#2 In the Northeast: Philadelphia or Boston (living, state, largest, compared)

[Dub King]

They never make any lists of richest people anymore. Probably because they are so big into philanthropy and public service. I'm glad they live up to their credo of helping others. Holding a RI congressional seat is a fairly weak position after the political glory they enjoyed in decades past.

Originally Posted by btownboss4

they still have 1 seat in RI Congress, an oil company for people who can't afford home heating oil
Run the special Olympics, and are crazy rich.

[btownboss4]

Originally Posted by Dub King

They never make any lists of richest people anymore. Probably because they are so big into philanthropy and public service. I'm glad they live up to their credo of helping others. Holding a RI congressional seat is a fairly weak position after the political glory they enjoyed in decades past.

in Many ways thats more influental than getting money and puting in a hole in your backyard, as many rich people do.

[Dub King]

Of course, I'm not putting the Kennedy's down. I respect what they have done. The same can be said for the Pew family of Philadelphia, except that they didn't hold any elected positions and they were conservatives.

Originally Posted by btownboss4

in Many ways thats more influental than getting money and puting in a hole in your backyard, as many rich people do.

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by btownboss4

ok then, thats a nitpick but whatever, History is one of those things that are a virtual draw between the two cities.

no it's not a nitpick. Harvard in the 18th century resembles a seminary more than a modern university. It's place as the first institute of higher learning is also in debate as William and Mary also stakes a claim here. Upenn's place as the first University in America is undeniable.

Originally Posted by btownboss4

Boston is more important Historicly
the start of the American Revolution
Shays Rebbellion was stopped here
(cause of the consitutional convention)
the Indusdustal revolution started there*
First primary school*
First Public school
First University*
First Hospital*

*in America

Funny that when deciding to create a list that shows Boston's Historical importance you choose 8 facts. And of those 8 facts:

-2 of those facts are outright falsehoods (university and hospital)

-2 of the facts (first public school in the world and first primary school in America) are tied to same institution, Boston Latin, and while it IS the first primary school in america, it is NOT the first public school in the world, in fact most wouldn't even consider it the first public school in america. Due to who was allowed to attend the school: only puritans and almost primarily upper class citizens, the school wasn't exactly public.

In fact although Penn Charter (in Philadelphia) is today an exclusive private school, in it's beginning it was a much more a "public school" than Boston Latin ever was. It was the first school in America to offer finanical aid to students of lesser means, the first to allow girls to learn alongside boys, and the first to welcome children of all creeds and colors. It was truly an institution where the entire public was welcomed, whereas Boston Latin was NOT. Also Penn Charter and the other Quaker schools started in Philadelphia are MUCH more pertinent to modern schooling, take any class on the history of education and that much will be made obvious. The Quaker schools are sometimes considered the birthplace of modern public schooling across the world due to the exclusion of many facets that were long predominant such as etiquette and religion as well as scholarly topics that had little to no relevance to everyday life such as astrology and Latin(ahem). Instead the schools focused instilling educational ideals that would benefit the students and society, mostly, reading, writing, and arithmetic. A curriculum that from Philadelphia would subsequently spread across most of the globe.

-1 of your facts (shays rebellion) lists a factual truth... but then ties it to a greater event in a false connection. Shays Rebellion influenced what happened at the Constitutional Convention, mostly with the decision to create Washington D.C., to claim it as the reason WHY they met is at best only very partially true and at worst at outright lie. Besides it is not the ending of the rebellion that is important, it is it's beginning, the fact that it even exists that shapes American policy. The rebellion started in Springfield Mass then Springfield should claim the rebellion, not Boston... although claiming a rebellion against the American Government seems like a dubious thing to hang your hat on despite it's affect on future policy.

Not to mention the actual important event we're talking about here: the Constitutional Convention, the assembly that wrote and signed our Constitution in 1787 took place in PHILADELPHIA.

-1 of your facts states a fact that can easily be disputed, depending on context. You claim that the American revolution starts in Boston. The first battles of the war were certainly fought there. However at the time in which they were fought the American Revolution did not yet exist. When the battles occur they are fought by Massachusetts Minutemen against the British army. It is only when independence is declared in PHILADELPHIA that our country is actually created and is the technical start of the Revolutionary war. So if you want you can say the first battles of the Revolutionary War took place outside of Boston... but to say the Revolutionary War started IN Boston is questionable as it could be easily be debated that it actually started in Philadelphia.

So after your facts are put under scrutiny this is what is left of your list of 8 facts:

The first primary school in America
The start of the industrial Revolution in America

Listen Boston has a RICH history and is extremely important in the creation of this country. But at best you should hope to match Philadelphia in historical importance. If you try and claim that Boston is more important "historicly" though I'll be glad to continue to thoroughly show you that this is untrue.

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by btownboss4

in Many ways thats more influental than getting money and puting in a hole in your backyard, as many rich people do.

absolutely agree. The Kennedy's are a great American family and their service to others continues to serve as an example. I have two portraits in my study and both of them I will admit are of men who came from Boston. Bobby Kennedy and Benjamin Franklin... although Benjamin is of course a true Philadelphia through and through.

[po-boy]

I'm no expert on these two cities, but to me it is close enough to call it a draw. Both are among America's most important historical cities. By city and metro, Philly is a little larger, with I believe a slightly higher GDP. Boston has a higher profile thanks to its educational institutions and the fact that it is on one end of the Bos-Wash corridor instead of in the middle like Philly.

Trying to decide which is #2 in the Northeast is hopefully a fun exercise for those weighing in, but at the end of the day I think there are arguments for either side and they are both major national cities.

[tmac9wr]

Originally Posted by Dub King

Time for the classic clip, I think:


Philly rulez, Boston sucks - YouTube

Haha love that clip. At least we're not Los Angeles. Highways, Legoland, Michael Bay haha. Great show

[btownboss4]

Originally Posted by phillies2011

no it's not a nitpick. Harvard in the 18th century resembles a seminary more than a modern university. It's place as the first institute of higher learning is also in debate as William and Mary also stakes a claim here. Upenn's place as the first University in America is undeniable.




Funny that when deciding to create a list that shows Boston's Historical importance you choose 8 facts. And of those 8 facts:

-2 of those facts are outright falsehoods (university and hospital)

-2 of the facts (first public school in the world and first primary school in America) are tied to same institution, Boston Latin, and while it IS the first primary school in america, it is NOT the first public school in the world, in fact most wouldn't even consider it the first public school in america. Due to who was allowed to attend the school: only puritans and almost primarily upper class citizens, the school wasn't exactly public.

In fact although Penn Charter (in Philadelphia) is today an exclusive private school, in it's beginning it was a much more a "public school" than Boston Latin ever was. It was the first school in America to offer finanical aid to students of lesser means, the first to allow girls to learn alongside boys, and the first to welcome children of all creeds and colors. It was truly an institution where the entire public was welcomed, whereas Boston Latin was NOT. Also Penn Charter and the other Quaker schools started in Philadelphia are MUCH more pertinent to modern schooling, take any class on the history of education and that much will be made obvious. The Quaker schools are sometimes considered the birthplace of modern public schooling across the world due to the exclusion of many facets that were long predominant such as etiquette and religion as well as scholarly topics that had little to no relevance to everyday life such as astrology and Latin(ahem). Instead the schools focused instilling educational ideals that would benefit the students and society, mostly, reading, writing, and arithmetic. A curriculum that from Philadelphia would subsequently spread across most of the globe.

-1 of your facts (shays rebellion) lists a factual truth... but then ties it to a greater event in a false connection. Shays Rebellion influenced what happened at the Constitutional Convention, mostly with the decision to create Washington D.C., to claim it as the reason WHY they met is at best only very partially true and at worst at outright lie. Besides it is not the ending of the rebellion that is important, it is it's beginning, the fact that it even exists that shapes American policy. The rebellion started in Springfield Mass then Springfield should claim the rebellion, not Boston... although claiming a rebellion against the American Government seems like a dubious thing to hang your hat on despite it's affect on future policy.

Not to mention the actual important event we're talking about here: the Constitutional Convention, the assembly that wrote and signed our Constitution in 1787 took place in PHILADELPHIA.

-1 of your facts states a fact that can easily be disputed, depending on context. You claim that the American revolution starts in Boston. The first battles of the war were certainly fought there. However at the time in which they were fought the American Revolution did not yet exist. When the battles occur they are fought by Massachusetts Minutemen against the British army. It is only when independence is declared in PHILADELPHIA that our country is actually created and is the technical start of the Revolutionary war. So if you want you can say the first battles of the Revolutionary War took place outside of Boston... but to say the Revolutionary War started IN Boston is questionable as it could be easily be debated that it actually started in Philadelphia.

So after your facts are put under scrutiny this is what is left of your list of 8 facts:

The first primary school in America
The start of the industrial Revolution in America

Listen Boston has a RICH history and is extremely important in the creation of this country. But at best you should hope to match Philadelphia in historical importance. If you try and claim that Boston is more important "historicly" though I'll be glad to continue to thoroughly show you that this is untrue.

Ok
-Lexington-Concord
-Bunker Hill
-Siege of Boston
the first 3 major Battles of the Revolution were in Boston.
And infact the entire reason for Ticondaroga, and Saratoga was to save Boston because without it the rebbelion would fall apart because Bostonians had the cultural and Finantal support for the war, Philly was just a cental point to meet, when most of the information put in those 2 Documents were from People from Massachusetts or Virginia.
on the Bold the rebellion started in Springfield and went east from there being stopped right outside Boston. ZHZow is a rebellion against the American Government silly, while you say a rebellion against the British Government makes these cities have a rich History?

[Dub King]

blah blah blah.

So tell me, is DC not important because senators and members of congress come from other states and just happen to be meeting in DC because it's a convenient, central place?

Regardless, you ignore so much Philly history, but I don't blame you... you're from Boston.

Originally Posted by btownboss4

Ok
-Lexington-Concord
-Bunker Hill
-Siege of Boston
the first 3 major Battles of the Revolution were in Boston.
And infact the entire reason for Ticondaroga, and Saratoga was to save Boston because without it the rebbelion would fall apart because Bostonians had the cultural and Finantal support for the war, Philly was just a cental point to meet, when most of the information put in those 2 Documents were from People from Massachusetts or Virginia.
on the Bold the rebellion started in Springfield and went east from there being stopped right outside Boston. ZHZow is a rebellion against the American Government silly, while you say a rebellion against the British Government makes these cities have a rich History?

[btownboss4]

Originally Posted by Dub King

blah blah blah.

So tell me, is DC not important because senators and members of congress come from other states and just happen to be meeting in DC because it's a convenient, central place?

Regardless, you ignore so much Philly history, but I don't blame you... you're from Boston.

and the constitution was based off the Mass Bay Charter.
History Boston has a slight edge.