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Old 01-22-2011, 10:55 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwkimbro View Post
Well a few considerations/pieces to the answer

historical... it was the first area of the U.S. to really grow into an advanced economy, so historically it is the financial/business hub. Most companies move and/or build elsewhere to take advantage of lower costs elsewhere... part of this runs into what John Biggs... with the relationship between income levels and educational attainment... It is also why the area attracts people with higher educational attainment and incomes as well. (Compared to our worldwide counterparts... we move around quite a bit).

They also have had longer time to build up a stronger education system.

Other issues for some areas are rural populations tend to be low cost, low education, lower pay. You don't traditionally need a masters degree to run a family farm. Although, there is room for bio engineers in the agri-corporations.

A few places have local/regional issues that hold them down by averages. The racial divide in the south being one that comes to mind. The scars of slavery are still there, despite having come a long way. If you analyze the white black populations separately the educational attainment is much higher for whites, than blacks. The basic modern problem being that, while attitudes about race and segregation are far better than they were before, it has only been a generation or two. Most people stay the same at the same economic level as their parents, so it is going to take time for the disparity to readjust.... Just a quick side note... the racial disparity and problems exist country-wide. It isn't just the south. The difference is we have a larger, mostly rural population here that is left behind and doesn't have as much direction at improving the situation.
Like racial segregation is not an issue up north (sarcasm). North was known for segregation, HECK, even White people segregated each other.

Polish here, Italians there, etc.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:16 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgamibi View Post
Like racial segregation is not an issue up north (sarcasm). North was known for segregation, HECK, even White people segregated each other.

Polish here, Italians there, etc.
It's different because it's more by choice, whereas in the South the divide was by law for a long time. Hence, the point about the legacy of slavery/legal segregation.

Also, the ethnic enclaves of the Northern cities still had a close proximity to other groups and in turn, you would have integrated schools even in the early 20th century, if not prior to that, in many Northern cities.

I think a lot of the difference is the early start of the Northern areas and standards like teacher education could be a factor. Maybe the smaller school districts in the North could be a factor too. Meaning, the test scores for Southern school districts are many, if not most times, are on a county level, whereas in the North, many school districts are community specific. So, you could possibly say that the school districts in the North are an example of smaller government in the sense of the size of the jurisdiction, but it could also be seen as being big in the terms of so many administrations/jurisdictions. So, maybe we need to look at efficient governing as the bottom line.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:25 AM
NCN
 
Location: NC/SC Border Patrol
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You live out of the book and we live by life experiences. Our children have not been brainwashed to the correct answer. They are taught to think for themselves. I would rather have a person who can think for himself than have one that makes a high score on some prejudiced test.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
It's different because it's more by choice, whereas in the South the divide was by law for a long time. Hence, the point about the legacy of slavery/legal segregation.

Also, the ethnic enclaves of the Northern cities still had a close proximity to other groups and in turn, you would have integrated schools even in the early 20th century, if not prior to that, in many Northern cities.

I think a lot of the difference is the early start of the Northern areas and standards like teacher education could be a factor. Maybe the smaller school districts in the North could be a factor too. Meaning, the test scores for Southern school districts are many, if not most times, are on a county level, whereas in the North, many school districts are community specific. So, you could possibly say that the school districts in the North are an example of smaller government in the sense of the size of the jurisdiction, but it could also be seen as being big in the terms of so many administrations/jurisdictions. So, maybe we need to look at efficient governing as the bottom line.
By choice? So if a Black person wanted to live in an all White neighborhood up north you are telling me they wouldn't be bothered about it!?

Also down south I have seen 10x more integration than I could ever see up North. It is common to see Black and White couples and it is common for all ethnic groups to hang out with each other without there being much conflict.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:32 AM
 
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On the whole, they value education more in the north. Northern areas with higher population concentrations have also been more willing to see the values of collectivism on certain fronts. In our modern society, a rugged individualist mentality usually sets people back in terms of most anything including education. And, the south is where the rugged individualist mentality is more strongly embraced. It's a fairly silly mentality when considering that 90% of their livelihoods are dependent on entities formed or obtained through collectivist means. When they finally wise up, I believe that you will see more uniformity.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgamibi View Post
By choice? So if a Black person wanted to live in an all White neighborhood up north you are telling me they wouldn't be bothered about it!?

Also down south I have seen 10x more integration than I could ever see up North. It is common to see Black and White couples and it is common for all ethnic groups to hang out with each other without there being much conflict.
I'd agree; whether it's voluntarily or involuntarily segregation; it isn't progressive. You guys can keep pointing out the negative history of the south, but the south has come a long way and that's what really matters. Like I've stated before; Black northerns settled for the conditions and the requirements the white men placed on them; while black southerners fought until the end. The results of the southerners bravery can be seen today within our cities.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:34 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland_Collector View Post
On the whole, they value education more in the north. Northern areas with higher population concentrations have also been more willing to see the values of collectivism on certain fronts. In our modern society, a rugged individualist mentality usually sets people back in terms of most anything including education. And, the south is where the rugged individualist mentality is more strongly embraced. It's a fairly silly mentality when considering that 90% of their livelihoods are dependent on entities formed or obtained through collectivist means. When they finally wise up, I believe that you will see more uniformity.
Lets not completely put the south down now, the Private schools there produce better kids than most schools up north and the suburban public schools down south produce some extremely bright kids as well.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:36 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
I'd agree; whether it's voluntarily or involuntarily segregation; it isn't progressive. You guys can keep pointing out the negative history of the south, but the south has come a long way and that's what really matters. Like I've stated before; Black northerns settled for the conditions and the requirements the white men placed on them; while black southerners fought until the end.
Outstanding point.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:37 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgamibi View Post
By choice? So if a Black person wanted to live in an all White neighborhood up north you are telling me they wouldn't be bothered about it!?
No, probably not. Especially not the majority.

Quote:
Also down south I have seen 10x more integration than I could ever see up North. It is common to see Black and White couples and it is common for all ethnic groups to hang out with each other without there being much conflict.
Well, all I have to say about that is Jim Crow was alive and well down south 50 years ago. Things are changing in the south and that's great. But, saying that racism is more prevalent in the north and especially the northeast is just flat-out ignorant.
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Old 01-22-2011, 11:38 AM
NCN
 
Location: NC/SC Border Patrol
21,136 posts, read 21,166,415 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland_Collector View Post
On the whole, they value education more in the north. Northern areas with higher population concentrations have also been more willing to see the values of collectivism on certain fronts. In our modern society, a rugged individualist mentality usually sets people back in terms of most anything including education. And, the south is where the rugged individualist mentality is more strongly embraced. It's a fairly silly mentality when considering that 90% of their livelihoods are dependent on entities formed or obtained through collectivist means. When they finally wise up, I believe that you will see more uniformity.
You have lost the ability to think for yourself and you are suggesting that a person who still has a functioning brain should wise up. You are one step from communism.
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