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Regarding Boston, I wholeheartedly agree as I have been there personally and have seen it, which is why Im a little shocked that according to C-D, Boston has no neighborhoods with 30K+ppsm(?), but I wonder if its because very dense areas and not as dense areas are in the same neighborhood?
@kidphilly, I go by city-data neighborhoods, not zip codes but obviously your data is just as correct, just a different geography(zip code as opposed to actual neighborhoods)
Going by census tract, Boston definitely has multiple areas well above 30,000 people per square mile...i dunno if they comprise entire neighborhoods though. But on the other hand i've noticed that neighborhood boundaries as definined on CD are kind of weird sometimes, so it could simply be lack of correct data on this website, and Boston does actually have at least one neighborhood of 30,000+ pp/sq. mi (it seems like it should). A Bostonian would know better lol.
agree was reviewing these a bit and am confused by quite a few not to mention they have neighborhoods on here (one of which i used to live in) I had never heard of.
The zip stuff may make more sense though some boundary issues there
I would also suspect that the North End is at least at likely well above 30K as a neighborhood in Boston
I was also reviewing their definitions for places like Old City, Society Hill, Queen Village, Pennsport along the eastern portion of Center City and these areas were showing densities at like 15-20K, then i looked and they included all the port frontage in these places bascially doubling the size and halving the density.
Last edited by kidphilly; 10-01-2011 at 02:58 PM..
Going by census tract, Boston definitely has multiple areas well above 30,000 people per square mile...i dunno if they comprise entire neighborhoods though. But on the other hand i've noticed that neighborhood boundaries as definined on CD are kind of weird sometimes, so it could simply be lack of correct data on this website, and Boston does actually have at least one neighborhood of 30,000+ pp/sq. mi (it seems like it should). A Bostonian would know better lol.
You also got me thinking on zip 19104 in Philly a little more, basically UCity - at 3 sq miles and at 27+K ppsm this 3 sq miles includes three university campuses, a huge rail station and rail yard, 3 stadiums, the whole Penn and CHOP medical center (huge complex), part of fairmont park, and the Philadelphia zoo in this zip. None of these metrics are perfect.
Also on ur 17 sq miles I dont think Philly can match that, based on some quick numbers I think the best I can get a Philly density at on continuity in that space would about 3K less ppsm. It is after this are where Philly must maintain higher denisity as it can achieve over 20K ppsm in the 47 sq miles. Once outside the core of Philly the density stays pretty constant with the miles of continuity of rowhome neighborhoods
Regarding Boston, I wholeheartedly agree as I have been there personally and have seen it, which is why Im a little shocked that according to C-D, Boston has no neighborhoods with 30K+ppsm(?), but I wonder if its because very dense areas and not as dense areas are in the same neighborhood?
@kidphilly, I go by city-data neighborhoods, not zip codes but obviously your data is just as correct, just a different geography(zip code as opposed to actual neighborhoods)
That is the weird part on the neighborhood data, the zips have self contained multiple neighborhoods which should be way higher yet dont show. Rittenhouse should really be ~50K+ but yet is shown less than 30K on here. Another is Queen Village, the densest part/neighborhood of zip 19147 (zip shown at 30+k) yet QV shows in the neighborhood profile at 15K ppsm (the latest census data suggest it is pushing 40K it is only 5 blocks by 7 blocks as a neighborhood and this is based on a Philadelphia Inquirer profile done with the census release, also back to the North End, while QV is fairly dense I would think the North End in Boston is at least 10K more dense as a neighborhood) - if you even spent time in this neighborhood (QV) you would immeadiately know that 15K number is somehow false
That is the weird part on the neighborhood data, the zips have self contained multiple neighborhoods which should be way higher yet dont show. Rittenhouse should really be ~50K+ but yet is shown less than 30K on here. Another is Queen Village, the densest part/neighborhood of zip 19147 (zip shown at 30+k) yet QV shows in the neighborhood profile at 15K ppsm (the latest census data suggest it is pushing 40K it is only 5 blocks by 7 blocks as a neighborhood and this is based on a Philadelphia Inquirer profile down with the census release, also nback to the North End, while QV is fairly dense I would think the North End in Boston is at least 10K more dense as a neighborhood) - if you even spent time in this neighborhood you would immeadiately know that 15K number is somehow false
Yeah, the same can be said of probably any city, for example Ive seen the Tenderloin as high as 100,000 ppsm. I wonder if C-D will update their density data soon to reflect the census?
Yeah, the same can be said of probably any city, for example Ive seen the Tenderloin as high as 100,000 ppsm. I wonder if C-D will update their density data soon to reflect the census?
But it just seems wrong (not just not updated) the more I look at the philly neighborhoods. And image this would be the case in other cities as well.
Old City at 14K ppsm - it may be the closest area in the country to the NYs Village in America in development style - they just make no sense some of these
It (CD in the old city profile) also lists a tract at over 80K ppsm which may make sense actually in the same profile that shows overall density at 14K ppsm. Overall just doesnt make sense to me, Old City is a small area with mostly lofts/condos/Apartments highly dense and this isnt because of 2000 census data
Last edited by kidphilly; 10-01-2011 at 04:19 PM..
To me urbanity isn't strictly about density or ppl per sq mile.... to me urbanity is a mix of concrete steel and brick like an urban jungle..old town Alexandria, VA is more dense than SE DC but I dnt consider that more urban. There are bars on nearly every window in DC and LA that's what I consider urban. Phillys brick rowhouses is what I consider urban
Chicago looks to have wider zips than SF, I think it is slightly denser if you do community areas/neighborhoods using more easily definable dense blocks instead of grabbing up a lot of warehouses and stuff which Chicago definitely still has, this is also off city-data. I've spent a lot of time in both, they are pretty comparable esp when you get into the neighborhoods. SF's immediate DT as well as Philadelphia are more populated with narrower streets. Chicago's DT is more commercial oriented and significantly larger. Chicago will keep up that 20k+ density quite a bit further if you keep expanding though.
Last edited by Garfieldian; 10-02-2011 at 10:50 AM..
and you posted this why?? did you look at the poll, no Chicago.
Somebody asked about it. Yes I see the poll Sherlock.
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