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View Poll Results: Will Houston surpass Chicago as the 3rd largest city by 2020?
Yes 492 41.55%
No 692 58.45%
Voters: 1184. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-15-2008, 09:49 AM
 
Location: Katy-zuela
4,852 posts, read 8,999,050 times
Reputation: 2364

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Quote:
Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
It is the METROPOLITAN AREA that counts here, not the arbitrary line that is used to determine city limits. Houston city limits is proportially massive in area, and is far, far, far less densely populated than Chicago. Chicago's metro population is approaching 10 million, while Houston's is considerably smaller.
The Census Bureau considers the Bay Area to be 2 different metropolitan areas even though they are next to each other and receive the same television and radio signals. That's why DFW is the 4th largest metro instead Talk about arbitrary! With metropolitan areas, it's just pick and choose which counties even if they are large in land area (such as SoCal's counties. Do you expect Needles in SB county and Palm Springs in Riverside to be part of LA?).

Quote:
Of course, measuring population doesn't tell you much. Chicago's is by far one of the most diverse economies on earth, and it continues to gain ground as a global financial center. It is consistently ranked among the 10 most important economic centers on the planet (I'll be glad to provide sources on request), consistently even outranking Los Angeles, which has nearly 1 million more people.
Nobody pays attention to CME/CBoT when talking about commodity prices. (It's actually NYMEX.) What up-and-coming financial center? The financial crisis is focused on New York and not a peep is heard from Chicago. How about the banks? BoA is integrating LaSalle the day after tomorrow and most of the banking activity (outside NYC) is located in Charlotte.

Quote:
Sorry, but despite your lofty ambitions, Houston comes nowhere near Chicago; and among those ranking global centers of commerce, it's not even on the map. Metro Houston should consider surpassing Atlanta, the Bay Area, Metro Boston, DC/Baltimore, and perhaps even Los Angeles before comparing itself to Chicago.
LA? LA has greater economic activity than Chicago. It accounts for half of California's output. The Port of LA/Long Beach is a serious competitor to the Port of Houston. Does Chicago have a port or is the lake merely ornamental? Illinois' output surely doesn't outmatch California especially with one city doing all the work.

If you think the California is part of the stereotypical Wild West, it's probably because of the Midwestern isolation. Chicago is Custers' Last Stand for the whole Midwest since the other major cities (St. Louis, Detroit, Cleveland, Milwaukee) are s***ty and there isn't much competition even in Illinois.

Quote:
And Chicago's lead will not change any time soon. Year after year the Chicago metro gains new corporate facilities faster than any other in the Unites States (ready to post a source when asked) and the city does remarkably well competing against sunbelt cities for corporate headquarters. It has beaten out Dallas twice for large corporate HQ, pulled a large healthcare REIT HQ from Louisville, Kentucky, grabbed the north American HQ of the world's largest steel behemoth, the north American HQ of the world's largest environmental services corporation, become the global center of what has been the fastest growing financial industry (electronic derivatives & energy/precious metals trading--over a quadrillion dollars traded annually in recent years), and now Mead Johnson (large nutritional supply company) is likely to move its HQ there. That's just the major stuff, and most of what I mentioned above has taken place in the past 6 months.
Why would I care about companies I have never heard of? The well known companies are located in the suburbs instead of in The Loop. I wonder how The Loop stays busy if the big companies are in the suburbs. The small companies explain it.

Sears moved to Hoffman Estates from their famed tower (oops!), Walgreens moved to Deerfield, Discover Card is in Riverwoods, Allstate in Northbrook, Motorola is in Schaumburg, OfficeMax in Naperville, and McDonalds in Oak Brook.

But the some of the companies in Chicago are outmoded. I haven't seen Motorola phones widely available in a while. McDonalds has the greasy reputation. Sears is...never mind.
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Old 10-15-2008, 11:53 AM
 
Location: LaSalle Park / St. Louis
570 posts, read 1,814,526 times
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Nice post Kerr but...while Chicago has slipped in some criteria behind LA, Houston is nowhere Chicago in terms of power and prestige, period
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Old 10-15-2008, 12:00 PM
 
11,177 posts, read 22,388,331 times
Reputation: 10924
Quote:
Originally Posted by KerrTown View Post
The Census Bureau considers the Bay Area to be 2 different metropolitan areas even though they are next to each other and receive the same television and radio signals. That's why DFW is the 4th largest metro instead Talk about arbitrary! With metropolitan areas, it's just pick and choose which counties even if they are large in land area (such as SoCal's counties. Do you expect Needles in SB county and Palm Springs in Riverside to be part of LA?).



Why would I care about companies I have never heard of? The well known companies are located in the suburbs instead of in The Loop. I wonder how The Loop stays busy if the big companies are in the suburbs. The small companies explain it.

Sears moved to Hoffman Estates from their famed tower (oops!), Walgreens moved to Deerfield, Discover Card is in Riverwoods, Allstate in Northbrook, Motorola is in Schaumburg, OfficeMax in Naperville, and McDonalds in Oak Brook.
That's why they have CSA's, to bring together metro areas that are obviously inner-connected.

New York 22 million
Los Angeles 17.8 million
Chicago 9.8 million
Washington DC 8.2 million
Boston 7.4 million
San Fran 7.3 million
Dallas 6.5 million
Philadelphia 6.4 million
Houston 5.7 million



As far as companies, they've been moving to suburbs in cities for years because they're much cheaper to do business. Many moved from Chicago, but it's not like:

Accenture
Aon
Boeing
CNA
Encyclopedia Britannica
Hyatt
Playboy
True Value
United Airlines
US Cellular
Wrigley

...aren't still in the downtown area. Along with dozens of other companies. Boeing and United Airlines are actually new to downtown. United use to be in the burbs. There are over 500,000 people working in the central business district of Chicago, the Loop. It's not like companies are in the burbs cause downtown is "icky". It's cheaper and easier to park. Downtown is definitely as healthy as it's ever been.
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Old 10-15-2008, 01:37 PM
 
Location: Dorchester
2,602 posts, read 4,321,698 times
Reputation: 1082
It could be a regional thing here in the northeast/midwest corridor but Chicago is considered a magnet city and Houston isn't even on anyone's radar.

Like I said though, that could be regional.
I'm sure Houston is a magnet city across the southern belt. But then again, maybe not
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Old 10-15-2008, 03:05 PM
 
492 posts, read 1,018,979 times
Reputation: 362
Here are some basic statistics that show that Houston as an independent city, who do not have to deal with too many bureaucracies (other cities or states) can really thrive.

Per Capita GDP

San Jose-San Francisco-Oakland, CA ..........$65,804
Houston-Baytown-Huntsville, TX ..............$61,038
Washington-Baltimore-Hagerstown, DC-MD-VA-WV $60,864
New York-Newark-Bridgeport, NY-NJ-CT-PA .....$58,427
Seattle-Tacoma-Olympia, WA ..................$56,217

Top 10 U.S. Metropolitan Area Exports 2006

1 New York-Northern New Jersey-Long Island, NY-NJ-PA ......$66,228,887,963
2 Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown, TX ..........................$53,280,990,686
3 Los Angeles-Long Beach-SantaAna, CA .....................$48,718,100,044
4 Seattle-Tacoma-Bellevue, WA .............................$46,309,174,478
Largest MSA in the u.s.


3 Chicago–Naperville–Joliet IL–IN–WI 9,524,673
4 Dallas–Fort Worth–Arlington TX 6,145,037
5 Philadelphia–Camden–Wilmington PA–NJ–DE–MD 5,827,962
6 Houston–Sugar Land–Baytown TX 5,628,101
10 Boston–Cambridge–Quincy MA–NH 4,482,857
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Old 10-15-2008, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Hell's Kitchen, NYC
2,271 posts, read 4,531,826 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomDot View Post
It could be a regional thing here in the northeast/midwest corridor but Chicago is considered a magnet city and Houston isn't even on anyone's radar.

Like I said though, that could be regional.
I'm sure Houston is a magnet city across the southern belt. But then again, maybe not
Most people don't think about Chicago in Houston, but there are a lot of transplants from there. At the very least, Houston is a job magnet, so yeah maybe it is a northeast/midwest corridor thing.
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Old 10-15-2008, 09:55 PM
 
Location: Katy-zuela
4,852 posts, read 8,999,050 times
Reputation: 2364
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago60614 View Post
That's why they have CSA's, to bring together metro areas that are obviously inner-connected.

New York 22 million
Los Angeles 17.8 million
Chicago 9.8 million
Washington DC 8.2 million
Boston 7.4 million
San Fran 7.3 million
Dallas 6.5 million
Philadelphia 6.4 million
Houston 5.7 million
A proper CSA for SF Bay would include Sacramento and exclude it in the MSA while keeping San Jose for both.

Quote:
As far as companies, they've been moving to suburbs in cities for years because they're much cheaper to do business. Many moved from Chicago, but it's not like:

Accenture
Aon
Boeing
CNA
Encyclopedia Britannica
Hyatt
Playboy
True Value
United Airlines
US Cellular
Wrigley

...aren't still in the downtown area. Along with dozens of other companies. Boeing and United Airlines are actually new to downtown. United use to be in the burbs. There are over 500,000 people working in the central business district of Chicago, the Loop. It's not like companies are in the burbs cause downtown is "icky". It's cheaper and easier to park. Downtown is definitely as healthy as it's ever been.
Mayor Daley should make attracting some of those Fortune 500 companies into The Loop one of his biggest priorities since the city limits are so small.

Recently in Houston, there are new office buildings constructed between Park Ten and the "Energy Corridor" (I consider Smith/Louisiana streets in DT Houston the real Energy Corridor.) for energy companies. KBR has decided to move to the Katy suburbs, west of Park Ten, on a site at the junction of two major freeways. In Chicago, this would be in a village or a suburban city and would be a detriment to the City of Chicago and the Chicagoland traffic patterns (many workers who cannot use Metra anymore). But in Houston they can be annexed by the city at anytime (if the Texas legislature doesn't change the rules). After seeing those projects, I started getting concerned that DT Houston may have a harder time looking like The Loop and realized that in other cities the central city would have a loss and the suburbs would gain.

To park? I thought Metra solved most of that problem. All these plans for tollways (read: privatization--the Great Texas land-grab and sell-off) seem to perpetuate a policy that hurts the average person with high gas prices. Houston needs to have a commuter train but demagogues like John Culberson keep it from happening. (I'd like to point out to everyone about the Fiesta grocery store that John chased out down the freeway to the Katy suburbs--my neighborhood--and the 5 or so homeowners who got condemned to expand the freeway. I bet they aren't Culberson supporters if they still live in 7th District.)
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Old 10-16-2008, 01:35 PM
 
Location: from houstoner to bostoner to new yorker to new jerseyite ;)
4,085 posts, read 11,456,702 times
Reputation: 1942
Quote:
Originally Posted by theSUBlime View Post
Most people don't think about Chicago in Houston, but there are a lot of transplants from there. At the very least, Houston is a job magnet, so yeah maybe it is a northeast/midwest corridor thing.
Yeah, and the thing is that kinda works both ways. People in Houston don't think or talk about Chicago much either. I think it's like that all over the country, with the possible exception of the biggies like NYC and L.A. that everyone talks about. Other than that, you mostly think about the cities nearest you. Oh, and I just met a Chicago transplant here yesterday! She's an academic who took a job at a university here. Chicago was where she'd lived most recently anyway. She was from somewhere else originally... I forgot where.
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Old 10-16-2008, 01:50 PM
 
Location: Lake Arlington Heights, IL
5,481 posts, read 10,405,917 times
Reputation: 2794
We tried to move from Chicago area to Houston area this summer, but job offer fell through. Houston area has a lot going for it, low cost of living, pro-growth government, less tax heavy government, milder climate. But Chicago area still continues to add more people and jobs than it loses. So I don't think Metro Chicago will lose #3 to Metro Houston anytime soon. I do see where city proper, Houston may annex surrounding unincorporated areas and become #3.
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Old 10-16-2008, 05:00 PM
 
Location: Phoenix metro
20,005 posts, read 69,434,810 times
Reputation: 10115
Quote:
Originally Posted by cubssoxfan View Post
We tried to move from Chicago area to Houston area this summer, but job offer fell through. Houston area has a lot going for it, low cost of living, pro-growth government, less tax heavy government, milder climate.
Ahem

Milder winter climate.

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