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Old 01-09-2009, 09:39 PM
1 posts, read 10,254 times
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My husband and I moved to Cin over a year ago for his job and we're still trying to get to know the neighborhoods so we'll know where to buy a house. We've been to Forest Park, and we really like the diversity and the areas by Winton High School and off Waycrost Road (Waycross?)--especially the cul-de-sac streets! But some of our friends and coworkers are discouraging. What's so wrong with Forest Park?
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Old 01-10-2009, 07:32 AM
Location: Hartwell--IN THE City of Cincinnati
1,055 posts, read 3,561,254 times
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My sister in law moved to Forest Park in May 08. Its her & her husbands first home. They moved into the "C" section of Forest Park, ranch style house built in the 50's on a dead end street. The neighborhood is broken up into sections by the street names (all the streets begin with the same first letter). I lived in Greenhills which is right next to Forest Park for couple years and they do their streets the same way.
Just like every neighborhood there are good and bad spots. I LOVE the "C" section as it is really close to Winton Woods park and is located south of Sharon Road and west of Waycross.
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:51 PM
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Forest Park is going through what all suburbs that were built immediatley after the war are going through or will go through, you essentially have an entire city of nothing but the same age, same style housing stock. This housing stock is now a half century old and much smaller than what you can get in a new subdivision. If people want suburban living, they can get a better house, probably at a lower cost per sq. ft in Mason or West Chester. If they want urban living, they go to the City.
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:05 PM
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I agree with jlrosen, it's an issue of competitiveness.

To some extent the City and the Exurbs (i.e. Mason, Westchester) are competing for different audiences. They offer different lifestyles, and have different types of residents.

However, mid-century suburbs are in more direct competition with the newer, better exurban McMansion. It's the same style of neighborhood in general, however the newer generation offers bigger, cheaper houses with more chain stores nearby.
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Old 01-10-2009, 07:23 PM
710 posts, read 2,648,678 times
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Originally Posted by Joe 4520832257 View Post
I agree with jlrosen, it's an issue of competitiveness.

To some extent the City and the Exurbs (i.e. Mason, Westchester) are competing for different audiences. They offer different lifestyles, and have different types of residents.

However, mid-century suburbs are in more direct competition with the newer, better exurban McMansion. It's the same style of neighborhood in general, however the newer generation offers bigger, cheaper houses with more chain stores nearby.
Exactly, nobody has their short list down to Downtown or Mason, but Forest Park and Golf Manor can't possibly compete with Mason or West Chester or even Blue Ash or Symmes Township.

Deer Park, Delhi Township, Green Township, Silverton and Finneytown will all be going through this same cycle of disinvestment in the near future.
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Old 01-10-2009, 09:24 PM
Location: Cambridge, MA
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I beg to differ in one important respect: Forest Park was planned as an "intentionally integrated" community. Its founding fathers (parents?) were upset with the patterns of housing discrimination in Greater Cincinnati - much of it legal at the time - and deliberately went against that grain. An unintended consequence was that many realtors "steered" AA homebuyers there, but since the majority of White folks were in the town by choice as well there was no "tipping point" to send its demographics in one direction or another. Although Forest Park now has a majority-Black population, with some original sections such as the "H" streets presently almost monochromatic in the skin tone of their residents, by no means is it in danger of losing its "mixed" feel. New condominium and townhouse complexes along West Kemper Rd have attracted tenants and owners of all shades, and there's a fair amount of buying in by young adults returning to the place of their upbringing. So all the uproar going on in quite a few other postwar areas like Western Hills, Finneytown, etc has no relevance. FP has always been diverse, as well as strategically situated. And none of the housing stock has deteriorated; if any Section 8 conversions have been done they've been scattered and assimilated. "Cycle of disinvestment"? Not there.
A major transition that occurred some years back was the consolidation of the school systems of Forest Park and essentially-all-White Greenhills, done on purpose to engineer a desegregated population at the middle and high school levels. (Greenhills High became Winton Woods Middle, and Forest Park High is now Winton Woods High.) This is mainly what has led people of the "melanin-challenged" race to cast aspersions upon FP - few come right out and say it, but the sentiment is that Greenhills is still "nice" but the town next door has too many of "them" and that downgrades everything. The offspring of families in the former Greenhills district now attend parochial and private schools in fairly significant numbers, though the Winton Woods schools have remained solidly in the second tier of quality. (The majority of graduates pursue higher education, but the path to the Ivy League is broader and smoother in places like Wyoming and Indian Hill.)
Nearly all of my AA classmates who stayed in Cincinnati are now dwelling in Forest Park. It's a safe blanket assumption to make that they like its secure and middle-class character, along with the presence of many folks who "look like them" and without the snootiness that all too often colors life in Wyoming. From time to time when I'm back in Cincinnati, new White acquaintances met in a setting such as a wedding or concert will answer "Forest Park" when asked where their home is. It's almost code among the pale part of society for, "I'm an open-minded person and put my money where my mouth is." Those are Goyguy's kind of people. :-) And it's that kind of people who drew up the plans for FP some sixty years ago.
Waycross Rd is fairly long, but the areas around it are uniformly good. If any part of FP could be called the "moneyed" section, it'd be on the "L" streets which lie west of Winton Rd off Kemper. The only questionable portion of town, in my mind, is around the Forest Park Apartments in the southeast corner adjoining Woodlawn. Aside from its now having subsidized units, the complex is showing its age, had a recent fire, and the track record around Cincy for 1960's-70's apartment developments has not been good of late.
BTW there's a "Home-a-Rama" put on every year by a real-estate group. They always select a newly-developed area to showcase, then furnish some model homes in that area and hold what amounts to a mega open house. One year in the '70s, the "I" section of Forest Park was the place of choice. This section is between Kemper and Sharon Rd's, immediately east of Winton, and is close by the high school so is probably one of the neighborhoods mentioned by the TO.
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Old 01-12-2009, 10:33 AM
Location: Silver Spring,Maryland
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Wow GoGuy you know your stuff. My parents wanted to leave College Hill for Forest Park back in the 80's. I think at that time it was THE place to move for AA families that wanted a bigger, newer home and a nice neighborhood. I have friends that live there and they like it too. Forest Park is more intergrated than many people realize.
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Old 03-22-2009, 11:53 PM
Location: Ohio
71 posts, read 196,201 times
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You insight of the inner workings of social engineering are very insightful. They give me more understanding of how things were made to be played out. I grew up in south western ohio spending my time between Dayton and Cincinnati and some of the suburbs you speak of.

The events I see you express on this forum at times connect the pieces to the puzzles for me, yet at times pricks the heart of some who hide behind the phasode..

Keep it up!!
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Old 06-16-2009, 08:54 AM
1 posts, read 9,495 times
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Default Forest Park I wouldn't

You know when my family moved to Forest Park 10 yeats ago in 1998 I was amazed with the area, being from St. Louis you couldn't find a suburb with this many black people that wasn't ghetto or ignorant. My kids were small and I wanted then to see that black people also lived in the burbs, since we came from the all white suburb of St. Louis. Oh, I am a black american, and I have to say some sections of Forest Park would be a good place for first home owners, but I'd be gone before your kids start school, at that point your children will be exposed to ignorant black kids who of course have the uneducated ignorant black parent, mostly parent not parents. My son's first year of high school wasn't positive at all. He was forced to defend himself constantly from ignorant black kids, I'd luv to use a harsher word. I feel for the poor few white kids at the high school, yes few very few. As soon as possible I want to move from Forest Park. Don't come here, you will be bettrer off.
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Old 06-17-2009, 12:32 AM
Location: Cambridge, MA
4,730 posts, read 10,931,493 times
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Now that this thread's been revived after about three months I'm going to go ahead and run the risk of steering it off the rails.
One of my many favorite sayings goes, "You can take the fill-in-the-blank kid out of the country/ghetto/etc but you can't take the country/ghetto/etc out of the kid." There's a lot of truth in that. Part of Forest Park's evolution has entailed attracting some AA mainstays of Cincinnati out there, such as churches (both newly established and expanded or relocated) and a branch of one of the city's oldest funeral homes. And for every head of household who was raised in a suburban environment such as Woodlawn there's at least one who's bought or rented "up" from a city setting which could be a poorer area like Avondale or even a public housing community. For all of their silliness, old TV shows like "The Beverly Hillbillies" and "Fresh Prince of Bel Air" touched upon what actually happens when folks from one sort of place land in another. They bring their culture with them. It's one thing to hang on the streets socializing at all hours, dabble in "vices" such as casual drug dealing, and so on when you're in OTR. It's quite another when you're in suburbia. You run up against people with no exposure to how life is in "da 'hood" and those who've strived to leave it behind. Resentment builds the more the new arrivals refuse to adapt and the inbumbent residents mutter, "That boy down the street whose mom just brought him here from Winton Terrace had some of his damn friends over at 3 AM again. After they rolled up and leaned on the horn they kept the music blasting and talked, more like yelled, for over an hour. Some of us work for a living around here" and so on.
Add to that the ongoing embracing of "ghetto stylin'" by its rightful owners and kids of all shades from all economic levels. Offending the old folks by donning raggedy clothes and smoking weed was played out by the '80s, but putting an inner-city AA spin on it still works. Some male teens of any race are all about perp-walking and hand-signaling around while uttering bon mots like "Where ma ho's at" and using degrading words such as "dawg" or "ni99a" as terms of endearment (both in hailing friends and for splicing into conversation.) Meanwhile their female counterparts also use, or more likely affect, the same street lingo and similarly emulate inner-city behaviors right down to deliberately getting pregnant. To their elders all of this is "shocking, I'm telling you, utterly appalling." This sizable adolescent subculture thrives no matter where you go, so putting it on Forest Park is unfair.
Carrying this a bit farther: with over 70% of AA households headed by a single mother, equating academic and professional success with "acting White," and idealizing "thug" and "gangsta" behavior Black folks got issues. I know all about how much the US continues to be a racist society: "noise ordinances" that never existed when pale kids roared around in muscle cars crankin' tunes, disinvestment by factories and retailers when a neighborhood "changes," bias - now more subtle - on the part of realtors, presumptions that someone only got where they are in a job because of affirmative-action mandates, on and on it goes. The sad thing is the predictable self-loathing and destruction that this brings, carried out in how much of the youth generation behaves while White kids latch onto its "coolness." There's no geographic boundary where all this is concerned - Indian Hill and the West End alike are impacted. Leaving or avoiding FP only means stumbling into it elsewhere.
"Just sayin'," now I'll climb off my know-it-all Caucasian soapbox.
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