Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Ohio > Cincinnati
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 07-26-2013, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
477 posts, read 661,356 times
Reputation: 275

Advertisements

Quote:
^^^That is highway robbery and I don't believe anyone in their right mind can justify this cost per mile to develop a subway in this economy, especially in California which is in terrible financial straights.
Have you ever driven in LA traffic before? I think you'd have a vastly different opinion if you were forced to be on a 20 lane freeway that was clogged 14 hours a day and had a 4 hour commute to/from work due to traffic. You could say oh I won't live there but unfortunately because film and media is so concentrated there, there are thousands of people who are literally forced to put up with that because they HAVE to live there in order to work in a field they love and put food on the table.

Traffic is so bad in LA that people actually passed this transit expansion by referendum - one that required over 75% of the vote to get passed! Traffic is literally a 4 letter word there, and they've expanded the freeways so much that people feel that doing that is producing diminishing returns - a 22 lane freeway won't help much when the 20 lanes that already exist are completely clogged.

And speaking of LA...

Quote:
I was living in LA when they were working on the subway line that connected downtown to Western Avenue in Hollywood. Apparently, they have built a decent system there in the 20 something years since I lived there.
I was just there, and in certain parts of town (basically where most touristy things are - the LA basin north of Orange County) its a pretty good transit system already, just keep in mind that you'll be riding a bus instead of a train a lot of places. I really really liked the rapid buses, they stopped only at main drags and even had the ability to shorten lights (think light BRT), I wish Chicago would have those for areas that aren't well served by the trains - and when the trains are finished in LA in 20 years it will have a world class transit system. I spent about 3 days out of the 7 I was there without a car, and was far less stressed out for it. It will be awesome when you can go from Downtown LA to Santa Monica or Westwood by train in under an hour and that's coming very soon.

Quote:
One thing that needs to be considered is the potential for crime against people using mass transit. Recently in Kansas City there instances of riders and even a couple of bus drivers having been attacked by riders. One driver was stabbed just this past week. The negative connotation of using mass transit has to be alleviated and the perception that using mass transit is quite safe if rail is going to sell.
Crime is significantly lower on mass transit than it is off mass transit. Not only that but having more people walking in neighborhoods makes them safer, most crime is commited when there aren't large numbers of people around to call the cops on the perpetrator. Isolated areas are far more at risk for crime, one of the reasons why OTR was so terrible was the amount of abandoned buildings that people could get away with stuff in.

Last edited by neilworms2; 07-26-2013 at 11:47 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-26-2013, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
4,471 posts, read 6,183,898 times
Reputation: 1303
Quote:
Originally Posted by neilworms2 View Post
I was just there, and in certain parts of town (basically where most touristy things are - the LA basin north of Orange County) its a pretty good transit system already, just keep in mind that you'll be riding a bus instead of a train a lot of places. I really really liked the rapid buses, they stopped only at main drags and even had the ability to shorten lights (think light BRT), I wish Chicago would have those for areas that aren't well served by the trains - and when the trains are finished in LA in 20 years it will have a world class transit system. I spent about 3 days out of the 7 I was there without a car, and was far less stressed out for it. It will be awesome when you can go from Downtown LA to Santa Monica or Westwood by train in under an hour and that's coming very soon.
I need to visit at some point, haven't been there in years. I didn't own a car when I lived there and did just fine via bicycle, skate board, and MTA. I'm sure it's a lot better now, with subway lines being operational. And traffic in LA is a freaking nightmare. Spent a lot of hours in that crap with friends trying to get from A to B. Not uncommon to get stuck in traffic in the middle of the night.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
477 posts, read 661,356 times
Reputation: 275
Quote:
I need to visit at some point, haven't been there in years. I didn't own a car when I lived there and did just fine via bicycle, skate board, and MTA. I'm sure it's a lot better now, with subway lines being operational. And traffic in LA is a freaking nightmare. Spent a lot of hours in that crap with friends trying to get from A to B. Not uncommon to get stuck in traffic in the middle of the night.
When I did have a car, I couldn't believe how much traffic there was on the 405 going over the Sepulveda pass at like 11pm on a weeknight - it was nightmarish, tons of lanes (narrowed due to construction) and everyone doing 90 on over a mountain pass with traffic that was not heavy enough to congeal but heavy enough to make changing lanes extremely difficult. The average Cincinnatian who leaves 10 feet in front of them on I-75 in rush hour traffic would be dead in that situation

Here's a pic of what I'm talking about - LA is a whole 'nother world and even if you feel transit is wasteful its probably one of the few places where its hard to be cynical about investing in it due the sheer mass of traffic there: http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1075/...4b0ea3119e.jpg
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 03:26 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
4,471 posts, read 6,183,898 times
Reputation: 1303
Quote:
Originally Posted by neilworms2 View Post
The average Cincinnatian who leaves 10 feet in front of them on I-75 in rush hour traffic would be dead in that situation
Oh, thats a sore subject with me. Three biggest peeves with Cincinnati drivers that I've experienced are:

1 - While I was turning left across Jefferson Street from Corryville, headed back downtown, I had a driver stop in the right lane and wave me into heavy traffic in the left lane. I would have wrecked had I followed his motion.

2 - Drivers that slow down next to an acceleration lane to let traffic onto the interstate, and then the person merging slows down as well.

3 - Remaining stopped at a green light after it was red. Happens all the damn time. WTF is that about anyway?

Drives me nucking futts.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Mason, OH
9,259 posts, read 16,709,519 times
Reputation: 1954
neilworms2 ...

I hope the average Cincinnatian leaves a hell of a lot more space than 10 ft between then and the vehicle ahead on I-75 during rush hour traffic.

Did you ever hear of the principle of safe stopping distance? If anything goes wrong you are likely in a multi-car pileup. You can try to anticipate what is happening up ahead, but in dense rush hour traffic you frankly don't have a clue.

I hope you get the rails to ride on where you have absolutely no control over the operation. At least then you are not responsible for the safety of your fellow motorists.

Here are some of my pet peeves, since they endanger other motorists.
1) People who sit in a left turn lane, and on a Yellow try to see how many cars they can force through an intersection. More than once I have been tempted to T-Bone one of them just out of cantankerous spite. And this is frequently a lane with an actual left turn signal which they missed and are too impatient to wait for the next one.
2) People who run Yellow lights just because they are too damn lazy to stop. Oh correct that, beause they feel privileged.
3) People who buzz their horn at me because I slow down to let someone merging from the right have confidence they can comfortably merge. If you are in such an absolute rush why are you not in the high speed lane? Since I am rarely in a rush (to do what?) I will slow down in the right lane to permit traffic to merge. What else am I supposed to do, run them out of the merge lane so they have to throw on their brakes and mess everything up?

Again, if you don't like this you belong on rail where you have no control of the actual operation. If the train has to park on a siding to permit an express train to pass that is the way it is. If the design has no provision for an express versus a local train, may all of you express frustration at that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 08:31 PM
 
3,513 posts, read 5,127,726 times
Reputation: 1821
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjbrill View Post
Here are some of my pet peeves, since they endanger other motorists.

3) People who buzz their horn at me because I slow down to let someone merging from the right have confidence they can comfortably merge. If you are in such an absolute rush why are you not in the high speed lane? Since I am rarely in a rush (to do what?) I will slow down in the right lane to permit traffic to merge. What else am I supposed to do, run them out of the merge lane so they have to throw on their brakes and mess everything up?
That's a trend I notice a lot driving in SW Ohio. It seems to be unique to the area, and very common. People around here in general don't get over to let oncoming traffic merge onto the highway.

I remember when I first started driving that was what freaked me out the most (and narrow country roads with large ditches - still don't like those).

One time when I was doing my required hours, I merged onto a highway with two lanes in each direction. The guy in the right lane never got over to let me in. Being stupid, I didn't gun it down the entrance ramp to get past him. So next thing I knew I had made a two-lane highway into a three-lane highway! That was the scariest quarter-mile drive I ever hope to have. But hopefully it taught the other guy a lesson... maybe?


Now I've seen plenty of people driving who take it one step further and keep pace with cars coming from the entrance ramp for the sole purpose of ramp-chasing them, I guess. Unfortunately, most of us in these parts tend to be very passive-aggressive, and this is always the example I point to in support of that theory.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 08:46 PM
 
Location: Mason, OH
9,259 posts, read 16,709,519 times
Reputation: 1954
Quote:
Originally Posted by OHKID View Post
Now I've seen plenty of people driving who take it one step further and keep pace with cars coming from the entrance ramp for the sole purpose of ramp-chasing them, I guess. Unfortunately, most of us in these parts tend to be very passive-aggressive, and this is always the example I point to in support of that theory.
If I interpret you correctly, you mean the parallel traffic just keeps pace witrh the merging ramp so there is no clear path to merge. That is just SICK BEHAVIOR, and I hope a minority in Ohio.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 08:54 PM
 
1,295 posts, read 1,899,358 times
Reputation: 693
Quote:
Originally Posted by WILWRadio View Post
One thing that needs to be considered is the potential for crime against people using mass transit. Recently in Kansas City there instances of riders and even a couple of bus drivers having been attacked by riders. One driver was stabbed just this past week. The negative connotation of using mass transit has to be alleviated and the perception that using mass transit is quite safe if rail is going to sell.
This is really a case where people think irrationally. Just about the most dangerous place a person can be in America is in a personal automobile. Transit vehicles are really far down the list. People have a very hard time weighing the risks between intentional (criminal) and accidental dangers.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-26-2013, 11:08 PM
 
109 posts, read 165,381 times
Reputation: 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjbrill View Post
3) People who buzz their horn at me because I slow down to let someone merging from the right have confidence they can comfortably merge. If you are in such an absolute rush why are you not in the high speed lane? Since I am rarely in a rush (to do what?) I will slow down in the right lane to permit traffic to merge. What else am I supposed to do, run them out of the merge lane so they have to throw on their brakes and mess everything up?
I dunno, GET OUT OF THE MERGE LANE? If I'm coming up on an on-ramp that's merging onto the interstate, I get out of the merge lane and let them on. I certainly don't stay in the merge lane and slam on my brakes, throwing the traffic behind me into chaos. This is the kind of stuff that causes accidents, Brill. I know you feel like you're being a "good buddy driver" but this is the sort of nonsense that causes wrecks.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2013, 03:28 AM
 
800 posts, read 944,932 times
Reputation: 559
>Traffic is so bad in LA that people actually passed this transit expansion by referendum - one that required over 75% of the vote to get passed!

California is one of the few states that still requires supermajorities for tax ballot issues, although I think it's 65%, not 75%.

Also, Los Angeles County voters have voted for not one but three separate transit sales taxes, so they have a 1.5 cent transit sales tax in the county. Each of those three taxes funds a different part of it. For example, the first tax from 1980 cannot fund tunnel construction of any kind due to the whacky tunneling ban, but the other two can. I believe the third of the three taxes has a 30 year sunset, and there was recently an attempt to eliminate that sunset, allowing construction to progress more rapidly.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Ohio > Cincinnati

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top