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Unread 03-12-2012, 12:12 PM
 
7,121 posts, read 3,865,682 times
Reputation: 1205
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spade View Post
Baltimore may have been that city in this area. But Philadelphia would have probably been the 3rd largest metro over 10 million if it stayed there. I think DC would have been Frederick if the capital didn't move there.
Same can be said for any city. If Philadelphia was not the capital long ago and was not settled, it too would not be in existence. If early settlers had landed in South Carolina and Georgia, Charleston and Savanna would be Boston and New York etc., Jacksonville would be Philadelphia. The center of the country and population would be in the south. That is the problem with talking about what if this or what if that. There is not a city in the nation that wasn't effected by choices people made 400 years ago.

 
Unread 03-12-2012, 03:17 PM
 
Location: The City
17,992 posts, read 13,311,289 times
Reputation: 5086
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
Same can be said for any city. If Philadelphia was not the capital long ago and was not settled, it too would not be in existence. If early settlers had landed in South Carolina and Georgia, Charleston and Savanna would be Boston and New York etc., Jacksonville would be Philadelphia. The center of the country and population would be in the south. That is the problem with talking about what if this or what if that. There is not a city in the nation that wasn't effected by choices people made 400 years ago.

Charleston and St Augustine are as old or older than many others. While there is a point cities like Boston, NYC, and Philadelphia became large early because of ports and commerce and the South was too hot for large cities then.

Philadelpia was the second largest English speaking city in the world before there even was an America.

DC grew because of the Govt; it was not a good city for commerce because of poor ports prior to recently. Not sure I totally agree with your point
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 03:41 PM
 
7,121 posts, read 3,865,682 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kidphilly View Post
Charleston and St Augustine are as old or older than many others. While there is a point cities like Boston, NYC, and Philadelphia became large early because of ports and commerce and the South was too hot for large cities then.

Philadelpia was the second largest English speaking city in the world before there even was an America.

DC grew because of the Govt; it was not a good city for commerce because of poor ports prior to recently. Not sure I totally agree with your point
So, you don't think the choice to put Philadelphia where it is came from the early settlers? They could have easily pushed all goods to Norfolk and Baltimore. Early settlers chose the area where Philadelphia stands just like they chose NYC and just like the founding fathers chose Washington D.C.

There isn't a city anywhere on the planet that wasn't made by a choice from man.
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 03:46 PM
 
Location: The City
17,992 posts, read 13,311,289 times
Reputation: 5086
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
So, you don't think the choice to put Philadelphia where it is came from the early settlers? They could have easily pushed all goods to Norfolk and Baltimore. Early settlers chose the area where Philadelphia stands just like they chose NYC and just like the founding fathers chose Washington D.C.

There isn't a city anywhere on the planet that wasn't made by a choice from man.

Understood but the physical location of DC made it a very poor choice for commerce early on. Also the location was very defensable because of the location for the capital. DC truly is a city unlike a Norfolk, Baltimore, Philly, NYC etc that really would have never came to be without the Govt, seriously. It is and was an awful port and why the other cities were choosen

DC would absolutely be a shell of itself without the Fed, whereas a city like Philly really would probably be about the same regardless of whether the capital was there for a few years or not; Philly was an important city prior because of commerce and why it grew after and mostly had zero to do with locating a capital there. There was nothing in DC basically before the Capital was placed there. Old Town was probably 10 times the size of DC when they started backfilling the district.
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 03:50 PM
 
Location: roaming gnome
12,397 posts, read 12,556,604 times
Reputation: 5246
DC isn't even a good transportation hub like Atlanta was. All those areas were considered poor up in there, just look at Jamestown. Every other historic city in the U.S. was port driven... Boston, Philadelphia, New Haven, NYC, Providence, Baltimore, Charleston, Savannah, New Orleans... all port cities.

Just look at the maps, look at the diff bt Baltimore and DC.

http://g.co/maps/9awb3
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 06:11 PM
 
7,121 posts, read 3,865,682 times
Reputation: 1205
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidphilly View Post
Understood but the physical location of DC made it a very poor choice for commerce early on. Also the location was very defensable because of the location for the capital. DC truly is a city unlike a Norfolk, Baltimore, Philly, NYC etc that really would have never came to be without the Govt, seriously. It is and was an awful port and why the other cities were choosen

DC would absolutely be a shell of itself without the Fed, whereas a city like Philly really would probably be about the same regardless of whether the capital was there for a few years or not; Philly was an important city prior because of commerce and why it grew after and mostly had zero to do with locating a capital there. There was nothing in DC basically before the Capital was placed there. Old Town was probably 10 times the size of DC when they started backfilling the district.
Agreed. DC was mandated by congress and would not be here if congress didn't select it to be the capital city. It's amazing how far DC has come. It is now a world class city which it would not be if Congress had their way. They are so set on not allowing DC to thrive but they have failed. They didn't want us to build skyscrapers. They don't want us to have representation in this country. The media never shows the actual city, just the monuments. It's almost like they feel like Washingtonians aren't US citizens. Yet, through all of this, we have arose from the ashes of crack cocain, heroin, and Martin Luther Riots to become a world class city. DC citizens are truly resilient. 480 murders and vacant blighted buildings to almost less than 100 murders and thriving neighborhoods. What a long way DC has come when all the odds were against us.
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 07:49 PM
 
Location: Florida
398 posts, read 260,886 times
Reputation: 248
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar View Post
Same can be said for any city. If Philadelphia was not the capital long ago and was not settled, it too would not be in existence. If early settlers had landed in South Carolina and Georgia, Charleston and Savanna would be Boston and New York etc., Jacksonville would be Philadelphia. The center of the country and population would be in the south. That is the problem with talking about what if this or what if that. There is not a city in the nation that wasn't effected by choices people made 400 years ago.
You need to go back to History lessons... Florida for instance WAS settled before the NE... We also need to go back to Colonial discussions... there was no United States man...separate colonies, separate economies...with most money filtering into the commonwealth of England or Imperial Spain/France.
Also plenty of those original cities... guess what EVERYBODY DIED!!! EVERYBODY LEFT!

Hello Jamestown, Hello Lost Colony of Roanoke.

Your posts in this thread make me want to single handedly reform American public education. Your boosterism is borderline you needing to get a psychiatric evaluation.
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 08:32 PM
 
Location: Villanova Pa.
3,854 posts, read 7,726,476 times
Reputation: 1771
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizz0rd View Post

Your boosterism is borderline you needing to get a psychiatric evaluation.
An eye check too while he/she is at it.

Sees things/Doesn't see things that aren't/are there in any comparison to DC.
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 09:54 PM
 
7,121 posts, read 3,865,682 times
Reputation: 1205
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizz0rd View Post
You need to go back to History lessons... Florida for instance WAS settled before the NE... We also need to go back to Colonial discussions... there was no United States man...separate colonies, separate economies...with most money filtering into the commonwealth of England or Imperial Spain/France.
Also plenty of those original cities... guess what EVERYBODY DIED!!! EVERYBODY LEFT!

Hello Jamestown, Hello Lost Colony of Roanoke.

Your posts in this thread make me want to single handedly reform American public education. Your boosterism is borderline you needing to get a psychiatric evaluation.
And this shows your lack of reading comprehension.

Couple things....

The establishment of a city starts when someone lands on that piece of earth and builds a colony. Settlers chose every single piece of land that was colonized in this country. The point of what I said is cities aren't just built willy nilly anywhere, they aren't built out of thin air either. The spot is chosen. What time period it was chosen is not important. You obviously need to slow down when you read since you have trouble comprehending the english language.

Who said anything about Florida? I may have referenced Jacksonville as a port city, but I was not focusing on Florida nor was I focusing on which region was established first or grew faster. I was talking about the choice people made to go to the colonies in America. That's a choice Europeans made while traveling to the new world. Maybe if you slowed down and took a deep breath, you would understand what was actually said.

You are so focused on size of cities and when cities were founded that you missed the whole point of what I said. Cities only grow because people choose to move to them. That is basically all I said. People choose to move to Philly and people chose to move to D.C. They both were created by an original thoughts from someone at some point in time before they were settled.
 
Unread 03-12-2012, 10:03 PM
 
7,121 posts, read 3,865,682 times
Reputation: 1205
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainrock View Post
An eye check too while he/she is at it.

Sees things/Doesn't see things that aren't/are there in any comparison to DC.
Yeah, because people don't throw unwarranted cheap shots at D.C. all the time.

D.C. poster:

D.C. is building a lot and improving on decades of decay.................


Rainrock:

D.C. is sterile and bland............


D.C. poster:

What? Where did that come from.................
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