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Old 07-18-2015, 02:07 PM
 
4,053 posts, read 1,452,829 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
You are misunderstanding what Jesus said. The self he is talking about is not Our true identity, but the self part of us that holds onto all the wrong beliefs and thinking about God and Our true self, his thoughts and his ways, that causes us to miss the mark.

Until our thoughts become his thoughts our ways will never be his ways.

Yes in away, but as well--We must disown ourselves and live to do Gods will-Matt 7:21--only those who do this will enter Gods kingdom.
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Old 07-18-2015, 04:59 PM
 
16,064 posts, read 9,234,697 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
The prize = life everlasting--anyone with sense desires this. Not just for self but for as many as possible. That is why going door to door with the good news of Gods kingdom is the most important work ever on this earth.
It is either God, His word, The Word His Son and the Spirit, never one, two or three only. Satan wants people to reject the written word in favor of their own feelings.

KJV Ephesians 2:2 (1 )Wherein in time past ye walked (2 )according to the course of this world, (3), according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now (4 )worketh in the (5 )children of disobedience:

KJV 2 Thessalonians 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

Those with God's spirit do as Jesus and all the writers of the NT did, they quote and reference ... scripture.

Makes it easy to see.
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Old 07-18-2015, 06:31 PM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,554 posts, read 22,715,248 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Yes in away, but as well--We must disown ourselves and live to do Gods will-Matt 7:21--only those who do this will enter Gods kingdom.
But if you do the works you do with the express idea of a reward in heaven, how can you say you have "disowned yourself" if the only reason you do works is because you are focused on the reward?
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Old 07-18-2015, 07:54 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
2,202 posts, read 1,319,282 times
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That's why we call them a religion a combination of biblical fact and a lot of manmade hooey with a good sell. Religious are partial victims in partial faiths it's sad, odd and preachers will be accountable!
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Old 07-19-2015, 01:51 AM
 
Location: California USA
849 posts, read 570,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
But if you do the works you do with the express idea of a reward in heaven, how can you say you have "disowned yourself" if the only reason you do works is because you are focused on the reward?
Just a slight clarification. JWs believe some go to heaven but an undetermined number of people from various walks of life will be resurrected to life on earth. Either way its good news for people- the prospect of everlasting life on earth... an earth just as God intended from the beginning.

So you think that God expects Christians to serve him without any hope and is it selfish to have everlasting life in view?
What was the apostle Paul's viewpoint in addressing fellow believers?
“God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name.” -Hebrews 6:10
"He becomes the rewarder of those earnestly seeking him." -Hebrews 11:6
Who was it that put in us the desire to have everlasting life (the "reward")? Was it not God himself who held out that prospect for Adam and Eve to have everlasting life as long as they accepted God's sovereignty?-Genesis 2:15-17

I suppose one could then ask is the reward a bribe? No, it's actually done out of love-2 Thessalonians 2:16,17

However you do pose a good point. Do we have the proper motive in serving God because even Jesus identified some who had purely selfish motives. John 6:26. Really, our motive then for serving God should be out of love because God showed his love for us first in giving us the prospect of everlasting life. I suppose that's why we have Jesus reminding us about the greatest commandment-You must love God with your whole heart, mind, and soul.
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Old 07-19-2015, 04:14 AM
 
Location: california
5,481 posts, read 4,554,733 times
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Remove all your church manufactured books, and what have you ?
Men circumventing God's design.
Joining a church does not make one born again, or filled with the Spirit.
Repentance is the turning from self govern to God's govern . and not Gods govern through some one else either, but through the Holy Spirit, Jesus provided in this relationship, as one endeavors to obey His Lordship, in the things Jesus taught and a receptive prayer life.
Jesus said ,My sheep know my voice.
Scriptures and preprogramed teachings aside , Do you know His voice ?
Does God lead you ,or is it the books of men's reasoning, that do your leading ?
The aggression Jesus speaks of is that hungering and thirsting after righteousness, from God's perspective one on one. Not academics.
Genesis 3; Academics replaced the relationship, that was the sin then and now.
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Old 07-19-2015, 04:57 AM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,554 posts, read 22,715,248 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hd4me View Post
Just a slight clarification. JWs believe some go to heaven but an undetermined number of people from various walks of life will be resurrected to life on earth. Either way its good news for people- the prospect of everlasting life on earth... an earth just as God intended from the beginning.

1). So you think that God expects Christians to serve him without any hope and is it selfish to have everlasting life in view?

2) What was the apostle Paul's viewpoint in addressing fellow believers?

“God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name.” -Hebrews 6:10
"He becomes the rewarder of those earnestly seeking him." -Hebrews 11:6
Who was it that put in us the desire to have everlasting life (the "reward")? Was it not God himself who held out that prospect for Adam and Eve to have everlasting life as long as they accepted God's sovereignty?-Genesis 2:15-17

I suppose one could then ask is the reward a bribe? No, it's actually done out of love-2 Thessalonians 2:16,17

However you do pose a good point. Do we have the proper motive in serving God because even Jesus identified some who had purely selfish motives. John 6:26. Really, our motive then for serving God should be out of love because God showed his love for us first in giving us the prospect of everlasting life. I suppose that's why we have Jesus reminding us about the greatest commandment-You must love God with your whole heart, mind, and soul.
1.) It is self-centered and extremely self-righteous to think--HEY, I AM GOING TO GIVE THIS PERSON FOOD BECAUSE GOD WILL GIVE ME A REWARD FOR DOING SO.===does that mean the MORE we do, the better reward? And why can't someone now be part of the 144,000? Who said it was a closed group and no longer accepting members?

2) I do not accept anything written by Paul as gospel or authoritative so you have me there.

When we ask for a reward we are saying that what we did, we really did not want to do OR what we did wasn't worth our time, BUT at least we get a reward out of the ordeal.. REALLY?
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Old 07-19-2015, 01:58 PM
 
4,053 posts, read 1,452,829 times
Reputation: 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
But if you do the works you do with the express idea of a reward in heaven, how can you say you have "disowned yourself" if the only reason you do works is because you are focused on the reward?

Focused on the reward for as many as possible, not just for self.
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Old 07-19-2015, 03:48 PM
 
37,494 posts, read 25,224,572 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zthatzmanz28 View Post
But if you do the works you do with the express idea of a reward in heaven, how can you say you have "disowned yourself" if the only reason you do works is because you are focused on the reward?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Focused on the reward for as many as possible, not just for self.
Reward/punish motivation is the lowest order of motivation possible. It reflects a relatively undeveloped Spirit. Emulation is a higher order of motivation, but internalized values irrespective of reward or punishment (as unambiguously displayed by Christ) is the highest order.
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Old 07-20-2015, 06:05 AM
 
Location: GOVERNMENT of TRAITORS & NAZIS
20,554 posts, read 22,715,248 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjw47 View Post
Focused on the reward for as many as possible, not just for self.
This is so altruistic...now I understand.

Thanks for sharing
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