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Old 04-23-2014, 10:07 PM
 
Location: Toronto
12,581 posts, read 10,464,285 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Well yes, I've been to a lot of Asian and European cities and with a few exceptions, like NYC, they easily win for overall city vibrancy/busyness. Actually some of the worst/densest crowds I have ever experienced in my life were actually in Milan on a Saturday afternoon during Christmas shopping. It was fighting through crowds for what seemed like ages. I swear, it was more intense than anything I experienced in NYC, London or Hong Kong.

I'll be going to Japan in October so will be keen to see how Tokyo compares.
Interesting experience in Milan! I haven't been but definitely want to well - not so sure about at Christmas for safety reasons apparently ...I'd imagine Tokyo will be crazy!! In my travels i'd say Bangkok and Cairo had the most intense general pedestrian vibrancy I've ever experienced. Aside from overall size, incredible density and pedestrian vibrancy I found cities with lots of street vendors add tons to how lively a place feels and in that regard Bangkok has it going on in spades.. Mind you, I'm not sure i'd be happy with the relative income living as a street side vendor but they sure make a place fun. Plus of course, quick, cheap and easy access to a Thai Massage as well.
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Old 04-23-2014, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Prince George's County, Maryland
6,212 posts, read 7,050,681 times
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Toronto looks like a very urban city and one of the great metropolises in the Western Hemisphere, let alone North America. However, there is the monster that is the D.F. or Mexico City on the southern part of the continent. Would love to visit both (so happy I finally got my passport last year )!
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Old 04-23-2014, 10:21 PM
 
Location: Pasadena, CA
9,832 posts, read 7,335,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f1000 View Post
Ya, the crowds, density, bustle and vibrancy in the biggest Asian and European cities are completely different league than all of the North American cities except NYC.

However for the context of the continent, Toronto certainly packs punch in urbanity.
I'm pretty sure Mexico City and Guadalajara can more than keep up.
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Old 04-24-2014, 01:56 AM
 
1,108 posts, read 1,823,313 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atticman View Post
Sorry, but that's just silly. All that happened in 1998 was that Toronto went from being a two-tiered 240 sq. mi municipality of 6 boroughs called Metropolitan Toronto to being a single tier municipality called the City of Toronto. The municipal borders, density and population were exactly the same the day before and after the amalgamation. The current density of the 240 square mile city is roughly equal to the density of the city of Chicago.

Metropolitan Toronto - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Amalgamation of Toronto - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Before the amalgamation the City of Toronto was more consistently urban and dense. Now it includes huge swaths of suburban areas. It waters the urbanity down.
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Old 04-24-2014, 02:10 AM
 
Location: Upper West Side, Manhattan, NYC
14,304 posts, read 17,964,136 times
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Toronto and Chicago are both urban cities. What you say about Chicago basically indicates that you don't know the city very well. Most of the city is low rise even though there's a number of high rises and parts are pretty urban for American standards. Mexico City is more urban than both of them though and no, it's not in South America.
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Old 04-24-2014, 02:17 AM
 
1,108 posts, read 1,823,313 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Well yes, I've been to a lot of Asian and European cities and with a few exceptions, like NYC, they easily win for overall city vibrancy/busyness. Actually some of the worst/densest crowds I have ever experienced in my life were actually in Milan on a Saturday afternoon during Christmas shopping. It was fighting through crowds for what seemed like ages. I swear, it was more intense than anything I experienced in NYC, London or Hong Kong.

I'll be going to Japan in October so will be keen to see how Tokyo compares.
Also check out Osaka, Kyoto, Nagoya and, really, any other major or mid-size City in Japan outside of Hokkaido. Where Japan really impresses is the consistency of its urbanity and vibrancy. I've been to downtowns of relatively small cities in Japan and they beat any City in the US except NYC in terms of vibrancy, urbanity, and bustle. A town of 200,000 called Matsue, off the bullet train line, had a large, bustling downtown area with a "red light district", incredibly dense alleyways, buildings packed with shops/restaurants/bars, a huge train station with hundreds of businesses, and people out and about late into the night. And this really is more the rule than the exception.

In terms of the big cities Tokyo's scale is amazing but I actually prefer Osaka.
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Old 04-24-2014, 02:37 AM
 
Location: West Hollywood
2,203 posts, read 4,007,517 times
Reputation: 1714
Quote:
Originally Posted by spicymeatball View Post
Even though Chicago's skyline is much larger than Toronto's, I didn't get the impression that Chicago was extremely urban, more just that it has a lot of tall buildings. I get the same feeling about Seattle.

Toronto just feels very big and important being there, because of its vibrancy, relatively high density throughout the metro and the fact there are high rises throughout much of the city and not just downtown. Also it's the largest city in a huge country which makes it seem more important than it ought to.
Definitely not!

I actually think what you're saying about Chicago (every way you describe it) is how I would describe Toronto. Not very urban, just lots of tall buildings. And Chicago, Philly, Boston, San Francisco (all more urban than Toronto, IMO) have tons of vibrancy, relatively high density throughout their metros, and high rises throughout much of the city outside of Downtown (especially Chicago.... have you even been there???).

Even LA can be arguably more urban and dense in much of the city than Toronto.
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Old 04-24-2014, 02:42 AM
 
Location: West Hollywood
2,203 posts, read 4,007,517 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
I'm curious, do you get crowds like this in Toronto, Chicago, SF.etc?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMGnIG-GX0Q

These are usual shopping crowds, no big event going on...
There absolutely crowds those sizes in Chicago, SF, Toronto, Boston, and Philly. I'm sure other US cities too.
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Old 04-24-2014, 04:25 AM
 
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
382 posts, read 509,907 times
Reputation: 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by orzo View Post
Also check out Osaka, Kyoto, Nagoya and, really, any other major or mid-size City in Japan outside of Hokkaido. Where Japan really impresses is the consistency of its urbanity and vibrancy. I've been to downtowns of relatively small cities in Japan and they beat any City in the US except NYC in terms of vibrancy, urbanity, and bustle. A town of 200,000 called Matsue, off the bullet train line, had a large, bustling downtown area with a "red light district", incredibly dense alleyways, buildings packed with shops/restaurants/bars, a huge train station with hundreds of businesses, and people out and about late into the night. And this really is more the rule than the exception.

In terms of the big cities Tokyo's scale is amazing but I actually prefer Osaka.
I worked in Japan for a while (Tokyo) and I'd agree on what you said with Tokyo and maybe Osaka. But I don't find it particularly crowded like the video Postman has shown outside of the two cities. Even in other bigger cities like Kyoto, Fukuoka and Nagoya. Certainly not to that extend of Tokyo or other dense Asian cities like Hong Kong. Crowded area in those cities are usually domestic tourists. But I agree that the urbanity of Japanese is rather great compared to any North American cities which the level of activities tend to drop off steeply outside of the CBD. Maybe it has something to do with the commuter culture, which is much greater than that of any North American cities.

I think there're some misconceptions of how urban many of the European cities are as well. Alot of them are very suburban and have similar problems with those of the new world so to speak.
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Old 04-24-2014, 05:40 AM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,783 posts, read 15,377,335 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
Interesting experience in Milan! I haven't been but definitely want to well - not so sure about at Christmas for safety reasons apparently ...I'd imagine Tokyo will be crazy!! In my travels i'd say Bangkok and Cairo had the most intense general pedestrian vibrancy I've ever experienced. Aside from overall size, incredible density and pedestrian vibrancy I found cities with lots of street vendors add tons to how lively a place feels and in that regard Bangkok has it going on in spades.. Mind you, I'm not sure i'd be happy with the relative income living as a street side vendor but they sure make a place fun. Plus of course, quick, cheap and easy access to a Thai Massage as well.
Yes...haha...actually Bangkok was quite quiet when I was there, but it was after some big floods, so that might've been it. In a lot of areas I felt like one of the few tourists there, like in the old city, Yaowarat...Sukhumvit, Silom were busier. It's far from the busiest feeling city I've been to overall.
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