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Old 10-21-2012, 05:48 PM
 
1,556 posts, read 1,463,316 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neilworms2 View Post
flashes: Read a mix of sources - Huff Post NPR NYTimes for left - the Economist and Fox News for Right (though the Economist is pretty centrist-libertarian these days). You sometimes need to challenge your own assumptions.
I'm all for centrist ideas (especially environmental and personal freedom issues), and at the risk of taking it further down the political road, and I think I can safely speak for people of my ilk, that we will no longer accept mainstream media speaking as if they are unbiased. I would never trust any group/organization that votes 80-90% in one direction (and the mainstream media does). The trust has been broken, and we have written these people off, and will never return.
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Old 10-21-2012, 06:15 PM
 
Location: Boston, MA
7,871 posts, read 6,819,268 times
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Might be of interest, from today's Plain Dealer in the Travel section: Cincinnati's Over-the-Rhine neighborhood makes an amazing comeback (photo gallery) | cleveland.com
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Old 10-21-2012, 06:50 PM
 
3,974 posts, read 5,536,668 times
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Some of it is about economics, some of it is about the daily commute, some of it is about bucking the suburban trend, some of it is about kids going to college in an urban setting and enjoying the lifestyle, but most of it is about the complete dissolution of white-flight. The 20-40 crowd doesn't identify with it. We all went to college with a multi-racial student body. Those who were in FEAR of people who looked different than they did (mostly because of family influence) learned that there was nothing to be afraid of. So, what used to be a foregone conclusion that you would live in the suburbs has now become just another option.
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Old 10-21-2012, 07:08 PM
 
5,649 posts, read 8,758,092 times
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I can't say that I've read this entire thread but I am wondering a couple of things and perhaps someone has the answer. First, it is nice to know that some of our cities are actually starting to see a rebirth in the form of new residents moving into the urban core regardless of their age. But clearly younger people will play a vital role in helping to keep these cities going in the future. However, how may of these younger people are married couples and that either have a child or two or hope to have children? So many of the 20 somethings that I run into and talk to from time to time don't seem too inclined to want to start a family. I think most just want to play around and have a little fun in non comital personal relationships. While this may lead to a lot of activity in our neighborhoods it certainly does not help the long term growth of a region if children are not being born.

Second. There are plenty of inner ring suburban communities that are in a sense a part of the fabric of a metro city. Cincy obviously has a lot of these little suburban communities that feel and look just like many city neighborhoods. I would not be surprised to see some of these places spring to life just like some of the communities in northern KY have. Would this also not be considered to be beneficial to the region in addition to seeing growth within the city limits of Cincinnati?
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Old 10-21-2012, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
4,007 posts, read 4,829,904 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WILWRadio View Post
Second. There are plenty of inner ring suburban communities that are in a sense a part of the fabric of a metro city. Cincy obviously has a lot of these little suburban communities that feel and look just like many city neighborhoods. I would not be surprised to see some of these places spring to life just like some of the communities in northern KY have. Would this also not be considered to be beneficial to the region in addition to seeing growth within the city limits of Cincinnati?
There are at least two inner ring suburbs that you can't even notice you are no longer in Cincinnati, only to be in Cincinnati again a few miles down the street. Most of them are doing just fine. From my perspective, any community that is doing well is a benefit to the Cincinnati metro.
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Old 10-21-2012, 07:29 PM
 
864 posts, read 1,197,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrtechno View Post
And there are people who prefer suburbs to the cities.

And there are people who prefer rural areas to either one.

Isn't this a wonderful country that we can choose the area that best suits us?
Here we go again...

I have said this repeatedly in thread after thread. Since I GREW UP IN THE SUBURBS AND NOW PREFER THE CITY, I want both the suburbs and the city to do well. I respect peoples choice to live in the suburbs, but I expect the same in return.
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Old 10-21-2012, 08:03 PM
 
Location: A voice of truth, shouted down by fools.
1,086 posts, read 2,223,744 times
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I live outside Lebanon and I am pretty well invested in living in the suburbs - actually, the exurbs. But I've moved around a lot.

Much have I seen and much have I done.

For I am Lothar ...

...of the hill people.

No, really ... Here's how I see urban vs. rural living:

City life is inherently more interesting than most suburban living because of (generally): older, more stately, dramatic and authentic architecture, more variety of shopping and entertainment options, and greater diversity of the population. The compactness of cities leads to a pedestrian culture.

These are the big triggers, I believe. If I decided to move, say, to San Francisco on a whim, those would all be reasons for the move.

All of these factors are due to a combination of greater age of the general surroundings, and much higher population density.

Each of these elements also have a negative side to some individuals.

Density itself can be stressful, depending on the individual. I can relate to that. I find some density electrifying. Mainly when I'm in tourist mode, someplace like NYC, or even, Cincinnati. Then I get sick of it and want my suburban lot and open roads. I think studies have been done with rats crowded in cages and they find that such rats either develop cancers at a greater rate or start eating each other or get sick a lot more often. In any event it's not positive.

Greater age of the physical plant can lead to slum and tenement conditions when the buildings are poor quality, or, there is no money to keep things maintained and upgraded and the stuff deteriorates. This is the main reason urban renewal caught hold in the 1960s and the reason that inner city freeway construction was used as an instrument to bulldoze and level entire neighborhoods.

More variety of shopping options can be irrelevant or confusing, depending on the individual. (Maybe the person has no interest in fish taco trucks or vegetarian tapas.)

Greater diversity of the population leads not only to more social opportunities, but also, more opportunities for contact with people that are so unlike yourself in extremely negative ways that encounters with them are outright dangerous. Criminals, gangs, and violence.

Greater density can be much harder and much more stressful to negotiate driving wise.

Which you like depends on where you are at in life.

Now, Kjbrill has stated in other threads that he and his wife use mobility equipment to get around, and I can envision that he enjoys being able to go to restaurants that have wheelchair ramps, accessibility, and large parking lots. The city truly can be a pain or even dangerous for someone not in top physical shape to negotiate. Even something like sprinting across a street at a sidewalk.

I think Kjbrill sees the multiple inconveniences of city life for him and writes them off as indicators that suburbs are always superior to the city.

Kjbrill, for a young person, I can tell you from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE as a suburbanite that most Cincinnati suburbs are living death for the young and single. They move into in-city neighborhoods primarily so that they can socialize.

When I lived in Landen years ago, I drove downtown to the bars on Pete Rose Way every freaking weekend. Because Landen and places like it are, socially speaking, scorched earth for a person if they aren't married and don't have a complement of slimy brats and a mini-van.

Between the two, which I would prefer depends on things like how I plan to get around and how much I value personal space vs. opportunities for socialization. When you're married, you want some space for projects and you are more socially self-contained. So the suburbs are more suitable for people in that position. Add in handicaps and it becomes even more compelling to stay where it's open and bland. Like Mason (or any suburb) is.

Ah, you also mentioned that you didn't like the reception you got on Urban Ohio. I saw that thread. What was it about, Austin Pike? You were repetitively flogging a point that was pretty obvious to everyone. I think you're getting the same reception in this thread. You just don't seem to incorporate any new logic into your argumentation. You come off as dogmatic and thick headed.

If you would ever admit that something like the list of issues I cited had bearing on your preferences, and you were willing to call them personal preferences and not broadly label city living inferior, I think most people here would leave you alone and would respect your views more.

By the way, since the ratio reputation/posts was mentioned - my current reputation is 463 and my total posts is 598 as of this one. I must be wearing a little board halo.
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Old 10-21-2012, 08:07 PM
 
Location: In a happy place
3,707 posts, read 6,571,615 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CinciFan View Post
Here we go again...

I have said this repeatedly in thread after thread. Since I GREW UP IN THE SUBURBS AND NOW PREFER THE CITY, I want both the suburbs and the city to do well. I respect peoples choice to live in the suburbs, but I expect the same in return.
Sorry if I offended you. I was just using and expanding on your statement, not criticizing it. It seems that nearly every thread in this sub-forum somehow turns into a bashing of those who have a different opinion of urban/suburban lifestyles. I wish everyone could have civil, respectful comments.

Sometimes I wonder if some threads aren't started just to stir the pot.
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Old 10-21-2012, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
4,007 posts, read 4,829,904 times
Reputation: 924
Quote:
Originally Posted by flashes1 View Post
I'm all for centrist ideas (especially environmental and personal freedom issues), and at the risk of taking it further down the political road, and I think I can safely speak for people of my ilk, that we will no longer accept mainstream media speaking as if they are unbiased. I would never trust any group/organization that votes 80-90% in one direction (and the mainstream media does). The trust has been broken, and we have written these people off, and will never return.
I see you chose genetic fallacy. You never handled the information presented that was in opposition to your point of view. Instead you chose to discredit the source, even though I pulled the same information from multiple sources, political leanings aside.
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Old 10-21-2012, 08:42 PM
 
864 posts, read 1,197,153 times
Reputation: 310
Quote:
Originally Posted by rrtechno View Post
Sorry if I offended you. I was just using and expanding on your statement, not criticizing it. It seems that nearly every thread in this sub-forum somehow turns into a bashing of those who have a different opinion of urban/suburban lifestyles. I wish everyone could have civil, respectful comments.
Amen.

I think the problem with some of these threads is that people think growth of the city has to come at the expense of the suburbs. It doesn't need to be that way if we can make our region attractive to people from other parts of the country. In order to do that we need to make our region, and the especially the city, a more attractive place to live.
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