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Old 07-12-2013, 07:30 PM
 
19,952 posts, read 13,078,264 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer View Post
The Bible also said He will have all men to be saved, and come to the knowledge of the truth (1 Tim 2:4), so what now?

Even if you use a translation that says He "wants" all men to be saved, that same translation will say that God gets what He wants...

That's why the debate continues...
No. It really doesn't, but we can debate universalism on one of the many universalism threads.
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Old 07-12-2013, 07:36 PM
 
Location: In a state of Grace
796 posts, read 673,404 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
No. It really doesn't, but we can debate universalism on one of the many universalism threads.
It appears that we have someone with many user names trying to make it look like a lot of people are attacking Gods truth on here.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:21 AM
 
Location: RV Park
7,544 posts, read 11,603,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio View Post
No. It really doesn't, but we can debate universalism on one of the many universalism threads.
It's a waste of time for all involved - I'm much more engaged in the doing away with law-based preaching and setting people free by the grace of God. I believe that's our charge, having been given the ministry of reconciliation.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:36 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,134,460 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer View Post
It's a waste of time for all involved - I'm much more engaged in the doing away with law-based preaching and setting people free by the grace of God. I believe that's our charge, having been given the ministry of reconciliation.
True.

Law based preaching disguised as unmeited favor >>>>>>>Grace is unmerited favor given only to those who merit it with faith and obedience.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:03 AM
 
Location: arizona ... most of the time
11,825 posts, read 9,867,712 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little elmer View Post
It's a waste of time for all involved - I'm much more engaged in the doing away with law-based preaching and setting people free by the grace of God. I believe that's our charge, having been given the ministry of reconciliation.
It's a waste of time for all involved .... how so?

What that means is that it was a waste of time for Jesus to fulfill the whole law... and the Law was written by God.

If the preacher was a faithful student of the written Word, he'd then would realize that the law is used to point to Christ. Without the law, one points to any number of false christs because one will not know what you're being graced from.

A correct preacher will be a student of the written word which shows the correct relationship of Law and Gospel.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:25 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,134,460 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
It's a waste of time for all involved .... how so?

What that means is that it was a waste of time for Jesus to fulfill the whole law... and the Law was written by God.

If the preacher was a faithful student of the written Word, he'd then would realize that the law is used to point to Christ. Without the law, one points to any number of false christs because one will not know what you're being graced from.

A correct preacher will be a student of the written word which shows the correct relationship of Law and Gospel.
Actually focus on the law points us to us missing the mark. Jesus Christ( the grace of God) takes the focus of ourselves on to him and who we really are,which quickens faith within us, which causes us to live how God intended us to........abundant Life.

The just live by faith.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:35 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
15,639 posts, read 7,101,893 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
It's a waste of time for all involved .... how so?

What that means is that it was a waste of time for Jesus to fulfill the whole law... and the Law was written by God.

If the preacher was a faithful student of the written Word, he'd then would realize that the law is used to point to Christ. Without the law, one points to any number of false christs because one will not know what you're being graced from.

A correct preacher will be a student of the written word which shows the correct relationship of Law and Gospel.
Excellent post! So why do so many of them try to put us back under Law by saying "God said it, I believe it" about matters of conscience?
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
15,639 posts, read 7,101,893 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Actually focus on the law points us to us missing the mark. Jesus Christ( the grace of God) takes the focus of ourselves on to him and who we really are,which quickens faith within us, which causes us to live how God intended us to........abundant Life.

The just live by faith.
That's the point of the Law being a schoolmaster to Christ...... the focus is on the NOT Law.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:39 AM
 
Location: RV Park
7,544 posts, read 11,603,493 times
Reputation: 4470
Quote:
Originally Posted by twin.spin View Post
It's a waste of time for all involved .... how so?

What that means is that it was a waste of time for Jesus to fulfill the whole law... and the Law was written by God.

If the preacher was a faithful student of the written Word, he'd then would realize that the law is used to point to Christ. Without the law, one points to any number of false christs because one will not know what you're being graced from.

A correct preacher will be a student of the written word which shows the correct relationship of Law and Gospel.
True, but God only gave the law after the children of Israel boasted that they would hold their end of the bargain. (Exod 19) Before then, God had been the source of deliverance from Egypt, treasure from Egypt, food, water, victory over the enemy, healing all their diseases, etc...all they would ever need. When they boasted, He turned on them with hardship and death at every turn.

You're right of course, the law drives us to Christ - and that's the purpose God had in mind when He gave it. But the most damaging thing in the life of a believer is to eat of that tree - it's the knowledge of good and evil to us, and it keeps our eyes on ourselves and our failures instead of His finished work.

The tree of life to us is the gospel - the good news of the new covenant of grace. We say we believe in Jesus, but do we really trust Him for our salvation? Why then do we want the 10 commandments hung in every school and courthouse in the land - does the law make anyone righteous?

Last edited by little elmer; 07-13-2013 at 09:53 AM..
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:56 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,410 posts, read 20,134,460 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
That's the point of the Law being a schoolmaster to Christ...... the focus is on the NOT Law.
My point is the law did not point us to Christ, it pointed to us missing the mark. The law which scripture says is glorious and spiritual brought condemnation due to us missing the mark. I also do not believe you need the law to come to faith in Christ.
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