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Old 11-29-2011, 05:56 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
171 posts, read 295,312 times
Reputation: 116

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilson513 View Post
I enjoy 14th and Sycamore more each day. We got a new guy, a 70 year old couple who relocated from Wyoming (I speak the truth Jen) with a friendly dog and a good attitude. He and Lucy (the dog) were fascinated by the recent man hunt for the escapees from the Justice Center. The cops set up perimeters and signaled each other with beeps from their sirens to the delight of Lucy. Eventually the perps were apprehended and everything returned to a quiet evening. Makes me see it as more and more likely that I will renovate the 11 rooms (2700 square feet) in the two 1860's row houses' space above my office and downsize to OTR.
Not sure why I wouldn't believe you? I would love to live in OTR some day. Makes sense for an older couple from Wyoming to live down there. Remember, lots from Wyoming love architecture (I love my 100 yr old house) and love being close to things and are used to taxes. Plus, I've noticed a huge importance of giving back in this community. Much more than when I was in Lebanon or my other locations prior to OH. I would think it's a normal progression. Obviously, their kids are out of school, so they don't need to stay for the schools. A large yard is not a priority for many once they retire as well. And, since you always say that I live around ghettos, i guess there wouldn't be much adjustment to the lower economic areas surrounding it. Although even you pointed out that they were "fascinated" by the manhunt, so maybe you are starting to soften on the idea that Wyoming isn't as scary as you like to lead people to believe?? Could you even be coming around to this area since you met a nice couple from here??
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Old 11-29-2011, 08:47 PM
 
307 posts, read 441,338 times
Reputation: 98
I haven't seen the map of the census tract but in the article it mentioned it was the northern half of otr. I'm guessing it's the "view" properties on mulberry and maybe some other streets that make this inequality. Ive always considered Cincinnati bit of a pocket city due to the geography, streets, etc so I'm honestly not too surprised.
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Old 11-30-2011, 12:30 AM
 
405 posts, read 754,275 times
Reputation: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilson513 View Post
Yea, I know that. I have some crime scene tape in my office as a reminder of a murder a year and a half ago where the tape was tied to my iron fence.
Would be a pretty gutsy move, deserving of admiration, seems to me. Many years from being anywhere near as safe in OTR as it is in Mt Lookout/Hyde Park, I'd guess.

I wonder how it would compare to your experience in East walnut Hills.
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Old 11-30-2011, 02:58 AM
 
10,139 posts, read 22,440,335 times
Reputation: 8244
Quote:
Originally Posted by wolden View Post
Would be a pretty gutsy move, deserving of admiration, seems to me. Many years from being anywhere near as safe in OTR as it is in Mt Lookout/Hyde Park, I'd guess.

I wonder how it would compare to your experience in East walnut Hills.

I've been in OTR three times as long as EWH and had zero break ins compared with three in EWH. Also zero car damage.
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Old 11-30-2011, 06:45 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati
3,335 posts, read 5,733,381 times
Reputation: 2058
wilson, you are full of surprises. great thread!
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Old 11-30-2011, 07:47 AM
 
Location: Indianapolis and Cincinnati
682 posts, read 1,389,259 times
Reputation: 610
It is an interesting thread and one of the reasons I decided to post this is that in my own preservation blog I have watched the 'evolution' of neighborhood perceptions over the last three years in Cincinnati. Since I came from a city that went through this same "urban evolution" (Indianapolis), it is interesting to me to see how Cincinnati will cope with the changes that are coming.

I know whenever I post 'positive stories of turnaround' on my Preservation Blog. The reaction 3 years ago was "are you crazy or, those people are crazy", today it's more "Really, I didn't know about that" but people are not 'shocked' like they once were.

I still get what I call the "Liberal, poverty pusher, hate mail" in which 'gentrification' is Evil and must be stopped at all cost, but most often those people are the ones who run programs and seem to be more concerned about the loss of clients (funding) for their programs rather than real concern.

To me, neighborhoods have a 'right' to improve and change. The idea that a neighborhood 'must' remain poor, or rich, for that matter is ridiculous. Market forces, need and demand drive neighborhood changes. For example the Harlem of the 1970's is no more, once bombed out brownstones bring millions. I have also seen once middle class owner occupied 'suburbs' change into high crime,gang infested, mostly rental areas. Neighborhood change.

The OTR today is not the OTR we will see in 10 years, and I would venture to say, if history is any guide, that many of the so called "affluent" gentrying pioneers of today, will eventually be priced out of OTR, just as many who initially restored or built in Mt Adams have moved on.

It is not just OTR that is changing however, its happening in Price Hill , Fairmount, and Walnut Hills and other neighborhoods too. People are moving into urban neighborhood once again and it is beginning to look like we could well look like many other cities within a decade with affluent Urban neighborhood core surrounded by a ring of poverty of once working/middle class 1950,60's and 70's suburban tract neighborhoods that might bear a surprising resemblance to what many think of when they think of neighborhoods like OTR. Beyond that will be the "far burbs" filled by those who would never, under any circumstance, want or feel they need an urban experience. The only people without any choice will likely be the poor who simply will locate where ever they can afford and try to make the best of their situation. It will create transportation issues and such, but with an improved property tax base, there might be money to afford to actually do something rather than rely on a federal government handout.

However one thing is sure, a rebirth of urban communities will create job opportunities which ultimately could raise the living standards of anyone wanting to improve their situation.
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Old 11-30-2011, 10:08 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati near
2,509 posts, read 3,357,650 times
Reputation: 5611
Gentrification is fine in my book as long as it is natural and not driven by a subsidy to artificially distribute resources. I am very skeptical of actions taken to appease downtown investors.
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Old 11-30-2011, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati
3,335 posts, read 5,733,381 times
Reputation: 2058
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy View Post
Gentrification is fine in my book as long as it is natural and not driven by a subsidy to artificially distribute resources..
"Subsidy to artificially distribute resources" is the only way development happens anywhere in this country.
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Old 11-30-2011, 03:20 PM
 
Location: Indianapolis and Cincinnati
682 posts, read 1,389,259 times
Reputation: 610
Well at least a far as 3CDC is concerned They get tax credits and of course the normal tax abatements apply to anyone who restores a house in Cincinnati. Also the vast majority of properties they developed were already vacant and probably beyond the financial resources of the average person.

In my neighborhood its entirely individual driven, but then we are talking about a much smaller area. Clearly 'post riots', something had to be done in OTR as there was a danger of investments already made failing and loss of long term tax revenue.

There is an economic reality that 10,000 properties pay literally no taxes and drain resources. that same property restored with a value of say 200,000.00 does generate tax revenue, not only from increased property taxes but income and sales tax generated by the people living there who have disposable income, That creates jobs throughout the economy. It is that stronger economy that provides opportunity.

The only big problem as I see it is that the city still makes it too difficult to effectively restore with a lot in unnecessary red tape and a permit process that is a disaster compared to most cities. But then Cincinnati has been slow to the realization of historic restoration and preservation as an economic development tool.
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Old 11-30-2011, 04:49 PM
 
10,139 posts, read 22,440,335 times
Reputation: 8244
My little corner of the world is pretty much renovated except for my building with the eight little old ladies and my vehicle garage. And other than the TIF credit I am not aware of any public money in this area. I suppose when the Car Barn was done 20 years ago that may have been a loan guaranty by some government agency, but all the residential around here and the church next door were done by owners without subsidy. Now, if someone takes on the old SCPA School building I am sure there will be grants and loans and credits galore.
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