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It's ironic how BayanYankee is insinuating that Northern California Mexicans and Asians "act black" when Southern California blacks, as well as Asians and even Armenians, take cultural cues from Chicano culture. It's only natural seeing as L.A. is predominantly Mexican. Dickies, high socks, Nike Cortez, Pendeltons, lowriders, gang banging; in SoCal, all of these are cultural trademarks pioneered by Mexicans in Los Angeles. Mexicans were doing all these things decades before blacks in L.A. Imitation is the greatest form of flattery. You can bring up zoot suits with Mexican gangs back in the 40's, but that is long outdated. However, current mainstream black L.A. cultural icons dress and look like black cholos (i.e. YG). In the Bay Area, blacks do not gang bang, no real presence of Bloods or Crips, no lowriders, no excessive tattoos, no Crip walking or gang dances, no high socks, Nike Cortez and Dickies as a uniform. The only folks who do that in the Bay Area are Mexicans and off-brand wannabe Asian Crips.
It is an important indicator because it shows
a large degree of cultural integration and
common identity.
Not if theyre already the same race, and how does media incubation make Afrcan Americans integrated into Black Latin culture? I dont see that at all.
In fact, Mexican food is WAYYYY more prevalent from sea to shining sea than any other Latin cuisine, Im almost certain, among African Americans as well.
Quote:
You would think with,
what, 35 million Mexican Americans you'd
have one equivalent of Hosea Chanchez,
Zoe Saldana, Laz Alonso, Lisa Vidal, Rosario
Dawson, etc. But of course, you're not going
to have that because there aren't many
Mexican Americans with substantial African
ancestry.
But Mexicans dont need the patronage of the Black media in order to make a name for themselves in this country since Mexican artists and entertainers are showcased on Spanish language media in the US WAYYY more than any other group.
In fact, Mexican food is WAYYYY more prevalent from sea to shining sea than any other Latin cuisine, Im almost certain, among African Americans as well.
Good point. Probably most black Americans eat and maybe even cook their own versions of things like tacos and enchiladas. Most blacks have probably never even heard of mofongo or chuchifritos. We should definitely be eating more of the latter, however, since Caribbean dishes tend to be much healthier Americanized Mexican food.
Huh? The point was that many come to take on a Black identity in addition to an Hispanic identity. Mexicans can take on a Black identity about as much as I can take on a Filipino identity.
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Originally Posted by 18Montclair
and how does media incubation make Afrcan Americans integrated into Black Latin culture? I dont see that at all.
African Americans don't have to become integrated into Hispanic culture as AA culture was the dominant culture when Black immigrants arrived here. The point is that many Black Hispanics assimilate into a greater notion of Blackness just as Jamaicans, Trinis or Nigerians do (who also come to America with cultures very distinct from AA culture). The thread is titled "Which coast has historically had better Black-Latino relations," not "Which coast do Black people eat the most Latin food," and I'm saying that Black and Hispanic relations have been traditionally better in the East because the two identities have been bound up together to a large extent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Montclair
In fact, Mexican food is WAYYYY more prevalent from sea to shining sea than any other Latin cuisine, Im almost certain, among African Americans as well.
So is Chinese food and spaghetti. In fact, I'm sure St. Patrick's Day is celebrated by more African Americans than any Puerto Rican holiday, which I suppose we should consider as evidence of the strong, harmonious, historical relationship between Blacks and the Irish in Eastern cities.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Montclair
But Mexicans dont need the patronage of the Black media in order to make a name for themselves in this country since Mexican artists and entertainers are showcased on Spanish language media in the US WAYYY more than any other group.
What's the point? How many African Americans are watching Telemundo every day? We're supposed to be talking about the relationship between the Black and Hispanic communities on the East and West Coast, not which culture is more dominant, which we all know is Mexican because there are tens of millions of them compared to the few Puerto Ricans concentrated mostly in the Northeast and Florida.
Last edited by BajanYankee; 03-01-2015 at 04:43 PM..
Good point. Probably most black Americans eat and maybe even cook their own versions of things like tacos and enchiladas. Most blacks have probably never even heard of mofongo or chuchifritos. We should definitely be eating more of the latter, however, since Caribbean dishes tend to be much healthier Americanized Mexican food.
Black people also eat more bagels, lasagna, pizza, shrimp fried rice, etc. Many of the Black people eating these foods don't have any type of relationship with a Jew, Italian or Asian. That they eat food associated with these ethnic groups doesn't say anything about their relationship with them.
Blacks and Puerto Ricans developed a closeness not only because they were poor and lived in ghettos, but also because of a common heritage, which obviously had profound consequences in early 20th Century America. Blacks and Puerto Ricans were historically in close proximity with many different ethnic groups--Italians, Irish, Jews, etc--and today live near a multitude of others, yet they clearly have stronger affiliations with groups that have substantial African ancestry (West Indians, East and West Africans, Dominicans, etc). If there was an ethnic group that made for a natural ally of African Americans, it was the Irish, and for a variety of reasons that relationship never materialized.
From the Schomburg's (Schomburg himself was Puerto Rican) "African American Migration Experience" webpage.
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Other northeastern cities such as Philadelphia, Newark, and Hartford also attracted many Puerto Ricans during this period. A secondary concentration developed in the Midwest during the 1950s, particularly Chicago, Cleveland, and smaller industrial cities such as Lorain, Ohio, and Gary, Indiana. Most of the immigrants were young, male, unskilled rural workers, with little education and knowledge of the English language, and were largely incorporated into the lower rungs of the U.S. economy, particularly in light manufacturing, domestic service, and seasonal agriculture. Because many had African or mixed ancestry, Puerto Ricans were often treated as African Americans and excluded from jobs, housing, and schools.
From the "Puerto Ricans in the U.S." Wiki page, FWIW.
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Puerto Ricans are more likely to be proficient in English than any other Hispanic group, and Puerto Ricans are also more likely to intermarry other ethnic groups, and far more likely to intermarry or "intermingle" specifically with blacks than any other Hispanic group.
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The stateside Puerto Rican community has partnered with the African American community, particularly in cities such as New York and Philadelphia, not only because of cultural similarities, but also to combat racism and disenfranchisement of the mid to late 20th century in their communities as a unified force.
Black people also eat more bagels, lasagna, pizza, shrimp fried rice, etc. Many of the Black people eating these foods don't have any type of relationship with a Jew, Italian or Asian. That they eat food associated with these ethnic groups doesn't say anything about their relationship with them.
Blacks and Puerto Ricans developed a closeness not only because they were poor and lived in ghettos, but also because of a common heritage, which obviously had profound consequences in early 20th Century America. Blacks and Puerto Ricans were historically in close proximity with many different ethnic groups--Italians, Irish, Jews, etc--and today live near a multitude of others, yet they clearly have stronger affiliations with groups that have substantial African ancestry (West Indians, East and West Africans, Dominicans, etc). If there was an ethnic group that made for a natural ally of African Americans, it was the Irish, and for a variety of reasons that relationship never materialized.
I never said that the food we eat solidifies a relationship with any particular group, but it is evidence of some cultural overlap.
As for the actual relationship between Blacks and Mexicans, it has clearly be demonstrated that, in some parts of the country, it does exist. So I have no idea why some posters are steadily trying to insist that the two groups never have anything to do with each other.
I lived in an apartment complex in Houston that was divided between latinos (primarily Mexicans) and blacks (primarily African-Americans but also many immigrants from Africa). The apartment complex had hundreds of units, took up several Houston blocks and had a capacity for over a thousand people. You could get lost just driving through the gated property.
To a statistician I'm sure this apartment complex would get high points for integration. After all blacks and Mexicans were sharing it. But on the day to day to live, everyone segregated.
Blacks hung around Blacks. Mexicans with Mexicans. This was made even more poignant that they shared a space and could easily fraternize. What was striking, and something I didn't put fully together until I was responding to you, was it seemed that when blacks were hanging out in mass I never saw Mexicans and opposite. This could lead you to completely pegging the demographics wrong if you just drove through it once. I'm not sure what the reason was for the behavior, lifestyle or simply avoidance.
That's sort of what I figured. The big reason that endogamic marriage is so high among Mexican Americans is simply because there are so many of them. It's the same way you can have largely Jewish and Italian communities in the NYC area with a high degree of endogamic marriage (same with Irish in Boston); their populations are large enough to maintain some measure of insularity.
Growing up in the Northeast, I never really had much contact with Hispanics other than Puerto Ricans until I lived in the DC area (where most are Central American). While you see some of the younger Blacks kids with Hispanic friends (as well as Asian and everything else, particularly in Montgomery County), it seems that the larger trend is that Central Americans are a bit more like Asians in that they either have their own separate thing or assimilate into White culture. Those in their early to mid 20s are more likely to party at a clubs that play Latin music and EDM (where few Blacks go).
Then there are Ethiopians, which are completely the opposite. Even though they are phenotypically distinct from the average African American, and retain their own language (Amharic), they blend rather seamlessly into the Black social scene. I would say the African American-Ethiopian relationship in the DC area is most similar to the African American-Puerto Rican relationship in NYC. And again, the common thread seems to be race.
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