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Old 05-24-2010, 10:58 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,294,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enow View Post
Most will disagree but then again, it is by His grace that any does hear.

Deceptions is within the churches: not within a nation. Granted, there are deceptions in the nation: but it is that personal reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ that is being violated and why judgment will fall on the House of God first.
Enow,

A while back, prior to Preterism, I realized that the ID of the woman/Babylon had everything to do with the church, as I landed on several key verses that not only identified the woman/Babylon as Israel, it was even more telling because Israel was in charge of the dispensation of God. You are correct it is the church, just the timing of when the church was around, and that church, was in fact, the Jewish Apostate church.
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Old 05-25-2010, 01:10 AM
 
Location: Florida
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I believe Babylon is the corrupt religious/political system that has always ruled the world. It changes kings and priests intermittently, but it is like the harlot(religion) riding the beast (political power). The system enslaves everyone who comes into the world. I think Babylon could be described as the anti-Kingdom of God - the kingdom the sets itself up against God's spiritual kingdom. Also, Babylon is something that is enmeshed in the hearts and minds of men and women. There is a saying: "We can take the man out of Babylon, but only God can take the Babylon out of man."

Those are my general thoughts about what Babylon is.

Heartsong
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Old 05-25-2010, 01:19 AM
 
Location: Florida
5,965 posts, read 5,581,108 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Folks, being in the New Heavens and Earth has nothing to do with the absence of bad tidings in the world.....The New Heavens and Earth only means, that the order, the government UNDER CHRIST is now in effect, as opposed to the Old Heavens and Earth, which was under the Law of sin and death.

And BTW, Preterism is rapidly growing in Africa. I have friends there that are local pastors, born, bred and raised in Africa, and they preach fulfilled eschatology, with great results.
This thread has become about Preterism? BTW, Preterism makes no sense at all to me. But whether or not people believe it or not has no bearing on their salvation. The same goes for a lot of things that Christians do not see eye to eye on - it doesn't matter. But I thought we were discussing who/what is Babylon in this thread.

Heartsong
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Old 05-25-2010, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Italy
6,387 posts, read 5,118,767 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Sciotamicks believes only apostate Israel is Babylon. I say he has half the equation. Babylon encompasses ALL religion; Catholic, Protestant, and otherwise. The "*****" is in league with the "beast"; Religion and politics.

They have ALWAYS gone hand in hand.

REMEMBER Babylon, it's beliefs and symbols, and then brush up on your history. What was our country founded on? And what are it's symbols? Start looking with your SPIRITUAL eyes around the world.

What say you all?

And, call me crazy if you like, but check out this site;

The Vigilant Citizen

My parents taught me well. Strangely, but well.
I think Babylon is symbolic for the flesh and pride of man, exalting itself against anything that is called God. He sits on the throne of God (the heart of man) believing that he IS God. He is the antichrist, devil, son of iniquity. He will be dethroned when God takes him out of the way. When God takes the son of iniquity away, this is the rapture of the saints.
My 2c for now!

blessings,
brian
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Old 05-25-2010, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Wa
5,302 posts, read 5,294,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
This thread has become about Preterism? BTW, Preterism makes no sense at all to me. But whether or not people believe it or not has no bearing on their salvation. The same goes for a lot of things that Christians do not see eye to eye on - it doesn't matter. But I thought we were discussing who/what is Babylon in this thread.

Heartsong
Read the OP and follow the discussion.
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Old 05-25-2010, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,387,196 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sciotamicks View Post
Enow,

A while back, prior to Preterism, I realized that the ID of the woman/Babylon had everything to do with the church, as I landed on several key verses that not only identified the woman/Babylon as Israel, it was even more telling because Israel was in charge of the dispensation of God. You are correct it is the church, just the timing of when the church was around, and that church, was in fact, the Jewish Apostate church.
(I'm sure I will offend some here, and I'm sorry, but when you start seeing things with your spiritual eyes, it is hard to keep quiet. And I am a little frustrated (no, VERY) that those who call themselves Christian continue on in their blind ways and call those of us that believe ALL will be restored devil worshipers, basically, and do not see the BEAM in their OWN eyes)

Anyhow, here is my rant.



Babylon is an END-TIME SPIRIT! We are in the rabbit hole!

You must understand this before I can help you see how the puzzle pieces fit together.

America and it's churches are a HUGE part of this system, whether anybody wants to recognize this or not.

Jeremiah 7:18: The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes TO THE QUEEN OF HEAVEN!

Lawlessness: The American way of life is exported around the world!

The Statue of Liberty speaks of defiance to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The Statue of Liberty is DEFINITELY the Queen of Heaven, with it's 7 spikes in her CROWN!

The United States and so many others around the world build their systems with USURY, which God HATED, and DEPEND on others (the low-life masses) to build up debt so that they are in bondage to the SYSTEM their WHOLE LIVES!

They are building a system in DEFIANCE to God and HIS WAYS! None of these systems are EVER going to work, and if you want to sing patriotic songs and fly your flags, in whatever country you are a part of, you are in a place of LAWLESSNESS in your spirit.

IT does not matter whether you have Jesus on your lips. What matters is what system you honor outwardly.

God WILL NOT BE MOCKED!

The world and it's Babylonian system will come crashing down. RELIGIONS around the world are tied to it, whether they are MUSLIM, "CHRISTIAN," or JEWISH!

The symbols that are placed ALL OVER THE WORLD testify to the spirit that is running it, and it is being run under an ANCIENT SYSTEM.

This system has taken over the world and is becoming more satanic as we speak. You can not POSSIBLY watch the movies and listen to the music out there without realizing it if your SPIRITUAL eyes are open!

WHY are our cars COVERED in old pagan symbols??? Why are our shoes, and vehicles, and corporations COVERED in ancient symbols with pagan names attached to them???

WHAT SYSTEM HAS ARISEN FROM THE ASHES????

And HOW do the RELIGIONS around the world keep it running?

The paganism in our churches is ALIVE AND WELL! And the god that christianity WARships to keep it's system running is ALIVE AND WELL!

God's kingdom is NOT A PART OF THIS WORLD! Then would my people fight!

WAR, USURY (interest charged), and pagan darkness is what has infiltrated ALL societies, but the fact that AMERICA calls itself CHRISTIAN (follower of Yeshua) and CONTINUES to blatantly defy ALL THAT GOD IS, and prints BIBLE VERSES ON IT'S WEAPONS and puts "IN GOD WE TRUST" on it's Babylonian money is UTTER BLASPHEMY and we WILL be punished in the judgment!

Pat Robertson said the the reason Haiti was crushed by an earthquake was because of some pact with the devil a few hundred years ago.

PAT ROBERTSON is tied to a MUCH more wicked system than Haiti will EVER be tied to!

THE DELUSION HAS COVERED THE WORLD!

The religious system that is in place here in America is completely BLIND!

ALL IS GOING ACCORDING TO PLAN!

(Europe has the Woman Riding the Beast on some of it's money, and the European Union Strasbourg Parliament building is basically the Tower of Babel; not hard to see)

ALL SYSTEMS ARE CORRUPT!
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Old 05-25-2010, 04:14 PM
 
17,752 posts, read 15,069,778 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herefornow View Post
Jews, Catholics, Muslims, and Protestants.

You are a preterist, and you will NEVER see what I am saying with those glasses on. I believe that parts of Revelation have been fulfilled, parts of it not.

Don't put everything into a neat little box. Things are MUCH more complicated than you realize.

And, I have asked you many questions in the past, which you never answered. If you want to start on this thread, that's fine by me. I'm very interested to see how you wiggle your way out of them.
Hi herefornow,

No, he is a Gospel reader. You complicate things much more than you realize.

Matthew 23
31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets.

...
37 “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her!

Luke 16
16“The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it. 17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one tittle of the law to fail.
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Old 05-25-2010, 04:31 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,387,196 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
Hi herefornow,

No, he is a Gospel reader. You complicate things much more than you realize.

Matthew 23
31 “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets.

...
37 “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her!

Luke 16
16“The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the kingdom of God has been preached, and everyone is pressing into it. 17 And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one tittle of the law to fail.
I am a gospel reader myself! And there is a SYSTEM in place that is USING the w*o*e....yep, there is. You can bet your last DOLLAR on that.....

The RELIGIOUS of this age are BLIND and becoming blinder as we speak.

Did you read my above post? Who (or, rather, what) is Babylon???

Of course Jerusalem killed their prophets and then killed their Messiah.

BUT!

What has happened around the world??? What SYSTEM took over as soon as the GOOD NEWS left the gate? And WHO and WHAT is propping this system up?

NOTHING HAS CHANGED!

There is nothing new under the sun, and EVERYBODY on this planet is still in darkness. That is a fact, and it is MUCH worse than it has ever been.

Please, I beg of you, tell my WHY you are saying God has changed when He says HE DOES NOT change!

The FACTS are that GOD HATED the way the Jews were treating the poor and the outsiders!!! HATED!!!! With a vengeance!!!!

Don't EVER forget that.

Sciotamicks is a preterist. That is a dangerous place to be. He and those that think along those lines WILL NOT SEE!

They will not. That is a simple fact.

The people that are deceiving and BEING DECEIVED are waxing worse and worse.

Don't sit there and think that God is as happy as a clam with what is going on down here.

TRUST me, HE'S NOT! And HE WILL NOT BE MOCKED!

Everyone can skip around and believe that everything is Kosher, la la la la, but it will end. The birds will still be chirping, the people will still be partying, the merchants will still be selling.

As in the days of Noah.........

Last edited by herefornow; 05-25-2010 at 05:12 PM..
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Old 05-25-2010, 04:35 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
3,381 posts, read 3,387,196 times
Reputation: 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong View Post
I believe Babylon is the corrupt religious/political system that has always ruled the world. It changes kings and priests intermittently, but it is like the harlot(religion) riding the beast (political power). The system enslaves everyone who comes into the world. I think Babylon could be described as the anti-Kingdom of God - the kingdom the sets itself up against God's spiritual kingdom. Also, Babylon is something that is enmeshed in the hearts and minds of men and women. There is a saying: "We can take the man out of Babylon, but only God can take the Babylon out of man."

Those are my general thoughts about what Babylon is.

Heartsong
Thank you for that post, Heartsong.

A little simpler to read than what I wrote.
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Old 05-25-2010, 04:59 PM
 
7,880 posts, read 6,691,569 times
Reputation: 1374
The Harlot of babylon is an authority over greed, covetness, in the world market places through out the whole world of seven continants is the seven hills this spirit is a fallen angel who rides the seven headed ten horned beast of liberalism,,,, many say it is the church or Rome but that is small thinking where the blood of the saints is lost.....Is the church killing the Saints? No but the liberal spirit would if the dominion to do that came, like the day of nazi germany who killed the Saints. Why? because it could. the authority to kill came from within the spirit of this world..... The city has fallen and gold and silver will be worthless in those days and the harlot of babylon will be lost with the false prophet. Jesus promises to get rid of these spirits in those days and as long as people are deceived by false teaching and the false prophet, the harlot of Babylon will be in the earth messing up the economies of the nations of the earth....
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