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View Poll Results: Will New York and Phiily have one combine CSA by the 2030 census? ( 20 years from now)
Yes 45 30.41%
No 74 50.00%
Maybe 29 19.59%
Voters: 148. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-10-2016, 08:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy215267 View Post
Philly is def in its own. But PHIL-NYC are close but they have their own and it doesn't help that Staten Island is 45 Miles from the city line of the Philly (Northeast) ? It might happen one day who knows....but like i've told people before i dont
know of any other major cities that are so close together and hold their own and feel , and look the same or just about...and is well connected between the two.
Just checked google maps. From NYC to Philly it's about 98-101 miles driving. From LA to SD it's about 120 miles. Yeah it's about 20 miles more, but still a bit similar. The two already share some commuters. I haven't kept up to date on the commuting patterns, but I know Temecula area saw a big boom because some families had one spouse commuting to LA and the other to SD and it's between the two big cities. Both LA and SD have distinct identities but are well linked by freeways and trains. Those are the only other 2 I can think of. I mean there are other cities close together, but nothing like 1 massive CSA bordering another that is large on its own, but quite overshadowed in comparison.
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Old 07-10-2016, 10:00 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia/ Rehoboth Beach
295 posts, read 276,247 times
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My daughter bought a home in Princeton and it takes me less than 20 minutes from S. Main St. to the Pa line . I think the two CSA's are entangled very much so. . Philly has a strong influence in Mercer county . CHoP has a large outpatient center next to Princeton Medical Center and CHoP neonatologists run the neonatal unit at Princeton Med Center .http://www.chop.edu/locations?utm_so...1709&layers=TB

Last edited by kingtutaaa; 07-10-2016 at 10:10 PM..
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Old 07-10-2016, 10:08 PM
 
Location: Land of the Free
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A single CSA stretching from Madison, CT to Elkton, MD starts to bring into question the usefulness of the CSA. Scheduled commercial air service within the CSA has to get some kind of score against combination.

The DC-Baltimore combo is ridiculous enough given that it's two media markets, and two cities that couldn't be further apart culturally. But a NY-Philly CSA could pull in 3, 4, maybe 5 media markets? Contrast to the Bay Area, which even with SF, SJ, Oakland, and some distant suburbs, is still just one media market.
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Old 07-10-2016, 11:01 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia/ Rehoboth Beach
295 posts, read 276,247 times
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Maybe the time has come for new terminology to better describe and fit the 21st century where giant CSA's run together and inter-react . Lets face it's only 90 miles between NYC and Philly and with high speed trains and super highways that distance is growing shorter it is becoming like one Mega City with 33 million people .
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Old 07-11-2016, 08:57 AM
 
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
6,541 posts, read 5,153,368 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheseGoTo11 View Post
A single CSA stretching from Madison, CT to Elkton, MD starts to bring into question the usefulness of the CSA. Scheduled commercial air service within the CSA has to get some kind of score against combination.

The DC-Baltimore combo is ridiculous enough given that it's two media markets, and two cities that couldn't be further apart culturally. But a NY-Philly CSA could pull in 3, 4, maybe 5 media markets? Contrast to the Bay Area, which even with SF, SJ, Oakland, and some distant suburbs, is still just one media market.
Culture has nothing to do with a CSA. It has do with commuting patterns, proximity and amenities shared, in fact DC-Baltimore fit the definition to a T:

A combined statistical area (CSA) is composed of adjacent metropolitan (MSA) and micropolitan statistical areas (µSA) in the United States and Puerto Rico that can demonstrate economic or social linkage. The United States Office of Management and Budget defines a CSA as consisting of various combinations of adjacent metropolitan and micropolitan areas with economic ties measured by commuting patterns. These areas that combine retain their own designations as metropolitan or micropolitan statistical areas within the larger combined statistical area.

Washington DC has the highest share of long distance auto commuting in the country ahead of NYC, so it absolutely makes sense that suburbs 20-30 miles away from the city pull enough commuters to combine as one CSA. Because in reality there is a large share of commuting from 50-60 miles away heck some even 75-80 miles away. There is a reason we have 2nd busiest subway system, and still have the 1st or 2nd worst traffic in the entire US.

Also Miami- West Palm Beach etc has separate media markets within one MSA, let alone their CSA.

Last edited by the resident09; 07-11-2016 at 09:15 AM..
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Old 07-14-2016, 09:22 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia/ Rehoboth Beach
295 posts, read 276,247 times
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Not only is CHoP expanding in to the NYC market , now Penn Medicine and Princeton Medical Center also merging , more evidence of Phillys influence in the NYC market .
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Old 07-30-2016, 03:54 PM
 
6,752 posts, read 3,191,314 times
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No. It would make no sense. Central cities are too far apart. The radius area would make no sense at all. Once you get beyond about a 40 miles radius of the central city, the relationship between the central city and its outer suburbs drops off dramatically. Merging the statistical data of NYC and Philly would totally obliterate the true picture of what metro Philly is and what metro NYC is. The cities of NYC and Philly are 100 miles apart. I could go into more detail, but generally, NYC and Philly are 2 distinct metros and makes no sense "combining" them.
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Old 07-31-2016, 10:51 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn, New York
4,391 posts, read 4,603,459 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by march2 View Post
No. It would make no sense. Central cities are too far apart. The radius area would make no sense at all. Once you get beyond about a 40 miles radius of the central city, the relationship between the central city and its outer suburbs drops off dramatically. Merging the statistical data of NYC and Philly would totally obliterate the true picture of what metro Philly is and what metro NYC is. The cities of NYC and Philly are 100 miles apart. I could go into more detail, but generally, NYC and Philly are 2 distinct metros and makes no sense "combining" them.
1. The 40 mile radius from central city as influence is your subjective opinion. Bigger cities have bigger influence. Both NYC and Philly are big cities.

2. At their closest NYC and Philly are about 45 miles apart as the crow flies (from city limits to city limits). They are about 100 miles apart driving distance from downtown NYC to Center City Philly, thus about half of each cities' areas are actually closer than that (Eg. from Bay Ridge, Brooklyn to Northeast Philly is 80 miles by car, from Tottenville (NYC neighborhood on Staten Island) its about 60-65 miles by car). Furthermore, there are no natural barriers between them, just open stretches of land.

3. This is about combining CSAs, not metro areas (MSAs).
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Old 08-01-2016, 01:03 PM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,669 posts, read 20,177,963 times
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If New York and Philadelphia ever become one CSA, this is what it will look like:

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Old 08-01-2016, 01:38 PM
 
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I kinda doubt it would happen by 2030-2035, but after that, it may be a open question. As others have pointed out, depending on where you're going, if you time it right it can almost be faster to move from point to point between the two cities, than within either city. I used to have to make a long commute from West Philly to North Philly via bus, el, and subway, that could take nearly an hour and a half if I missed a connection, and I remember sometimes standing on the subway platform thinking half-jokingly that it would be easier to catch regional rail to Trenton, then NJT to Manhattan for work. Which is an exaggeration, but a slight one. People really make that commute all the time, and vice-versa. And the two metros are just going to continue grow and blur into each other at the margins. But both cities/metros are so large and so fiercely independent (despite their similarities) that I think that their will always be a certain distinction between them. As another poster suggested, we might need some new terminology to describe the region, and the relationship between the two cities/metros.
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