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San Francisco and the Bay Area are the second best city/area/place in the United States. After seeing all of close the "competition" for it in North America this year in Chicago, Los Angeles, Toronto, and Washington; I firmly believe it's a top two place.
To take it even further, I was genuinely impressed with the Bay Area increasingly outside of San Francisco too. Anyone that says Oakland is dangerous in the core areas that matter is a liar, anyone that thinks San Jose is just a suburb is a liar. Though who would care what a trailer trash from nowhere-of-significance has to say about it anyway, not like they could afford to live in near-perfection like that. That climate, that setting, that scenery, that cuisine, that culture, that progressive environment. The city is cleaner now than it's ever been. It's better now than it's ever been in it's history, period.
That being said, New York for me. It's my favorite city in the world and in my eyes, it is the world's top city, if any competition exists, it is London and Tokyo and that is it in my opinion.
It's so odd how much your opinion changes...like the wind. A year ago, weren't you one of those people who didn't care too much for the Bay Area and had a love affair with Toronto, Miami, and NYC? Now you're saying it's 2nd place.
It's so odd how much your opinion changes...like the wind. A year ago, weren't you one of those people who didn't care too much for the Bay Area and had a love affair with Toronto, Miami, and NYC? Now you're saying it's 2nd place.
Yes, my opinion on where San Francisco ranks if we asked what are the best cities in the country has definitely now think it's second, no, that doesn't mean I think it's the second most important (which is Los Angeles), or the second prettiest urban streetscape (which is Chicago), but I think it's the second best city/most dynamic city in America after New York. How could I not? What does San Francisco lack to anywhere not named New York?
Also, you are mistaking my preferences with what I think are just the best cities. I prefer Miami to San Francisco, that is my preference. I like it more as a place to live, but I think San Francisco is a better city. I prefer Toronto (or Chicago, Los Angeles, Washington DC) to San Francisco, that is my preference in cities to live in but I still think of San Francisco as the better city.
h to be clear; Miami, New York, and Vancouver are the only cities on this side of the world that I could ever love being in long-term. Beyond that point, for me, it's just picking with the more comfortable option for m, nothing more or less.
I think San Francisco is incredible, I am very happy to have people close to me there, both friends and family alike, as I would absolutely love nothing more than seeing that city again, and again, and again, for years to come.
Still, New York is my favorite world city and Miami is my favorite living environment (warmth in America, a year-round rarity).
Also, I am very open to changing opinions. I react to my last full experience anywhere, this time, San Francisco stood out spectacularly. It impressed me and I used to be a major critic of the place.
Also, you are mistaking my preferences with what I think are just the best cities. I prefer Miami to San Francisco, that is my preference. I like it more as a place to live, but I think San Francisco is a better city. I prefer Toronto (or Chicago, Los Angeles, Washington DC) to San Francisco, that is my preference in cities to live in but I still think of San Francisco as the better city.
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I find your takes on cities interesting, but you can be a bit confusing in your assessments. Above you say you prefer several cities to San Francisco - including Washington DC. But a while ago you wrote this about DC, which was absolutely scathing:
"I hated life in Washington DC.
I hated almost everything about it after the first four months to six months of being there. It was not worth living in. I could not get used to the climate, would suffer from skin disruptions and rash most of the winter months, would have to spend much of my time indoors due to that and miss long stretches of time at work. I mean I wouldn't care about climate so much if I felt like I lived somewhere that counter-balanced the depression with things going for it, Washington DC did not fit the bill for that. In spring and autumn, my eyes, throat, nose, and ears would be inflamed, as Washington has to be one of the worst places to live in if you have allergies. I hated how violent the city was, only city I have ever lived in where I felt like I was on the verge of being robbed every single time I got on Metro, and eventually it led up to not ever using public transit again after I actually WAS robbed on Metro and just having to use the car for everything. The parking situation is a piece of (expletive), the Capital Beltway and major road networks in Northern Virginia were essentially surface parking lots, the city is small and almost entirely chain ridden right in it's mother-effin core. Washington is expensive as hell for what you get, which isn't much. The only thing the place has going for it, in my personal opinion, is the high paying government jobs..."
I started a dot com in SF. Basically the embodiment of the cliche of dot com start-up kids. So that's my bias established.
I don't love either place but SF wins in every category I could possibly imagine.
NYC offers nothing for straight people with money in 2014. It's the single most over-rated city in the world in my opinion, and I don't mean that in any hyperbolic sense. I mean it quite literally.
The NYC that guys 10 years older than me describe sounds exciting, amazing, rare. In 2014 it is none of those things.
SF has agreeable weather, stunning beauty (both in the city and weekend trips in any direction offer some of the most beautiful landscape in our world), intelligent, rare intellects in droves, truly unique people, etc. Lots of flaws ( I don't live there anymore for a reason) but it's a special place.
Weekend trips for the dot commers would be to head up north, hit the French Laundry, explore wine country and cab it back to a hotel overlooking the rugged Norcal coast. Wake up hungover, go further to humbolt and meet people living in a completely different universe for a day. Then head home. Add in a trip to one of the worlds great tracks, Laguna Seca, on occasion.
The next weekend go south. Explore SOCAL in a convertible driving along the beach the entire trip. Canyon carve in a sports car, hit the big spots, the beaches, then head home.
NYC...well it's too cold or too humid to want to be outside most of the time. Go outside the city and you mind find yourself suicidal. The roads awful. The traffic is awful. The people are rude; not "in a hurry" because they are ambitious and hustling like the 90's, just rude for its' own sake. The restaurants are great but there are great restaurants everywhere...the street food after the bars is better in SF and the fine dining is comparable at the least.
Luxurious party comparison for rich young people?
Rooftop bars in the meat-packing district, freezing your balls off with kids who aren't employed talking about some french designer who is "totally hot right now?" Maybe a couple young E-bankers in the corner smoking cigars, trying to get laid?
Condos overlooking the Pacific, smoking legal pot, hanging out with entrepreneurs, talking politics, new tech, business ideas?
That's the rough difference in vibe in my experience.
I guess you can go down to time square and take some pictures of stuff?
New York is Disney World with bad weather and 10% income tax. Gays and unemployed, trust fund Europeans seem to think it's OK, though.
Last edited by goingforarip; 01-09-2015 at 01:49 AM..
Are you really disputing IRS data and suggesting a random marketing firm has a more accurate grasp of wealth and earnings than the IRS? Those numbers are pulled directly from IRS data and released by the California and New York Department of Finances. Oh, 18Montclair, you've really stooped to a new low. No one, not Wealth X nor whatever other survey you pull out from your bag of tricks, can track every last penny you've earned in a more militaristic and precise way than the IRS.
And these are the facts, from the God of sources as far as we're concerned:
$1MM+ earners, IRS
Manhattan: 18,952
Bay Area (9 counties). 17,773
Rich people live in NYC because they have to. That's where Goldman Sachs is. It's where xyz is, etc.
People leave as soon as they have "FU" money, in my experience.
I like SF, too. But at the end of the day, NYC > SF. Lol at 18Montclair disputing the IRS. The levels this guy will stoop to to prove a point
Agreed,
When I read many SF booster bloggers on this thread about how SF is suppose to be very LIBERAL, but it is flawed. YES, many SF firms allow its employees to dress informal & laidback attire on the job so the SF populace, who just wants to retaliate against the mainstream corporate world to be fair enough. However, when you live in the SF neighborhoods after you're done from work; thus, the SF residents will judge you very carefully by what your political & social perspectives: abortion (I support), affirmative action (I don't support), death penalty (I support), LGBT & women rights (I support), socialism (I don't support), etc. If you don't agree with them above on everything then you're an outcast. The SF residents will act very PASSIVE AGRESSIVE & find a way to force you on their social & political beliefs down into your throat. Furthermore, they'll figure out a way to make you move from the neighborhood. At the same time, they'll write things down on your door, slide it under, or place objects to be way out of line. Sadly this is when political correctness goes wrong.
I can't wait for the SF booster bloggers to reply dirty text comments against me on this thread.
I started a dot com in SF. Basically the embodiment of the cliche of dot com start-up kids. So that's my bias established.
I don't love either place but SF wins in every category I could possibly imagine.
NYC offers nothing for straight people with money in 2014. It's the single most over-rated city in the world in my opinion, and I don't mean that in any hyperbolic sense. I mean it quite literally.
The NYC that guys 10 years older than me describe sounds exciting, amazing, rare. In 2014 it is none of those things.
SF has agreeable weather, stunning beauty (both in the city and weekend trips in any direction offer some of the most beautiful landscape in our world), intelligent, rare intellects in droves, truly unique people, etc. Lots of flaws ( I don't live there anymore for a reason) but it's a special place.
Weekend trips for the dot commers would be to head up north, hit the French Laundry, explore wine country and cab it back to a hotel overlooking the rugged Norcal coast. Wake up hungover, go further to humbolt and meet people living in a completely different universe for a day. Then head home. Add in a trip to one of the worlds great tracks, Laguna Seca, on occasion.
The next weekend go south. Explore SOCAL in a convertible driving along the beach the entire trip. Canyon carve in a sports car, hit the big spots, the beaches, then head home.
NYC...well it's too cold or too humid to want to be outside most of the time. Go outside the city and you mind find yourself suicidal. The roads awful. The traffic is awful. The people are rude; not "in a hurry" because they are ambitious and hustling like the 90's, just rude for its' own sake. The restaurants are great but there are great restaurants everywhere...the street food after the bars is better in SF and the fine dining is comparable at the least.
Luxurious party comparison for rich young people?
Rooftop bars in the meat-packing district, freezing your balls off with kids who aren't employed talking about some french designer who is "totally hot right now?" Maybe a couple young E-bankers in the corner smoking cigars, trying to get laid?
Condos overlooking the Pacific, smoking legal pot, hanging out with entrepreneurs, talking politics, new tech, business ideas?
That's the rough difference in vibe in my experience.
I guess you can go down to time square and take some pictures of stuff?
New York is Disney World with bad weather and 10% income tax. Gays and unemployed, trust fund Europeans seem to think it's OK, though.
I too experienced the Dot Com during the late 1990s (rise) & early 2000s (fall) when I lived in SF at the time, but where is it now?
No offense, but I never found the Dot Comers to be very impressive & intelligent. They tend to be very conformists, entitlements, superficials, & textbook intelligence when I worked as a bldg. security officer in a couple dot com firms (WebVan & Jackson/Front Street). While I attended college at CCSF around the time. Unfortunately the Dot Com Industry caused the COL in SF to be overpriced.
What does NYC gays & unemployed, trust fund Euros seem to think it's ok, though statement?
FYI,
I'm not gay, but the NYC gays have class to be very depth, intelligent, & successful than the SF gays to be very anarchist, political correctness, insecurity, etc. Trust fund Euros? Yeah I laugh at them when they state such anti-capitalist nonsense w/o having to work. I stay away from them. Many gold diggers take advantage of them anyway. No friendship lost there. Unemployed? You meant to text about the massive homeless bums in SF? Since they receive the largest welfare checks in the US; therefore, they have such entitlement rights to physically or verbally insult you w/o being arrested by the SFPD. Moreover, they can file a class action lawsuit against you criminally & financially if you try to defend yourself. YES, this is when the SF political correctness goes wrong.
Rich people live in NYC because they have to. That's where Goldman Sachs is. It's where xyz is, etc.
People leave as soon as they have "FU" money, in my experience.
Yeah, but if you do some historical research between NYC vs. SF. NYC was known as New Amsterdam (Dutch Colony) in the 1600s to be commercially developed & SF was a Spaniard Missionary in the 1700s, but it didn't commercially develop until the 1850s during the Gold Rush Era. Glad NYC is the economical & cultural center of the nation & globe than SF b/c of its political correctness & socialist utopia not to comprehend by how capitalism is truly function.
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