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Old 05-23-2010, 06:19 AM
 
3,668 posts, read 482,916 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
God is commiting Genocide...
God is creating man in his own image ................. it is not finished yet.
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Old 05-23-2010, 06:22 AM
 
Location: US
26,537 posts, read 14,131,038 times
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Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Yes He did....so did Paul, Peter...John and so forth.
Although i agree with you on a lot of topics, you really should show scriptural backup to your statements...
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Old 05-23-2010, 06:48 AM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,796,150 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meerkat2 View Post
God is creating man in his own image ................. it is not finished yet.
He's just getting started!!!
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Old 05-23-2010, 06:50 AM
 
Location: US
26,537 posts, read 14,131,038 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
So what? The context is what? You have a very weak arguement there.
Is a disembodied soul and someone? Is a dead man without his body...a someone? You are imposing again this paradigm against the scriptures and the neccesity of faith for salvation...preserverance....living righteous....etc.....ytou guys will do anything won't you to discredit what is staring you right in the face! Shall I bring forward each and every verse again that declares man must profess their faith in Christ in order to be saved? Shall I...once again show your theology is false?

John 3:4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man (anthropos) be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

Here are some others to help you along:

Gal 4:6 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

Except a man (Any one that partakes of the human nature, and consequently of its corruptions) be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God, the kingdom of the Messiah begun in grace and perfected in glory. Except we be born from above, we cannot see this. That is, First, We cannot understand the nature of it. Such is the nature of things pertaining to the kingdom of God (in which Nicodemus desired to be instructed) that the soul must be re-modelled and moulded, the natural man must become a spiritual man, before he is capable of receiving and understanding them, 1 Co. 2:14.

Regeneration is absolutely necessary to our happiness here and hereafter. Considering what we are by nature, how corrupt and sinful,—what God is, in whom alone we can be happy,—and what heaven is, to which the perfection of our happiness is reserved, it will appear, in the nature of the thing, that we must be born again, because it is impossible that we should be happy if we be not holy.

1 Peter 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Isa 44:3 For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:

Not all seeds.
John 3:4 is a confirmation to Nicodemus' statement of recognizing Christ, He is saying that unless one is born from above is is impossible to recognize the Reign of God and He was confirming that Nicodemus must be in fact born from above in that he recognized that Christ was sent from God, because Nicodemus said that no one could do the things that He did unless God was with them...

Galatians 4:6 is merely a admonishon against faultering...this is why i am against individual verse usage...one can build a whole doctrine around it...one only needs to study a book in its entirety to understand the Authors whole message...and it merely says "tis - one" in the Greek of John 3:3 not 'anthropos - man'...However, the whole gist of Christ and the Apostles is that unless one is born from above (regenerated by the Spirit) one cannot comprehed the Reign of God...The Jews understood that everything comes from God, even birth (life) so Nicodemus was misunderstanding what Christ was speaking of...that is why he said 'can i enter into my mothers womb and be born a second time?'...Nicodemus knew that his physical birth was from God and couldn't understand that Christ was talking of a birth (regeneration) of the Spirit in order to comprehend the Reign of God...That is why Christ told him 'what is born of the flesh is flesh and what is born of the Spirit is spirit'...
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Old 05-23-2010, 06:58 AM
 
Location: US
26,537 posts, read 14,131,038 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
No wrath does.
A man does not accept God's offering and sacrifice, it's like socking Him in the nose.
One cannot accept God's gift unless God regenerates him through the Spirit...Scripture is clear that God shows mercy on some and others He hardens according to His plan and will...Exodus is a perfect example and Paul refers to it and quotes it in Romans to teach a point regarding God's Sovreignty...
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Old 05-23-2010, 07:00 AM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,796,150 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright Hope for Tomorrow View Post
BHFT: The main reason I say that is because that's how I was. I had relatives who died over the years that I was supposedly believing that, and I just figured they were "probably" ok. That's how everyone is that I know.

You must have misunderstood my point. I meant that I used to think they were "probably" ok and didn't worry about it. That is the opposite of looking for UR. I didn't really think of it as something I should be giving a lot of thought. I was not fully comprehending the horror of ET. When God revealed the truth of UR to me, it was after I somewhat began to comprehend the horror while thinking about total strangers (like we're supposed to do - love your neighbor as yourself). It had nothing to do with relatives when I cried out to God and asked Him why He would burn people forever, and asked Him why He didn't have a way to save them. He answered in my heart loud and clear, that He was going to do no such thing.

You are professing with your lips that you believe people are going to be set on fire forever (maybe they are even burning right at this minute), but yet you aren't urgently warning every single person you meet that doesn't believe in Jesus. (Please don't give me the comeback that you're doing that right now by telling people who believe God is willing and able to save all through the shed blood of Jesus.)

If you really believe most of the people around you are going to hell, you should get off your computer and go warn everyone you come into contact with. Oh yeah...the bible doesn't tell us to do that, does it? I wonder why. Do you think God doesn't want us to warn people because He wants to burn as many as possible? Or maybe He doesn't want us to be embarrassed and look foolish warning all those people. Is that it? Or maybe He just forgot to put that part in the bible.

If hell is a literal lake of fire and you have to accept Jesus for Him to have the power to save you, the bible should have a verse that says, "Go into all the world and warn them to accept me or burn forever." Instead, it's says to go into all the world and preach the good news - also called the good news of YOUR salvation. According to your beliefs, how can you tell someone of the good news of their own salvation before they accept Him? Also, you say you're a Calvinist so there's really no need to preach anything if He has already decided who He'll keep and who He'll throw away.

ETers either don't, in the depths of their hearts, believe in a literal lake of fire, are "brainwashed," or their hearts are so hardened that they don't care if anyone other than themselves and a few loved ones burn. That's the simple truth. Otherwise, they wouldn't have time for anything else in life other than to warn people because NOTHING ELSE WOULD MATTER!

As for me, I think when I believed in ET I was a little brainwashed. I'm not sure if that's the right word, but it is pretty much the same thing as when I believed in Santa Claus. I believed it because that is what I was told and I just accepted it on "faith" that I was being told the truth. Once I found out, I could think back and wonder how I could have believed that when it didn't make any sense. Just a side note: Anyone ever notice how the fable of Santa teaches that if you're good and believe in Santa you'll get good gifts, but if you're bad or don't believe you'll get nothing or a lump of coal? Funny how loving parents give good gifts to their child even if they had a lot of bad behavior that year, and keep giving gifts after they stop believing in Santa. I think that's called unconditional love.
This is something that I could have written. And you have a point about Santa Claus......those who are not good still receive good things. Maybe we can't really compare this to biblical things but we are made in God's image and I think the things we do reflect that image.

Great post BHFT!!!
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Old 05-23-2010, 07:01 AM
 
Location: On a road heaven bound !
10,290 posts, read 8,080,872 times
Reputation: 17784
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
God is commiting Genocide...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
John 3:4 is a confirmation to Nicodemus' statement of recognizing Christ, He is saying that unless one is born from above is is impossible to recognize the Reign of God and He was confirming that Nicodemus must be in fact born from above in that he recognized that Christ was sent from God, because Nicodemus said that no one could do the things that He did unless God was with them...

Galatians 4:6 is merely a admonishon against faultering...this is why i am against individual verse usage...one can build a whole doctrine around it...one only needs to study a book in its entirety to understand the Authors whole message...and it merely says "tis - one" in the Greek of John 3:3 not 'anthropos - man'...However, the whole gist of Christ and the Apostles is that unless one is born from above (regenerated by the Spirit) one cannot comprehed the Reign of God...The Jews understood that everything comes from God, even birth (life) so Nicodemus was misunderstanding what Christ was speaking of...that is why he said 'can i enter into my mothers womb and be born a second time?'...Nicodemus knew that his physical birth was from God and couldn't understand that Christ was talking of a birth (regeneration) of the Spirit in order to comprehend the Reign of God...That is why Christ told him 'what is born of the flesh is flesh and what is born of the Spirit is spirit'...
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Old 05-23-2010, 07:12 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,141,975 times
Reputation: 866
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
So now were going to blame non Universalism for abusive parents????

Incredible, and I mean that in the legal sense.

What's next? ET is the real cause of global warming or adult acne?

Gads!!!
The connection isn't nearly always as far-fetched as you think, unfortunately (although in this specific case I cannot say if it is accurate or not).

I've lived around ETers for years, I've seen how their doctrine of God's wrath toward man has become THEIR wrath towards man, too. If God hates sinners, then so do His followers. They say, "love the sinner, hate the sin," but their actions speak otherwise.

And I've seen people who believe in the Overcoming Power of Love, and the consequential love they show towards others who are different than themselves.

The fact is, is that if you believe in ET, then you also believe in a God who has failed to save the world. And a God who has failed will cause wrath in anybody's heart; and the consequences of that towards those around us is simply unavoidable.
I've seen it, maybe you haven't. My experience tells me otherwise.

And they are in a sense hypocrites because they say they follow a Man who died for sinners, but they themselves would do nothing of the kind, they are interested in their own well-being.

Blessings to you in spite of my rant!,
brian
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Old 05-23-2010, 07:28 AM
 
Location: US
26,537 posts, read 14,131,038 times
Reputation: 1618
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
No wrath does.
A man does not accept God's offering and sacrifice, it's like socking Him in the nose.
Exo 4:21 And the LORD said unto Moses, When thou goest to return into Egypt, see that thou do all those wonders before Pharaoh, which I have put in thine hand: but I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go.
Exo 4:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:
Exo 4:23 And I say unto thee, Let my son go, that he may serve me: and if thou refuse to let him go, behold, I will slay thy son, even thy firstborn.


Rom 9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
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Old 05-23-2010, 07:34 AM
 
Location: SC Foothills
8,830 posts, read 9,796,150 times
Reputation: 58199
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahigherway View Post
The connection isn't nearly always as far-fetched as you think, unfortunately (although in this specific case I cannot say if it is accurate or not).

I've lived around ETers for years, I've seen how their doctrine of God's wrath toward man has become THEIR wrath towards man, too. If God hates sinners, then so do His followers. They say, "love the sinner, hate the sin," but their actions speak otherwise.

And I've seen people who believe in the Overcoming Power of Love, and the consequential love they show towards others who are different than themselves.

The fact is, is that if you believe in ET, then you also believe in a God who has failed to save the world. And a God who has failed will cause wrath in anybody's heart; and the consequences of that towards those around us is simply unavoidable.
I've seen it, maybe you haven't. My experience tells me otherwise.

And they are in a sense hypocrites because they say they follow a Man who died for sinners, but they themselves would do nothing of the kind, they are interested in their own well-being.

Blessings to you in spite of my rant!,
brian
Amen Ahigherway!!! I've experienced first hand through a parent and ET and the threat of it came with rants and fists.....ETers are NOT full of love, they are full of condemnation and self-righteousness. I can say that because I was one. I know how I felt and the anger that was inside of me showed in the way I treated other people. It's a horrid, disgusting belief that I pray is slowly but surely on it's way out.
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