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View Poll Results: Will Houston surpass Chicago as the 3rd largest city by 2020?
Yes 492 41.59%
No 691 58.41%
Voters: 1183. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-12-2015, 01:50 PM
 
1,564 posts, read 1,125,850 times
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Pyroninja,Now that was funny lmao

TexasTallest,Don't become offended sir,Confederate states just give me a bad taste with all the injustice going on right now,Houston is a great city no doubt but Texas as a state is a thorn in my side .
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Old 08-12-2015, 02:51 PM
 
Location: East Central Pennsylvania/ Chicago for 6yrs.
2,539 posts, read 2,467,330 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yn0hTnA View Post
You speak as if the people who built Houston wanted to shun the coast. Disregarding the fact that the thoughts are not unfounded (annual threat for hurricanes), settlers in the area DID, in fact, see the appeal of the coast; in days long past, Galveston, right on the Gulf, not Houston, was the major city of commerce, an immigration station that was essentially the "Ellis Island of the South." It was on-course to be a major city, but it was struck with the devastating 1900 hurricane. Had that hurricane not struck, Galveston Island would have been the major city Houston is now; think NYC, but with a coastal South flair.
But, the hurricane happened, and the investors that came to the area on the aftermath chose to invest in Houston out of need for protection from the coastal storms. However, if Houston area growth and development is catalyst for such in other parts of the metro, then the coastal areas, including Galveston, can indeed catch on with some of the improvements. The beaches can be fixed, developments made, and revitalization achieved. With the additions of hurricane-resistant building methods, living on the coast can soon be done without fear of coastal storms.

However, I do agree with the fact that Houston made a huge blunder choosing "No-Zoning." However, that in and of itself does not prevent the city from creating an efficient urban environment; in fact, many of the aspects that contributed to Houston's auto-oriented development were borne out of mandatory regulations apart from zoning.
Yes I think Galveston/Houston as one city from Galveston inward. COULD HAVE BEEN LIKE Miami/Miami Beach. LINED WITH HIGH-RISE LIVING. Or even like Chicago's Gold Coast. But Houston still turned its back on its Gulf Shore then embracing it. In part because Downtown is sooooo far inland.

I surely understand and knew why Houston's Downtown ended up 50 mile inland. Because of the major hurricane. But Galveston did not disappear. It rebuilt and RESTORED ITS BEACHES. Now it caters to Houstonians and all Texans. Looking for a escape to a beach and vacation escape without going to Mexico. Houstonians would say... " we can drive to Galveston for its beaches and nearby Entertainment pier".

As my point on Houston neglecting its own shoreline. There really was no action taken to RESTORE LOST BEACHES OVER THE DECADES. Set aside more of the shore FOR PUBLIC USE? Sure there are very nice homes along the coast and areas the public can access.

But when I pointed out Chicago's coast. Besides its better city grid planning and developers had to maintain a level of uniformity in set-backs and sidewalks and the city, its part in streets with curbing.
But Chicago luckily had INDUSTRISLIST making sure INDUSTRY and private use of its shore. BUT ESPECIALLY CHICAGO HAD TO BUILD A NEW COASTLINE. ADDING INFILL ECT.

No Zoning but simpler guidelines... was NOT the better choice with FORSIGHT, PLANNING AND AT LEAST THE CITY KEEPING UP WITH BUILDING FULLY UNIFORM STREETS WITH SIDEWALKS. SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE STANDARD REQUIRED. Would have done a lot for uniformity of street grids. Sadly Houston left Business and politicians also deny it a once planned subway system in the 70s too. It would have been done today and aided more urbanizing the core outward.

But luckily HOUSTON ADOPTED a ordinance for PARKLAND SET ASIDE IN 1916. So HOUSTON it did gain nice Parks created. About H.P.A.R.D.

Anyone who visited Chicago notices Downtown Big Grant Park and New Millennium Park added to it. These Parks were once part of Lake Michigan. The Shore once came to Michigan Ave and its Beaches are man-made and have to be maintained and restored as needed over the years. Now Lake Michigan levels are in a rising cycle and that shortens beaches and increases erosion.

The downtown Park built by infill with a plan that began with debris from the Chicago fire. To a MASTER PLAN FOR ITS NEW LAKEFRONT. BASICALLY ALL GREEN IN THE PICTURES ARE INFILLED OR ADDED RESTORED SHORELINE. ONE RIGHT DOWNTOWN THE OTHER NORTH ALONG THE GOLD COAST LOOKING TOWARD DOWNTOWN.

Shoreline originally came to the older lower buildings in the middle here.⤵



This is LARGE Lincoln Park north of Downtown. ⤵
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Old 08-12-2015, 03:35 PM
 
Location: The Bayou City
3,220 posts, read 3,739,282 times
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Galveston/Houston is definitely not one city, but obviously Galveston is in the Houston metro. I'm not sure how it could have been like Miami beach? there are way too many rivers dumping silt out around the area, making the beaches/water no where near as visually appealing as Miami. besides. that hurricane absolutely ripped Galveston a new one in 1900. Galveston had a population of 38,000 people in 1900. Houston had a population of 45,000. as of the latest census numbers, Galveston has a population of 49,000 people, while Houston clocks in at 2.2 million. you can keep telling us how Galveston "didn't disappear" and "rebuilt", but if you can't see how badly that storm stunted Galvestons growth then i don't know what more to tell you?

isn't the land the world financial center in NYC is built on reclaimed land..? some Chinese city built a huge airport on reclaimed land. and we've all seen what Dubai has done (even if some of it is sinking) with reclaimed land. i don't see whats so amazing about reclaiming a little bit of land in a dense area where available/developable land is so desirable.


you seem to be forgetting about all of Houstons other coastlines.. the bayous that run through the city. Houston has been developing the heck out of the bayous, with the recent focus on a $58 million redevelopment of Buffalo Bayou Parks Sabine - Shepherd Promenade.

also the $480 million Bayou Greenways Initiative..

Quote:
When complete, the greater Houston area will have added 4,000 acres of new and equitably distributed green spaces that can also serve the function of flood control and storm water quality enhancement. We will have also completed 300 miles of continuous all-weather hike and bike trails that will meander through those greenways — an amenity unparalleled in the nation.
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Old 08-12-2015, 04:35 PM
 
Location: East Central Pennsylvania/ Chicago for 6yrs.
2,539 posts, read 2,467,330 times
Reputation: 1483
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasTallest View Post
Galveston/Houston is definitely not one city, but obviously Galveston is in the Houston metro. I'm not sure how it could have been like Miami beach? there are way too many rivers dumping silt out around the area, making the beaches/water no where near as visually appealing as Miami. besides. that hurricane absolutely ripped Galveston a new one in 1900. Galveston had a population of 38,000 people in 1900. Houston had a population of 45,000. as of the latest census numbers, Galveston has a population of 49,000 people, while Houston clocks in at 2.2 million. you can keep telling us how Galveston "didn't disappear" and "rebuilt", but if you can't see how badly that storm stunted Galvestons growth then i don't know what more to tell you?

isn't the land the world financial center in NYC is built on reclaimed land..? some Chinese city built a huge airport on reclaimed land. and we've all seen what Dubai has done (even if some of it is sinking) with reclaimed land. i don't see whats so amazing about reclaiming a little bit of land in a dense area where available/developable land is so desirable.

you seem to be forgetting about all of Houstons other coastlines.. the bayous that run through the city. Houston has been developing the heck out of the bayous, with the recent focus on a $58 million redevelopment of Buffalo Bayou Parks Sabine - Shepherd Promenade.

also the $480 million Bayou Greenways Initiative..
Yes I noted Houston set aside Parkland by a initiative that luckily was not voted down in 1916. and posted a sight about it. But others over the decades like zoning, was seen as too restrictive to free enterprise.

Yes I did know the southern tip Manhattan what is Battery Park. Is landfill. More then that before too I believe. Sadly Lower Manhattan will be most susceptible if ocean levels rise. They got a taste a few years ago with the tidal surge from a hurricane.

Chicago's plan for a in the Lake Airport, to alleviate O'Hare. Was voted down as too expensive without the government, and Environmentalists would have no part of it. I think that was the 80s. A revived Crosstown expressway just two years ago revived, but then buried.

But giving Chicago's always political wrangling. Industrialist in past eras and its multi-millionaires. FOUGHT TO PREVENT FREE ENTERPRISE ALONE AND INDUSTRY decide its rebuilding alone. From building on the Lakefront and Private investors owning it all.

With all the Oil Money over the decades. More should have been done perhaps by Houston's Wealthy Oil Barons? I'm sure they may have done some things.

It took VISIONARIES whose expertise and Industrialist like Montgomery Ward and Marshall Field. To put their money and clout to get THAT DIRTY WORD ZONING PUSHED FOWARD. Then PLANS FOR A NEW LAKEFRONT BE REALIZED AND A MASTER PLAN BY DANIEL BURNHAM used as a model.

Incidentally San Francisco rejected Daniel Burnham's new city plan before the Great quake. Then still rejected as too big, grandiose and expensive after the Big Quake. But SF would be a city of many European style Parks and a Street plan of Boulevards. (you can look that plan up online)

Chicago's Daniel Burnham's original 1909 plans for Chicago.

Chicago did adopt aspects of Boulevards on its street grid and its Lakefront in the Burnham Plan.

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Old 08-12-2015, 06:32 PM
 
Location: Washington D.C. By way of Texas
18,641 posts, read 27,078,190 times
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My order where I wish downtown Houston would sit would be on the other side of the island of Galveston on the mainland. Second would be where either Texas City or Laporte is at on Galveston Bay. Third is where it's at now. I do like the bayous and glad Houston is no longer ignoring them. But Houston could have been a subtropical Bay Area city. Sucks it didn't happen that way.
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Old 08-12-2015, 06:33 PM
 
Location: Houston
152 posts, read 124,473 times
Reputation: 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by NOLA101 View Post
No, you're just making this up.

There is no rich person who is forced to live in an urban environment. Name me a place in the U.S. where there is no suburban environment for rich people, and they are forced to crowd in urban areas.

You can't because you're just making up stuff. Rich people prefer urban areas, hence that's where prices are highest. It's much more expensive to live in Manhattan than in Greenwich, CT, yet both areas are very rich, and both areas are very convenient to job centers.
I know people who work for Exxon in the Houston area, one is in charge of downstream operations for Houston. If you are unfamiliar with the oil industry, then I will help you out, it is huge. He also stood in my wedding. I don't know how much he makes, but it is enough for him to have a place in the heights, a pricey neighborhood that reduces his commute to work, and a house north of kingwood (nice suburb) to get away to whenever he wants.

This is the kind of wealth I am talking about. I assume from your moniker that you are from New Orleans; having lived in New Orleans before, I can tell you there is not this kind of wealth on a large scale there, so maybe it is something you are unaccustomed to seeing.

By the way, he is considering buying a place in the country as well, near Lake Livingston.
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Old 08-12-2015, 06:40 PM
 
Location: A subtropical paradise
2,069 posts, read 2,201,513 times
Reputation: 1329
Quote:
Originally Posted by steeps View Post
Yes I think Galveston/Houston as one city from Galveston inward. COULD HAVE BEEN LIKE Miami/Miami Beach. LINED WITH HIGH-RISE LIVING. Or even like Chicago's Gold Coast. But Houston still turned its back on its Gulf Shore then embracing it. In part because Downtown is sooooo far inland.

I surely understand and knew why Houston's Downtown ended up 50 mile inland. Because of the major hurricane. But Galveston did not disappear. It rebuilt and RESTORED ITS BEACHES. Now it caters to Houstonians and all Texans. Looking for a escape to a beach and vacation escape without going to Mexico. Houstonians would say... " we can drive to Galveston for its beaches and nearby Entertainment pier".

As my point on Houston neglecting its own shoreline. There really was no action taken to RESTORE LOST BEACHES OVER THE DECADES. Set aside more of the shore FOR PUBLIC USE? Sure there are very nice homes along the coast and areas the public can access.

No Zoning but simpler guidelines... was NOT the better choice with FORSIGHT, PLANNING AND AT LEAST THE CITY KEEPING UP WITH BUILDING FULLY UNIFORM STREETS WITH SIDEWALKS. SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE STANDARD REQUIRED. Would have done a lot for uniformity of street grids. Sadly Houston left Business and politicians also deny it a once planned subway system in the 70s too. It would have been done today and aided more urbanizing the core outward.

But luckily HOUSTON ADOPTED a ordinance for PARKLAND SET ASIDE IN 1916. So HOUSTON it did gain nice Parks created. About H.P.A.R.D.
Again, Houston was never built on the direct Gulf coastline to begin with; it was founded upon the confluence of multiple bayous, the major one being Buffalo Bayou, which does open up into Galveston Bay, which in turn opens up to the Gulf. Galveston was the major city at the time, and the people had full intentions to develop it until the hurricane; so, the people in the area did not, in fact, have original intentions to neglect the coast.

The 1900 hurricane was very catastrophic, being a powerful storm striking an island, with no advanced warning systems in place like there is today; that shock surely was etched in the minds of the individuals. Such shock was the turning point that allowed Houston, quite a bit inland from the Gulf, to develop into the major city, and not Galveston.

Even though Houston is a distance inland from the Gulf, it still is quite connected with its shoreline, both at Galveston Bay, and at the Gulf of Mexico; loads of Houstonians go to Galveston Bay to sail, surf, fish, and perform other sea-faring activities. A testament to this fact is demonstrated with Kemah, TX, one of many locales on Galveston Bay, having the third largest fleet of recreational boats in the US:
Kemah Boardwalk - The Fun Never Stops!

Galveston Bay is the second largest producer of seafood for bays in the US; only Chesapeake Bay produces more:
https://www.edf.org/blog/2014/03/26/...ions-oil-spill

And, of course, you have the port, petrochemical complexes, and other economic activities on the coast. Thus, Houston is quite well-connected with its coastline, and has not really neglected it.

I will say, however, that you do have a point, in terms of the fact that connection with the coastline can really be stronger in Houston than it is right now, strong enough to induce a more "recreational beach vibe" into the city; in the past, there were rail-lines connecting Houston's core to the Galveston Bay locales, such as La Porte and Kemah, and those areas used to be nationally known tourist areas, having beaches, along with amusement parks, and constant events from celebrities. However, the petrochemical industry picked up, changing the economy, and that, combined with subsidence, and coastal storms, led to the disappearance of the beaches:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Porte,_Texas#History

Also, many of the beaches, especially at Galveston, use rip-rap in an attempt to stop erosion, but that has only sped up the process, to the point that many areas of Galveston don't have sandy beaches anymore.

However, recently, restoration efforts have been undertaken to bring back the beaches, one cell at a time:
Sylvan Beach | CBI

As the Houston area grows, it can indeed become more connected with Galveston, and we could see a situation analogous to Miami-Miami Beach, or at least Dallas- Ft.Worth.

Beach at southern Galveston Island:
http://imagesus.homeaway.com/mda01/9...ff86634ac.1.10
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Old 08-12-2015, 08:06 PM
 
Location: East Central Pennsylvania/ Chicago for 6yrs.
2,539 posts, read 2,467,330 times
Reputation: 1483
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yn0hTnA View Post
Even though Houston is a distance inland from the Gulf, it still is quite connected with its shoreline, both at Galveston Bay, and at the Gulf of Mexico; loads of Houstonians go to Galveston Bay to sail, surf, fish, and perform other sea-faring activities. A testament to this fact is demonstrated with Kemah, TX, one of many locales on Galveston Bay, having the third largest fleet of recreational boats in the US:
Kemah Boardwalk - The Fun Never Stops!

Galveston Bay is the second largest producer of seafood for bays in the US; only Chesapeake Bay produces more:
https://www.edf.org/blog/2014/03/26/...ions-oil-spill

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Porte,_Texas#History

Also, many of the beaches, especially at Galveston, use rip-rap in an attempt to stop erosion, but that has only sped up the process, to the point that many areas of Galveston don't have sandy beaches anymore.

However, recently, restoration efforts have been undertaken to bring back the beaches, one cell at a time:
Sylvan Beach | CBI

As the Houston area grows, it can indeed become more connected with Galveston, and we could see a situation analogous to Miami-Miami Beach, or at least Dallas- Ft.Worth.

Beach at southern Galveston Island:
http://imagesus.homeaway.com/mda01/9...ff86634ac.1.10
Nice, sounds Good and the Beach by Galveston looks inviting and Blue/Green waters.
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Old 08-13-2015, 04:23 AM
 
Location: Houston
152 posts, read 124,473 times
Reputation: 136
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasTallest View Post
why won't it feel right? did LA becoming #2 feel right when they first passed Chicago?
My thoughts exactly. Chicago clearly had the title of "second city" But I doubt anyone outside of the upper Midwest truly believes that anymore since LA passed it like it was standing still. Whose to say Chicago could not fall as far as 4 or even lower.
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:31 AM
 
9,701 posts, read 7,260,842 times
Reputation: 9846
Quote:
Originally Posted by steeps View Post
Yes I did know the southern tip Manhattan what is Battery Park. Is landfill. More then that before too I believe. Sadly Lower Manhattan will be most susceptible if ocean levels rise. They got a taste a few years ago with the tidal surge from a hurricane.
No, Battery Park isn't landfill. It's part of the original island.

And Manhattan is one of the least susceptible parts of NYC to rising ocean levels. Manhattan has higher elevation than much of the rest of the region.
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