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Every day I see tags from Illinois in Atlanta. The crime and weather in Chicago is enough to make a lot of people move.
Except for the fact that Atlanta has a higher crime rate for every major category versus Chicago. Even 2012, which was the highest year in Chicago for homicides in awhile, had a lower rate than Atlanta. 2013 saw the rate drop by over 3 per 100k (101 fewer homicides).
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Look at E. St Louis, Cairo, they look like third world countries. Outside of the loop and posh lakefront, and a few suburbs, Chicago is the pits.
Chicago is not like most of the rest of Illinois and East St. Louis is nowhere near Chicago. Regardless, yes there are bad areas, but all large cities have this. If you look up statistics, you realize that most of the homicides are centered in areas where only about 30% of population lives which is far away from pretty much any good area (except for one area).
Most of Chicago is normal in reality and people who are actually familiar with the city know this. There are many good communities that are not along the lakefront - Lincoln Square, Ravenswood, Bucktown, Wicker Park, Ukrainian Village, Irving Park/Old Irving Park, Dunning, Montclare, Mount Greenwood, Beverly, Jefferson Park, Norwood Park, Edison Park, West Elsdon, West Lawn, Garfield Ridge, Archer Heights, a good portion of Ashburn, most of Avondale, most of Portage Park, etc. Even some of the in the middle places for crime like Belmont Cragin are fine.
And just a few suburbs - is that a joke? Most of the North Shore is pretty affluent over multiple towns/cities not to mention the affluent or semi western suburbs. Most suburbs are fine and very safe. 32 suburbs (Population: 286,796) have median home values of over $500K while Atlanta has 0. Atlanta has 3 suburbs with a median household income of over $100,000/year (Population: 111,591) while Chicago has 56 (Population: 671,316).
Last edited by marothisu; 06-09-2014 at 06:49 AM..
I'm less concerned over state laws and suburban political views. Though it's definitely a plus to have gay marriage in IL. If I lived in Atlanta i'd probably stick to the east side of Atlanta and Decatur which are the most liberal, tolerant part of the area.
I'm more trying to figure out how the populations might be different. I know they are big cities so you have some of everything but overall what's different? For example, are there fratty/preppy guys in Atlanta that aren't in Chicago? Is Atlanta better for African Americans? Is Chicago more laid back? Trying to get a sense of these types of things...
If those were my options, I'd pick Chicago, for sure.
Remember, Atlanta is *IN* Georgia. Outside of Atlanta, you'll find that Georgia is ultra-conservative and extremely religious, even in the Atlanta are suburbs. Quite frankly, if I were you, I wouldn't *dream* of moving to a state as conservative and religious as Georgia, mostly because the population of the state outside of Atlanta and maybe Savannah *drags it down* in terms of progressiveness. Moreover, Georgia offers little to no protections and benefits at the state-level for LGBT folks, meaning that if, down the line, you meet someone and decide to get married, you *can't* in Georgia. You can also be *fired for being gay* and *discriminated against* in housing. I don't know about you, but to me, that *seems* like second-class citizenry.
OTOH, gay marriage just began in Illinois last week, and Illinois was the first state in the union to repeal its sodomy law, so the two states are certainly *worlds apart*. And if you tire of urban living and decide to move to the suburbs (perhaps to raise a future family), chances are good you'll better received in a Chicago area suburb than an Atlanta area suburb. I lived in Alpharetta, GA for six months, and that's not a place I'd recommend a gay family to settle down--at all.
At the end of the day, if you want to be "less-than-equal," then by all means, move to Atlanta. However, if I were you, my decision would be pretty darn clear.
Except for the fact that Atlanta has a higher crime rate for every major category versus Chicago. Even 2012, which was the highest year in Chicago for homicides in awhile, had a lower rate than Atlanta. 2013 saw the rate drop by over 3 per 100k (101 fewer homicides).
Chicago is not like most of the rest of Illinois and East St. Louis is nowhere near Chicago. Regardless, yes there are bad areas, but all large cities have this. If you look up statistics, you realize that most of the homicides are centered in areas where only about 30% of population lives which is far away from pretty much any good area (except for one area).
Most of Chicago is normal in reality and people who are actually familiar with the city know this. There are many good communities that are not along the lakefront - Lincoln Square, Ravenswood, Bucktown, Wicker Park, Ukrainian Village, Irving Park/Old Irving Park, Dunning, Montclare, Mount Greenwood, Beverly, Jefferson Park, Norwood Park, Edison Park, West Elsdon, West Lawn, Garfield Ridge, Archer Heights, a good portion of Ashburn, most of Avondale, most of Portage Park, etc. Even some of the in the middle places for crime like Belmont Cragin are fine.
And just a few suburbs - is that a joke? Most of the North Shore is pretty affluent over multiple towns/cities not to mention the affluent or semi western suburbs. Most suburbs are fine and very safe. 32 suburbs (Population: 286,796) have median home values of over $500K while Atlanta has 0. Atlanta has 3 suburbs with a median household income of over $100,000/year (Population: 111,591) while Chicago has 56 (Population: 671,316).
From Buckhead to Alpharetta and from East Cobb to West Gwinnett is a large uninterrupted block of $100k households.
Dunwoody has been holding down DeKalb as the sole $100k suburb in that County for decades.
The GA 400 corridor can and does go toe to toe with The North Shore. Neighborhoods like Historic Brookhaven and Druid Hills in Atlanta would easily fit in on the North Shore.
Chicago has more wealthy suburbs because it has 4 million more people.
Sandy Springs
Roswell
Alpharetta
Johns Creek
Milton
East Cobb
Dunwoody
Peachtree Corners
From Buckhead to Alpharetta and from East Cobb to West Gwinnett is a large uninterrupted block of $100k households.
Dunwoody has been holding down DeKalb as the sole $100k suburb in that County for decades.
The GA 400 corridor can and does go toe to toe with The North Shore. Neighborhoods like Historic Brookhaven and Druid Hills in Atlanta would easily fit in on the North Shore.
Chicago has more wealthy suburbs because it has 4 million more people.
Sandy Springs
Roswell
Alpharetta
Johns Creek
Milton
East Cobb
Dunwoody
Peachtree Corners
All of these.
I am using census data from 2010, and you can readily find those numbers I quoted online. If you put it in percentages, Atlanta area has a little over 2% of its population belonging to cities where the median household income is above $100K/year. Chicago area is at over 7.5%, so it doesn't matter that the population of Chicago is 4 million more metro wise - the percentage is still 3.5X higher than the Atlanta area.
There may be sections of the Atlanta area that are wealthy - not denying that in the least bit, but percentage wise it doesn't compare to what the Chicago area has. The highest median income place in the Atlanta area is Berkeley Lake at $131,944 median household income. The top for the Chicago area is Kenilworth at $229,792. There are 22 suburbs of Chicago that have a higher median household income than Atlanta's highest (Berkeley Lake). Talking strictly housing prices, there are 2 suburbs which average home prices over $1 Million and another one not far behind at $950K and another at $927K for averages. Atlanta area has none above $500K, while Chicago has 32 suburbs with home prices above $500K. Even if you accounted for COL and took Atlanta at a level of $350K, Atlanta has exactly 8 suburbs with that median home price.
You mention Sandy Springs which has a respectable median home price of $426,800 (ranked 6 in GA) and household income of $65,353 (ranked 43rd in GA). If it were in Chicago, the median house price would rank 40th instead of 6th and the household income would rank 263rd instead of 43rd. Even if you upped that to $90K median HHI, it would rank 86th if it were in IL.
Last edited by marothisu; 06-09-2014 at 04:49 PM..
As a 30 year old gay guy myself, I would never live in a red state, ever. I'm spoiled from living in blue states that have gay marriage (and I'm single) all my life. Even though I'm single and not actively looking to get married, I still prefer to live in a state that has politics that reflect the overall attitudes and values of the population at large. Living in a gay friendly area surrounded by vast miles and miles of anti-gay suburbia and country would make me feel like I'm living in a bubble and I don't like that. I want to be able to go out into the country and STILL feel accepted. Fortunately, I can do that here in New England, where gays are fully integrated in both urban and rural areas all over. That's they way it should be.
The only reasons why places like Atlanta, Dallas and Houston have large gay populations is because, well....those are already huge cities to begin with. In general, the more populated an area is, the more gays there will be in the area. Same goes for straight people.
Personally, I prefer masculine non-scene gay men, which are commonly found in less populated metro areas. I have lived in NYC for a couple years and found that more of the gay men there were rather metrosexual and "gay cultured," which I don't like. Masculine, "normal" gay men are not flocking to big cities for the gay life, for the most part. They just carry on with their own lives wherever they live, because being gay is just a part of who they are and it doesn't dictate where they should live.
Even in a large gay city, after a year or two, you're going to see the same faces over and over again. Everyone has the same idea and wants to go to the hottest bars at the same times. As for the online/Grindr scene, you're going to see mostly the same guys over and over again. And big cities are tougher and more competitive in general, when it comes to dating. Everyone seems to have the "wait for the next best thing" attitude. So, it didn't work out for me.
One last point I want to make is that big cities have very transient populations. If you make a nice circle of gay friends, expect half of them to move out of the city within a year or two. I had many friends when I lived in NYC from 2006-2008, but now, only about 2-3 of them remain.
As a gay guy myself, I think you would be just fine in either metro. I know that I would choose Atlanta mainly because I prefer it's location and weather. Chicago is a great town, though.
Location: Metro Atlanta (Sandy Springs), by way of Macon, GA
2,014 posts, read 5,096,883 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nep321
As a 30 year old gay guy myself, I would never live in a red state, ever. I'm spoiled from living in blue states that have gay marriage (and I'm single) all my life. Even though I'm single and not actively looking to get married, I still prefer to live in a state that has politics that reflect the overall attitudes and values of the population at large. Living in a gay friendly area surrounded by vast miles and miles of anti-gay suburbia and country would make me feel like I'm living in a bubble and I don't like that. I want to be able to go out into the country and STILL feel accepted. Fortunately, I can do that here in New England, where gays are fully integrated in both urban and rural areas all over. That's they way it should be.
The only reasons why places like Atlanta, Dallas and Houston have large gay populations is because, well....those are already huge cities to begin with. In general, the more populated an area is, the more gays there will be in the area. Same goes for straight people.
Personally, I prefer masculine non-scene gay men, which are commonly found in less populated metro areas. I have lived in NYC for a couple years and found that more of the gay men there were rather metrosexual and "gay cultured," which I don't like. Masculine, "normal" gay men are not flocking to big cities for the gay life, for the most part. They just carry on with their own lives wherever they live, because being gay is just a part of who they are and it doesn't dictate where they should live.
Even in a large gay city, after a year or two, you're going to see the same faces over and over again. Everyone has the same idea and wants to go to the hottest bars at the same times. As for the online/Grindr scene, you're going to see mostly the same guys over and over again. And big cities are tougher and more competitive in general, when it comes to dating. Everyone seems to have the "wait for the next best thing" attitude. So, it didn't work out for me.
One last point I want to make is that big cities have very transient populations. If you make a nice circle of gay friends, expect half of them to move out of the city within a year or two. I had many friends when I lived in NYC from 2006-2008, but now, only about 2-3 of them remain.
Instead of saying you could never live in "red states" you probably should've just said you can only live in New England. Referring back to the map I posted earlier, there are several alleged "blue states" where you'd be "Living in a gay friendly area surrounded by vast miles and miles of anti-gay suburbia and country." "Blue states" that are only "blue" because their urban areas are so populated it pulls enough of the vote, even though most of the rural areas in the state are no different are no different than in the south.
Just look. Can we really say "blue" states like Washington, Oregon, PA, Illinois, etc. are any different than Georgia. The same thing applies.
Instead of saying you could never live in "red states" you probably should've just said you can only live in New England. Referring back to the map I posted earlier, there are several alleged "blue states" where you'd be "Living in a gay friendly area surrounded by vast miles and miles of anti-gay suburbia and country." "Blue states" that are only "blue" because their urban areas are so populated it pulls enough of the vote, even though most of the rural areas in the state are no different are no different than in the south.
Just look. Can we really say "blue" states like Washington, Oregon, PA, Illinois, etc. are any different than Georgia. The same thing applies.
I understand your comments. However, the nice thing about being gay in a blue state is that the laws tend to be more gay friendly. It's not the end of the world if a gay person lives in a red state, of course. I've been to red states and spent a lot of time in them and felt comfortable enough. But it's icing on the cake to be able to be around more people who support gay rights.
Atlanta has a huge gay community. I enjoyed it, personally. But I prefer Chicago's, from my experiences there. If I had to describe a few cities' gay communities in one/two words, negatively, I would say:
Atlanta - sugar daddies / queens
Chicago - marriage on the mind (if you're young and not looking to get hitched...)
San Francisco - overbearingly techie
New York - intimidating in all the right ways (well that sucks if you aren't really good looking, successful, and generally awesome, lol)
Los Angeles - trying so hard, but most won't make it; or they'll suck Brian Singer's...and still won't make it, lol
Miami / Ft Lauderdale - what does everyone do for a living around here?
DC - an exact extension of the general population, except gay
There's more to do in a confined area in Chicago's gay districts, which are larger than Atlanta's. In Atlanta, you will find that despite being a cheaper city, there are a lot of guys that somehow can't afford Midtown or intown areas (without that sugar daddy...and they become snobs when someone else leases them a used 3 series and lets them stay at their $350K Midtown condo, LOLOL). You will go to Marietta to a drag show or Gwinnett for a pool party as a result. In Chicago, pick one of 3 neighborhoods and you won't have to leave for gay stuff, and will find yourself leaving merely to explore the rest of the city in a non-gay way. Lakewood/Boystown is definitely the largest gay area in the city, though. I personally find the boys cuter in Chicago (but I prefer a more European look and mentality). Atlanta's gay scene is more diverse (huge black gay scene, more diverse backgrounds).
One thing that is striking about Atlanta is the sheer amount of guys that come from small town backgrounds. Perhaps they were even persecuted in their small GA/southern town. They come to Atlanta and you will hear their story, and I personally think they way overcompensate for their "gayness" (hence queeny / sugar daddy / house boy culture, imo, in the south in general).
Guys in Chicago are kind of conservative (not too much) and come from Midwestern backgrounds, but for some reason that background doesn't result in crazy queens or super fem guys. Maybe their parents disapprove, but still accept them. So you get a guy who was raised in a likely religious, semi-conservative, but *accepting* household. Results in a completely different adult person, I promise you that (proof that accepting, at minimum, is needed in people's lives). Clean cut Midwestern boys (jocks) with good heads on their shoulders; mmm. Watch out, though, they ARE relationship oriented. If you're out to have fun, Atlanta is probably a better bet! Move to Chicago to find your husband.
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