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Old 12-01-2010, 06:02 AM
 
2,886 posts, read 4,951,122 times
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Wow, for once a lot of us regulars are pretty much in agreement. Northside and Oakley get my top votes, too. To the OP, Northside is a more artsy/gritty/urban pioneer type of neighborhood (also the center of the Cincinnati area's gay community) with some pretty nice amenities starting to develop. Oakley is more geared a bit more toward, um, conventionality if that's the right word.
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Old 12-01-2010, 06:09 AM
 
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I was being polite in not ranting against Northside. Please don't take that as agreement. I would not have Northside on the list other than the list of the most dangerous places in Cincinnati.
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Old 12-01-2010, 06:28 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilson1010 View Post
I was being polite in not ranting against Northside. Please don't take that as agreement. I would not have Northside on the list other than the list of the most dangerous places in Cincinnati.
I don't really know about the crime statistics, and I guess whether a given neighborhood would make a "most dangerous places" list would depend on the length of the list. At any rate, I did qualify my comment by saying "most" people seemed to be in agreement.

I'm in Northside fairly frequently. If I were the OP, there are certainly areas of Northside I'd want to avoid. Other parts have distinctly been gentrified and obviously the crime is not so severe as to prevent a continuous, steady influx of law-abiding, middle class people moving in. It's one of only a handful of neighborhoods that I've personally observed a noticeable improvement in in the 10 years since I moved back here.
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Old 12-01-2010, 07:53 AM
 
10,135 posts, read 27,356,547 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarah Perry View Post
I don't really know about the crime statistics, and I guess whether a given neighborhood would make a "most dangerous places" list would depend on the length of the list. At any rate, I did qualify my comment by saying "most" people seemed to be in agreement.

I'm in Northside fairly frequently. If I were the OP, there are certainly areas of Northside I'd want to avoid. Other parts have distinctly been gentrified and obviously the crime is not so severe as to prevent a continuous, steady influx of law-abiding, middle class people moving in. It's one of only a handful of neighborhoods that I've personally observed a noticeable improvement in in the 10 years since I moved back here.
I think Northside is interesting. It is home for an eclectic community which is difficult to find. In the late 60's I lived for a while is some pretty raw bootleg apartments in Mt. Adams which was nothing like it is today and had a great time. Of course it was the peace and love era and everything was pretty copasetic unless one stumbled into an anti-war protest.

Today, there is not such a gentle existence for the eccentrics in society. It seems they attract all manner of crime and substance abuse. Why that is I do not know. That is why I am excited about the artsy community in Oakley. Oakley has too much gravitas to permit the dealer on the corner, prostitute using the back of your car for a bathroom, thief in the window thing.

I'm going to go over there myself when I get a moment and report on Oakley. I have driven by, have friends raving about it, but have no first hand info.
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Old 12-01-2010, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
577 posts, read 1,272,568 times
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The difference between Northside and Oakley is that Northside is more of an up and coming area. You can find great bargains on houses over there if you don't mind putting some work into them where in Oakley the houses are more put together and not as much work may be required. But the price tags reflect that as well.

But, Northside has a great center to it. I would prefer to shop, eat, and drink in Northside over Oakley. Northside has a great music store - Shake It and one of my favorite bars - The Comet (great bands play there). Oakley has another one of my favorite bars - Habits and they also have the 20th Century (some great bands play there as well.

Sarah gave a great description of the differences between the two. Oakley is more of a young professional crowd where Northside is more of an earthy struggling artist type crowd.
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Old 12-01-2010, 06:49 PM
 
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I want to respond to Wilson's comment about "eccentrics" attracting crime and substance abuse.

My perception of Northside's crime problems, such as they are, is that by and large they have to do with the poor people who've been the long-time residents of the neighborhood, rather than to do with the newer people moving in. I'm not privy to the inside workings of the police department, but I think the recent efforts to clean up groups like the Taliband are PROBABLY a response to the presence of more middle-class families and homeowners in the area. Where residents essentially demand more, the city does more.

There was a discussion here a while ago about whether there's still money to be made on real estate in Northside. I hate to speculate, but I'd say that if you get on one of the streets where the momentum's in the right direction, you should at least do okay. Assuming you like a dense, urban neighborhood with historic housing stock.
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Old 12-02-2010, 12:32 AM
 
10,135 posts, read 27,356,547 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarah Perry View Post
I want to respond to Wilson's comment about "eccentrics" attracting crime and substance abuse.

My perception of Northside's crime problems, such as they are, is that by and large they have to do with the poor people who've been the long-time residents of the neighborhood, rather than to do with the newer people moving in. I'm not privy to the inside workings of the police department, but I think the recent efforts to clean up groups like the Taliband are PROBABLY a response to the presence of more middle-class families and homeowners in the area. Where residents essentially demand more, the city does more.

There was a discussion here a while ago about whether there's still money to be made on real estate in Northside. I hate to speculate, but I'd say that if you get on one of the streets where the momentum's in the right direction, you should at least do okay. Assuming you like a dense, urban neighborhood with historic housing stock.

I am not as outraged about this premise as I usually am and I don't know why. But, it is just as wrong as its always been. Look folks, this is real simple:

PEOPLE DO NOT COMMIT CRIMES BECAUSE THEY ARE POOR.
THEY ARE POOR BECAUSE THEY COMMIT CRIMES.

Let's start with the positive. There are tens of millions of people who are dirt poor, have been for decades, generations, multiple generations even. They would never, ever think of committing a crime. Especially a crime against neighbors, old people, store clerks. Especially crimes of violence. Its truly insulting to assume that because people are poor they will shoot you and take your money.

There are prosperous people who would drop you like a bag of dirt if they thought it would move them forward two inches.

It is not the fact that they are poor that makes them criminals.

Now the negative. There is no faster way to become poor than to commit a serious crime. People who commit crimes eventually get caught. Why? Because they continue to commit crimes, over and over and eventually the police stumble into them and off they go. Into the criminal justice system and then they are finished. No good job, lose everything, blah blah.

Or, they are substance addicted. If you are drunk or high a lot of the time it is hard to make any money. And, you get beat up, money taken, arrested, beat up again, drugs taken, blah blah. And regardless of where a person starts out on the socio-economic scale, a drug or serious alcohol habit will turn that person into a poor person.

As to the why of these people being attracted to Northside (which they are just as they are attracted to OTR) I said I didn't know. But a guess can be made that they blend in there. They don't stand out like a sore thumb and draw little attention. So when they get to OTR or Northside they stay because they are not out of their element.

But the fact is that poverty is not the problem, its bad morals and substance abuse that causes crime.
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Old 12-02-2010, 08:12 AM
 
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To repeat what I said, "My perception of Northside's crime problems, such as they are, is that by and large they have to do with the poor people who've been the long-time residents of the neighborhood..."

As is probably obvious to everyone else reading this thread, I said nothing about what causes the crime in Northside. I simply opined that the crime in the area is mostly CONNECTED TO the long-time residents, WHO ALSO HAPPEN TO BE POOR FOR WHATEVER REASON, rather than to the more affluent newcomers moving in.

Since you obviously want to take the thread off on a tangent, my own opinion about root causes of crime in the context we're discussing is that they're a lot more complex than bad morals and substance abuse. I'd say they're mostly to do with lack of education and economic opportunity, racial and class prejudice, and generations of government handouts that have given the recipients the message that they can't succeed at anything on their own.
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Old 12-02-2010, 08:24 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati, OH
279 posts, read 713,662 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deg1114 View Post
The difference between Northside and Oakley is that Northside is more of an up and coming area. You can find great bargains on houses over there if you don't mind putting some work into them where in Oakley the houses are more put together and not as much work may be required. But the price tags reflect that as well.

But, Northside has a great center to it. I would prefer to shop, eat, and drink in Northside over Oakley. Northside has a great music store - Shake It and one of my favorite bars - The Comet (great bands play there). Oakley has another one of my favorite bars - Habits and they also have the 20th Century (some great bands play there as well.

Sarah gave a great description of the differences between the two. Oakley is more of a young professional crowd where Northside is more of an earthy struggling artist type crowd.
Speaking of the 20th Century, went by last night to see it get lit up for the first time in 30 years. Sweet!
Attached Thumbnails
New Transplant, Where to Live?-20th.jpg  
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Old 12-02-2010, 08:28 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati near
2,628 posts, read 4,279,630 times
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In my opinion the biggest problem with Northside is that when the eccentric twenty-thirtysomething hipster types get married and choose a more traditional career, they pack up and move out of the neighborhood. I've lost track of the number of my close friends who were DAAP students, journalists, musicians, engineers, and social workers who turned 33 or so, got married, took a job with a bank or insurance company or something and went looking for a house in Mason or Blue Ash. In Oakley, by comparison, individuals are more likely to stay or at least settle in nearby Pleasant Ridge or Hyde Park. I just don't see Northside improving as a neighborhood without some serious gentrification like Prospect Hill or Mt. Adams, and I don't see the gentrification happening because of the area's geographical location.
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