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View Poll Results: Which has a better Downtown
Philadelphia 192 62.34%
Seattle 116 37.66%
Voters: 308. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-09-2016, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Center City
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays25 View Post
That's not "downtown." That's a 2-mile radius from city hall, or more than six square miles! Philly count probably over five square miles of land, while Seattle and others count substantially less due to water. And it's a very oversized area. Center City is a couple square miles.
I'm a little confused. Cities are debated on their own merit, not on some grading curve. Seattle doesn't start with a handicap based on its geography.

I also agree with the poster above. Your enthusiastic claims would carry more weight if they were backed up with actual facts.
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Old 05-09-2016, 10:10 PM
 
Location: Northern Wisconsin
4,455 posts, read 3,375,763 times
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Definitely Philadelphia.
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Old 05-09-2016, 10:28 PM
 
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I prefer Philly's because it's more compact and pedestrian-friendly.
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Old 05-09-2016, 11:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pine to Vine View Post
I'm a little confused. Cities are debated on their own merit, not on some grading curve. Seattle doesn't start with a handicap based on its geography.

I also agree with the poster above. Your enthusiastic claims would carry more weight if they were backed up with actual facts.
Huh? I said that Philly's two-mile radius contains more land than the same radius in a city with more water. How could that be confusing?
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Old 05-10-2016, 06:30 AM
 
Location: Center City
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays25 View Post
Huh? I said that Philly's two-mile radius contains more land than the same radius in a city with more water. How could that be confusing?
Manhattan is an an island, for crissakes! City planners there didn't throw up their hands and whine.
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Old 05-10-2016, 11:44 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityEvaluator View Post
First of all, let me say I prefer Philly's downtown (although both are great). But what he's saying is you can't fairly compare development using a 2-mile radius as your geographic unit when one has more land area in a 2-mile radius than the other.
Makes sense, although it depends on where you place the origin (center plot). Philly has the Delaware and the Schuylkill, although I know that's less water than what Seattle has.

The radius discussion is kind of beside the point IMO. Even if you took square land miles, Philly is more dense and vibrant. That's likely not going to change, even though Seattle is outpacing Philly's development growth. Center City has almost a 200 year head-start on Seattle with old-school urban build and a high residential population (and growing).
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Old 05-10-2016, 01:20 PM
 
Location: Center City
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityEvaluator View Post
First of all, let me say I prefer Philly's downtown (although both are great). But what he's saying is you can't fairly compare development using a 2-mile radius as your geographic unit when one has more land area in a 2-mile radius than the other.
And I am saying that Seattle is what is is - on water. There are no handicaps applied to this argument. If demand was warranted, Seattle would grow up, not out, within its footprint. I suspect that will come if the city continues to grow.

BTW, Philadelphia City Hall to Front Street and the Delaware on its east flank is 1.2 miles away. 2 miles afar lies NJ. Looks like Philly should air a complaint since we can't count those folks, huh? No one's living in our water, either.

Not trying to be snarky - just offering another viewpoint.
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Old 05-10-2016, 04:44 PM
 
Location: The City
22,379 posts, read 38,796,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pine to Vine View Post
And I am saying that Seattle is what is is - on water. There are no handicaps applied to this argument. If demand was warranted, Seattle would grow up, not out, within its footprint. I suspect that will come if the city continues to grow.

BTW, Philadelphia City Hall to Front Street and the Delaware on its east flank is 1.2 miles away. 2 miles afar lies NJ. Looks like Philly should air a complaint since we can't count those folks, huh? No one's living in our water, either.

Not trying to be snarky - just offering another viewpoint.
Not to mention two miles has also a huge park or significant parts of it. I posted the link to show that while Philly isnt growing fast on the whole it is growing rapidly in the core and already had a pretty large lead in population and density in both the direct downtown and extended neighborhoods. That difference would takes many many decades at the current change rates to be closed if ever

They are built differently and I find Philly more seamless by a large margin unless somehow 2 years have flipped this on its side and I will be honest not sure I can believe that based on the numbers I have seen. That said Seattle punches above its weight and is impressive. Just not the same density or to me vibrance of Philly and the close to DT neighborhoods though many may prefer Seattle it's just to me not at the same level of the next tiers of DAS outside of retail
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Old 05-10-2016, 05:33 PM
 
Location: Center City
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Originally Posted by kidphilly View Post
Not to mention two miles has also a huge park or significant parts of it. l
Which makes the Philly 2 mile stats even more impressive.
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Old 05-10-2016, 06:38 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pine to Vine View Post
Which makes the Philly 2 mile stats even more impressive.
Not surprising. Many tracts in central Philly hit 30k+/ppsm. There are a lot of people packed in + all the businesses/companies, tourist sites, city government, parks and water.
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