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Quote:
Originally Posted by bballniket View Post
The Golden Horseshoe imo includes CMAs that are (in my very subject opinion) not super connected to Toronto's...I wouldn't imagine that there's a ton of commuter interconnectivity between Hamilton, St. Catherines-Niagara, Kitchener-Waterloo, or Guelph, and Toronto...could be wrong though..
but in the case of the SF MSA and the SJ MSA, they are both VERY interconnected
Well you'd be surprised if we used U.S style measure of interconnectivity which we don't so its a moot point right? I mean great they are connected by highways for trade but they aren't really a connected 'urbanized area' they are connected by highways and trade not any great urbanized connectivity with respectable level of contiguous density - but really that escapes the point of this excercise imo - If we are comparing which areas feel more 'Asian' you need to use comparitive areas/populations.. By all means - pick an Area within the Bay Area CSA that is equivalent to the GTA's 6.1 million (2011 census - 2013 estimates are more like 6.34m) over 7100 sq km (I think that you could get your S.F and S.J MSA in such an area.. It would also be easier to find demographic info for the GTA - we largely don't care about super regions that are geared more towards commuter patters than meaningful urbanized areas.
I'd definitely edit it if I could...but CD isn't letting my edit my OP (i think you can only do that within a certain time period after the post)...but combined the SF and San Jose MSAs have 6,271,052 people of whom 1,631,513 are Asian- so that's ~26.0%. The MSAs together I'm sure are still a MUCH larger area than the Toronto CMA, so still not an apples to apples comparison, but it's better than the Bay Area CSA vs the Toronto CMA.
Canadian CMAs are pretty tightly defined and highly urbanized!
I'd definitely edit it if I could...but CD isn't letting my edit my OP (i think you can only do that within a certain time period after the post)...but combined the SF and San Jose MSAs have 6,271,052 people of whom 1,631,513 are Asian- so that's ~26.0%. The MSAs together I'm sure are still a MUCH larger area than the Toronto CMA, so still not an apples to apples comparison, but it's better than the Bay Area CSA vs the Toronto CMA.
Canadian CMAs are pretty tightly defined and highly urbanized!
Agreed but I think this is about as good as we're gonna get really... Go for it imo
My vote goes to Toronto, but the Bay Area Asian population is certainly nothing to scoff at.
Both metro areas have an enormous Asian population in terms of North American standards. In either of the two places, you can see Asians all over the region, from the downtown core to the far-flung suburbs. I'd even argue that the Bay Area is the most Asian-friendly metro in the United States (Los Angeles is #2 because of its larger Hispanic influence).
Why I think the GTA edges out here is not just because of statistics, but the sheer visibility of Asian Canadians in and around Toronto. There are huge swaths of areas that Asians dominate Toronto; the most notable ones including Chinatown (of course), Brampton, Markham, Agincourt, Mississauga, etc. The Bay Area definitely has its own areas including Daly City, Fremont, Miltipas, Sunnyvale, Cupertino, etc. but compared to the GTA, the Asian culture feel more suppressed in the Bay. This may be due to American culture (melting pot vs Canada's cultural mosaic), or it may be because of the noticeable Hispanic influence in the Bay. Contrast this with some parts of the GTA, where you will literally feel like you're in another country. The Asian culture there is much more pronounced.
y vote goes to Toronto, but the Bay Area Asian population is certainly nothing to scoff at.
Both metro areas have an enormous Asian population in terms of North American standards. In either of the two places, you can see Asians all over the region, from the downtown core to the far-flung suburbs. I'd even argue that the Bay Area is the most Asian-friendly metro in the United States (Los Angeles is #2 because of its larger Hispanic influence).
Why I think the GTA edges out here is not just because of statistics, but the sheer visibility of Asian Canadians in and around Toronto. There are huge swaths of areas that Asians dominate Toronto; the most notable ones including Chinatown (of course), Brampton, Markham, Agincourt, Mississauga, etc. The Bay Area definitely has its own areas including Daly City, Fremont, Miltipas, Sunnyvale, Cupertino, etc. but compared to the GTA, the Asian culture feel more suppressed in the Bay. This may be due to American culture (melting pot vs Canada's cultural mosaic), or it may be because of the noticeable Hispanic influence in the Bay. Contrast this with some parts of the GTA, where you will literally feel like you're in another country. The Asian culture there is much more pronounced.
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Nice comparison! Is the Asian visibility in the GTA more on par with the SF Bay are or with Greater Vancouver?
I honestly didn't know Toronto was so Asian. I knew that the Chinese were scooping up condos similar to Latins buying in Miami, but didn't know that was because Toronto was such an Asian place (thought it was simply because the city was willing to allow that many condos to be put up...unlike SF which restricts development moreso than any other major city in NA).
I do know the Bay Area is about as Asian as it gets in the US (which seems logical given its immense and historical near 175 year old Chinatown and other long-standing ethnic communities such as the two area Japantowns, etc, not to mention its location on the W Coast), so if Toronto in NE Canada is even more Asian, then that is quite impressive! I've heard Toronto has a HUGE Indian population. Are we counting them as Asian? Or are we limiting to Eastern/SE Asia?
I honestly didn't know Toronto was so Asian. I knew that the Chinese were scooping up condos similar to Latins buying in Miami, but didn't know that was because Toronto was such an Asian place (thought it was simply because the city was willing to allow that many condos to be put up...unlike SF which restricts development moreso than any other major city in NA).
I do know the Bay Area is about as Asian as it gets in the US (which seems logical given its immense and historical near 175 year old Chinatown and other long-standing ethnic communities such as the two area Japantowns, etc, not to mention its location on the W Coast), so if Toronto in NE Canada is even more Asian, then that is quite impressive! I've heard Toronto has a HUGE Indian population. Are we counting them as Asian? Or are we limiting to Eastern/SE Asia?
Yep, we're including Indians and other south Asians in the mix as well. What's interesting is that in addition to the large Indian population in Toronto (which seems to be largely Punjabi; interestingly enough, outside of the IT workers in the Silicon Valley, a lot of the Bay Area's Indian population is Punjabi as well- though not to the extent of Toronto), there's a massive Sri Lankan Tamil population in the GTA, mostly concentrated in Scarborough. I think the GTA has almost as many Tamil speakers as the entire United States.
The Bay Area has a pretty large South Asian population- I actually think it's proportionally the largest South Asian population in the US- slightly higher on a percentage basis than the NYC area- albeit with much smaller numbers. But the GTA is as South Asian as a Metro like Dallas is black, which is pretty mindblowing.
On the South/Southeast Asian front, the GTA has a significantly larger Chinese presence (10.8% percent vs 7.9% in the Bay), a slightly smaller Filipino presence (4.2% vs 5.1% in the Bay), a similar Korean presence (1.1% vs 1.0% in the bay), but a much smaller Vietnamese presence (<1% vs 2.5% in the Bay)...so I think when looking at South/Southeast Asians alone they're fairly comparable.
When you include South Asians, Toronto feels entirely different...this is why I feel like Greater Toronto's demographics are kind of similar to those of the Bay Area, but with much of the Hispanic population traded for a South Asian population and the American-born black population traded for a Jamaican population...another way of thinking about of GTA demographics, is similar to Greater London (in the UK) but with 16-17% of the white British ppl exchanged for east Asians.
Toronto has more Chinese, I'm pretty sure. SF/Bay Area has more southeast Asians, but there's a pretty large number in Toronto as well.
I would imagine you'd get more Vietnamese, Malays, Indonesians and Thai for example in the Bay area.. The GTA has a pretty large Flip community but I honestly don't know how that compares to the Bay area in terms of numbers. For sheer number of Chinese though, yes the GTA probably has more and I would definately say for South Asian.
I honestly didn't know Toronto was so Asian. I knew that the Chinese were scooping up condos similar to Latins buying in Miami, but didn't know that was because Toronto was such an Asian place (thought it was simply because the city was willing to allow that many condos to be put up...unlike SF which restricts development moreso than any other major city in NA).
I do know the Bay Area is about as Asian as it gets in the US (which seems logical given its immense and historical near 175 year old Chinatown and other long-standing ethnic communities such as the two area Japantowns, etc, not to mention its location on the W Coast), so if Toronto in NE Canada is even more Asian, then that is quite impressive! I've heard Toronto has a HUGE Indian population. Are we counting them as Asian? Or are we limiting to Eastern/SE Asia?
T.O like S.F has a huge Chinatown (several actually) but as other posters have mentioned there's a massive Chinese population in other parts like Markham, Richmond Hill, Scarborough etc.. This large Chinese population in the GTA predates the latest condo boom!
The Pacific Mall in Markham is the largest indoor Asian (Chinese Shopping Mall in N.A) for example
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