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Old 02-08-2012, 10:14 AM
 
2,886 posts, read 3,949,834 times
Reputation: 1499

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy View Post
...I put taxes in the same category as property values. If your margin for error is so slim that your local tax bill affects your lifestyle to the extent that it is THE determining factor in choosing a place to live, it is probably a better idea to rethink your financial priorities. On the other hand, if you are choosing between two similar houses, the tax burden is definitely a convincing tiebreaker.
I agree with basically every word of your posting, although I'll add that I think it's a reasonable criterion when deciding where to live to factor in the level and quality of local government services you're getting, i.e., whether you feel like it's a good value for what you pay in taxes. In comparing what I'd probably pay--and get--in one of the smaller cities across the river, like Ft. Mitchell, I suspect I'd feel a lot better on that score than I do now.

Otherwise, I look at the tax bill in the context of my entire family budget. In terms of a future move, it's not going to be so much whether we CAN pay the bill, but whether we want to choose to allocate the money toward high property tax, or move someplace where it's lower and have those dollars available for something else.
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Old 02-08-2012, 10:32 AM
 
800 posts, read 696,249 times
Reputation: 552
As for the taxes nonsense, there is no way that the $1000~ more someone might pay each year to live in Cincinnati isn't offset if they are a regular Metro rider, and much more if they don't own a vehicle at all (or raise a family with 1 car instead of 2). To those of retirement age, think about what your finances would look like if you owned five fewer cars over the course of your life -- at least $100,000 and more like $200,000+. This before the value of that saved money if it was steadily invested for the past 30-40 years. So this reliance on cars is absolutely crushing the finances of the middle class.

Yet we see people of that age who have convinced themselves that their decision to live where 2 cars were required to raise a family was wise because the value of their home went up $70K~ over 20-30 years. Well now that gain is gone too. So they literally spent a decade or more of their working just to keep those tires turning.
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Old 02-08-2012, 11:08 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati near
2,507 posts, read 3,350,911 times
Reputation: 5606
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
As for the taxes nonsense, there is no way that the $1000~ more someone might pay each year to live in Cincinnati isn't offset if they are a regular Metro rider, and much more if they don't own a vehicle at all (or raise a family with 1 car instead of 2). To those of retirement age, think about what your finances would look like if you owned five fewer cars over the course of your life -- at least $100,000 and more like $200,000+. This before the value of that saved money if it was steadily invested for the past 30-40 years. So this reliance on cars is absolutely crushing the finances of the middle class.

Yet we see people of that age who have convinced themselves that their decision to live where 2 cars were required to raise a family was wise because the value of their home went up $70K~ over 20-30 years. Well now that gain is gone too. So they literally spent a decade or more of their working just to keep those tires turning.
I agree that people spend too much on cars, and laptops make bus rides a lot more practical for a busy person. Still, many if not most professional jobs require personal transportation. My best friend and his wife are lawyers, and they use their cars every day visiting clients. My wife works in pharmaceutical marketing, and puts in quite a few miles every day. I don't really need a car just to do my teaching job, but I do need a car to attend meetings with collaborators as well as most of my professional service. For all of us, a car isn't an option, it is a necessity, and we don't even have kids to cart around yet. My motorcycles, on the other hand, are really just a luxury, but one that is worth the expense for me.
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Old 02-08-2012, 12:19 PM
 
2,886 posts, read 3,949,834 times
Reputation: 1499
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
As for the taxes nonsense, there is no way that the $1000~ more someone might pay each year to live in Cincinnati isn't offset if they are a regular Metro rider, and much more if they don't own a vehicle at all (or raise a family with 1 car instead of 2). To those of retirement age, think about what your finances would look like if you owned five fewer cars over the course of your life -- at least $100,000 and more like $200,000+. This before the value of that saved money if it was steadily invested for the past 30-40 years. So this reliance on cars is absolutely crushing the finances of the middle class.

Yet we see people of that age who have convinced themselves that their decision to live where 2 cars were required to raise a family was wise because the value of their home went up $70K~ over 20-30 years. Well now that gain is gone too. So they literally spent a decade or more of their working just to keep those tires turning.
Not sure what about the tax comments made here is so nonsensical to you. Not only have I had two hip replacements and can't really do the hiking necessary to get to and from my local bus stop (especially toting a load of a week's worth of groceries) but the part-time work I do takes me all over the metro area at all kinds of weird hours. Seriously, does it seem practical to you for me to depend on a bus to get to, say, Milford at 7:30 a.m. on a Sunday when I live 25 miles away on the west side of town? Or how about getting to my doctor's office in Montgomery? Yeah, that's a mere 15 miles, but do you really expect me to spend basically a whole day getting there and back? Even if I were physically able to? I mean, there are a bunch of ways I might be able to make up that $1,000 in property tax if I wanted to for the privilege of living within the city limits, but I don't think getting rid of my car is one of them.

You seem like you may not have a very complete grasp of the variety of considerations real people deal with in deciding where and how to live.
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Old 02-08-2012, 01:36 PM
 
Location: Mason, OH
9,259 posts, read 13,358,349 times
Reputation: 1919
Quote:
Originally Posted by captaincatfish View Post
I have always liked your forthright style, even on the few occasions I haven't agreed with you...and hang the age difference---no one is so 'old' that they can't either teach or be taught

But I gotta say, with a big LOL and a smile, you made me laugh out loud when you said 'surrounded by whities'...KJ, you and your 'old' self could be my neighbor anytime
An extension of my original thought. Over the 10 years the street was extended to the south into a quite nice new subdivision. It took me awhile to recognize how many A-A families have bought into it, two of which are diagonally across the new extended street from the original family. To me this is a good thing, everyone going about their own business, raising their families, and enjoying what the town has to offer. I came to the realization recently that a number of these newer houses have gone through foreclosure. What is one person's loss is another's gain. A search on the county auditor's website indicated several of these houses have been bought for 60 cents on the dollar against what they originally sold for. I think that may be why I am suddenly realizing a higher percentage of A-A families, the property became much more affordable, if you call $400,000 to $240,000 affordable.

Last edited by kjbrill; 02-08-2012 at 01:39 PM.. Reason: add content
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:14 PM
 
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
9,583 posts, read 20,456,271 times
Reputation: 9077
Been doing some more research, looks like the property tax difference is not Ohio vs Kentucky but Hamilton County vs everywhere else. Every house I checked in Fairfield (Butler Co) pays a similar rate to NKY, about 1% a year.

So far seems like City Data's town profiles are pretty close on property taxes, which are given as a percent of the home's value per year.

Doing a lot of research (still 5 years from buying a home, but like to think ahead) I think Fairfield averaged 1.2% while most of H.C. pays 2%. Lebanon and most of NKY was 0.9%. This is also what my sister pays in Lexington KY.
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Old 02-11-2012, 12:40 PM
 
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
9,583 posts, read 20,456,271 times
Reputation: 9077
Ok, since the CD profile seems pretty close on property taxes I'll start posting some stats for towns in the Metro

Cincinnati (city limits)
[LEFT]Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,957 (1.4%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,768 (1.7%)[/LEFT]


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Cincin...#ixzz1m6QDLOXa

Norwood OH
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,561 (1.2%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,352 (1.3%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Norwoo...#ixzz1m6QjAy2D

Mariemont OH
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $4,578 (1.8%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $4,412 (1.6%)


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Mariem...#ixzz1m6QwP8WH

Deer Park OH

Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,193 (1.6%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $2,137 (1.7%)


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Deer-P...#ixzz1m6R73I7f

Blue Ash
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,845 (1.3%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $2,664 (1.4%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Blue-A...#ixzz1m6RKYnSb

Cheviot
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,472 (1.4%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,721 (1.6%)


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Chevio...#ixzz1m6RUjNZS

Finneytown

Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,803 (2.1%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $2,866 (1.9%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Finney...#ixzz1m6RfGXgc

Forest Park
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,013 (1.6%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,873 (1.8%)


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Forest...#ixzz1m6SYnHPk

Butler County

Fairfield
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,872 (1.2%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,719 (1.2%)


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Fairfi...#ixzz1m6SwCbhm

Hamilton
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,320 (1.2%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,234 (1.2%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Hamilt...#ixzz1m6T8Zpp2

Middletown
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,630 (1.5%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,575 (1.5%

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Middle...#ixzz1m6TUhOVm

Warren County
Mason
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $3,505 (1.5%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $2,628 (1.6%)


Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Mason-...#ixzz1m6Tq2SsM

Loveland

Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $3,089 (1.8%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,998 (1.5%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Lovela...#ixzz1m6U36Ec8

Lebanon
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,019 (1.1%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,677 (1.2%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Lebano...#ixzz1m6UC66fl

Clermont County
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,442 (1.1%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,622 (1.1%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Batavi...#ixzz1m6UOtotB

Kentucky

Florence
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,233 (0.9%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $989 (0.8%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Floren...#ixzz1m6UZJkbs

Burlington
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,409 (0.8%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,317 (0.8%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Burlin...#ixzz1m6Uk1ilq

Kenton County
Independence
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,776 (1.1%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,329 (0.9%

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Indepe...#ixzz1m6Uuusga

Fort Mitchell
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,165 (1.0%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $2,119 (1.2%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Fort-M...#ixzz1m6V86f2Y

Campbell county
Fort Thomas
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $2,406 (1.3%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,868 (1.1%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Fort-T...#ixzz1m6VJoEwF

Alexandria

Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,664 (1.0%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,133 (0.9%)

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Alexan...#ixzz1m6VWVYyN

Indiana - Dearborn County

Hidden Valley
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with mortgages in 2009: $1,957 (1.0%)
Median real estate property taxes paid for housing units with no mortgage in 2009: $1,758 (1.0%

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/city/Hidden...#ixzz1m6VkaIub
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