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Old 06-01-2010, 06:54 AM
 
Location: East Coast
30,182 posts, read 19,976,834 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firstborn888 View Post
Not to mention that you don't have to be a trinitarian to understand that Jesus is the express image of the Father.
The funny thing is if you said "Jesus is the express image of the Father is an easy wasy of explaining the trinity" , all the trinitarians would be in agreement with you , why ? because you mentioned 2 parts of the christian trinity, the fact of the matter is many of the orthodox christian foot soldiers will blindly follow anything that uses the words eternal torment, trinity,judgement,condemnation, wrath and all the other stuff that orthodoxy is focused on .

An angry Universalist
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Old 06-01-2010, 08:22 AM
 
17,968 posts, read 12,432,516 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by firstborn888
Not to mention that you don't have to be a trinitarian to understand that Jesus is the express image of the Father.
An image of someone is not that someone. Allow me to explain.

When Jesus held a coin and asked His interrogators, "Whose image is this" and they said "Caesars" they did not think the image was literally Caesar but was a representation of what He looked like and what He represented as a ruler of the empire.

Thus also, Christ, being the image of the invisible God:

2Co 4:4 in whom the god of this eon blinds the apprehensions of the
unbelieving so that the illumination of the evangel of the glory of Christ,
Who is the Image of the invisible God, does not irradiate them."

is not THAT invisible God but is a representative of God.
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Old 06-01-2010, 08:23 AM
 
Location: southern california
55,237 posts, read 72,427,088 times
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then SBU has changed, that was not the requirement for salvation 45 years ago.
billy graham never made that a requirement for salvation either.
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Old 06-01-2010, 01:51 PM
 
3,576 posts, read 453,717 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
then SBU has changed, that was not the requirement for salvation 45 years ago.
billy graham never made that a requirement for salvation either.
It seems to me that the trinity was part of the tenents/doctrines/creeds of the Roman Catholic Church -- it is what they put in place to bind the people to them and unify them -- if you did not believe what they said you were a heretic and not "saved" The pope is the judge and jury for "that system" the protestant chuches have tried to brake away from that control, but still try and exert their control over the people with statements like "If you do not believe that Jesus Christ is God, you are not saved" and "If you do not believe like we do you are not part of 'the church' " to me it seems that they say that they are following the Holy Spirit and so everything they believe is true, and denying that the Holy Spirit is working in anyone else unless it is something they believe that they think does not relate to salvation and then it is fine to have different truths
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Old 06-01-2010, 02:13 PM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,683,225 times
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Jesus did not make clear this distinction when this poor feller got all excited.


Lk 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none [is] good, save one, [that is], God.
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Old 06-01-2010, 02:23 PM
 
Location: RV Park
7,543 posts, read 11,554,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
Jesus did not make clear this distinction when this poor feller got all excited.


Lk 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none [is] good, save one, [that is], God.
I believe that was because Jesus had yet to go the Cross - on the premise that the flesh is the problem. We see His "taking up of the cross" as our pattern; so long as the nature of the flesh is there, carnality will mix with His nature, making us impure.
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Old 06-01-2010, 02:43 PM
 
5,925 posts, read 5,683,225 times
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Originally Posted by little elmer View Post
I believe that was because Jesus had yet to go the Cross - on the premise that the flesh is the problem. We see His "taking up of the cross" as our pattern; so long as the nature of the flesh is there, carnality will mix with His nature, making us impure.

The premise as I see it is Jesus own statements.

If flesh is a problem, then Jesus had a problem.

Jesus tells us that the Father is greater than him, yet he says he does not see a problem with seeing him as equal to God.

The wording tells us that being one with the father is not the same as being the father.
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Old 06-01-2010, 02:48 PM
 
Location: RV Park
7,543 posts, read 11,554,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phazelwood View Post
If flesh is a problem, then Jesus had a problem.
It's a sensitive issue, and a bit off topic - but we see that Jesus Himself "learned obedience through the things He suffered" and prayed "not My will, but Yours".

A High Priest well acquainted with our sufferings.
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