U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S. > City vs. City
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
View Poll Results: Better relations?
West Coast 28 27.18%
East Coast 68 66.02%
Similar 7 6.80%
Voters: 103. You may not vote on this poll

Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-02-2015, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Miami Beach, FL/Tokyo, Japan
1,699 posts, read 1,479,810 times
Reputation: 699

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by mega man View Post
"CEP"s are less likely to have African blood than PR or Dominicans, right? I would assume that's the reason.
Ecuadorians and Peruvians for sure, Colombians depending on where they're from. If they're from the north, they're part black.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-02-2015, 09:00 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,611 posts, read 24,802,203 times
Reputation: 11185
Quote:
Originally Posted by mega man View Post
"CEP"s are less likely to have African blood than PR or Dominicans, right? I would assume that's the reason.
I believe so. If you look Black, you're generally going to hang around Blacks (people like Tiger Woods being the obvious exceptions to this rule).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2015, 09:02 AM
 
52,631 posts, read 75,477,928 times
Reputation: 11627
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDPMiami View Post
Ecuadorians and Peruvians for sure, Colombians depending on where they're from. If they're from the north, they're part black.
Colombians on the Pacific Coast are Black and same for nearby areas of Ecuador. Look up Choco in Colombia and Esmeraldas in Ecuador.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2015, 09:13 AM
 
Location: Miami Beach, FL/Tokyo, Japan
1,699 posts, read 1,479,810 times
Reputation: 699
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
Colombians on the Pacific Coast are Black and same for nearby areas of Ecuador. Look up Choco in Colombia and Esmeraldas in Ecuador.
What city? Buenaventura?

I went to Colombia, other than the Caribbean coast it's not black.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2015, 01:34 PM
 
Location: ITP - City of Atlanta Proper
7,794 posts, read 11,729,302 times
Reputation: 5394
I haven't (and won't) go through all 16 pages, but definitely the answer is the East coast. As was mentioned earlier, for longest period of time most Latinos in East Coast cities were from countries that had high African (and mixed) populations like Puerto Rico, Cuba, Dominican Republic, Columbia, etc. However, in recent years there has been in a mass shift in Latin immigration in the East that has been dominated by groups more frequently found out west like Mexicans and Salvadorians.

So what's different? A factor that may have been over looked is how the Segregation era both pre- and post- play in to this conversation. Places like California started seeing mass immigration from places like Mexico all the way back to the early part of the last century at the same time they had a huge influx of Black residents from the South started moving West. While there were no official Segregation laws out West (at least not like how it was in the South), a state of sotto voce segregation existed. These groups of immigrants had to compete for jobs and housing against newly arriving Black folks at the same they both groups had to face discrimination.

In contrast, cities in the East like DC or Atlanta (or pretty every city big and small) saw huge increases in the same populations present in the West after Segregation was over. With everything on an (idealistic) level playing ground, the same tensions that cropped in the West in less enlightened times and carried over to the modern era.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-02-2015, 07:18 PM
 
584 posts, read 1,076,851 times
Reputation: 1355
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
So here's a question: is there any Mexican or Central American who has become fully absorbed into the Black American cultural community...and I mean, like to the point where middle aged Black ladies in Alabama and North Carolina are reading about them in Essence or Ebony Magazine?

http://www.essence.com/sites/default...oe-saldana.jpg

Actress Lisa Vidal attends Essence Magazine's 5th Annual Black Women... News Photo | Getty Images

And I'm not talking about someone who's the product of a bi-racial relationship in the U.S. I'm talking about a straight up West Coast Latino. That, in a way, sort of tells you all you need to know about the relationship between the two groups.
What are you even talking about? There is no real "black community", stupid. Blacks from different sides of the same city don't even get along let alone blacks raised in the city and blacks raised in the suburbs. Your thought process is an internalization of white racism that all blacks are the same when they are not. BET was bullsh!t because it perpetrated the idea that all black people are like ghetto black people from the hood. That's like saying all white people are rural white trash and that there is a "white American cultural community" based in these values, when there is not. Blacks from different areas and cities have different opinions on race relations, stupid. And that even varies further from person to person because *gasp* individual black people are individuals just like white people or anyone else.

Bottomline, in Northern California, blacks and non-black Latinos get along fine in even some of the worst ghetto neighborhoods. Why? Because people are too busy trying to survive and help each other out to be divided along arbitrary racial lines created by an oppressive white society. Please, I beg you, go to East Oakland and tell all the Mexicans and Asians out there that they are "acting black" because you will not come home in one piece to your privileged upper middle class bougie lifestyle.

And you going on about Puerto Ricans and Dominicans having black blood is a joke seeing as the majority of Puerto Ricans see themselves as NOT being black at all. 80% of Puerto Ricans on the island define themselves as white. At the very least, PR's and DR's define themselves as Latino first and foremost, but never as black when it comes to a North American historical context. Do you ever hear your favorite Puerto Rican celebrities saying that they are black? No. Whiteness is prized over blackness in Latino culture just like American culture because Latino culture is the biproduct of the same European colonization. I have heard countless Dominicans and Puerto Ricans go out of their way to tell people that they are not black. Blacks are seen as the permanent underclass of American society and immigrants of all races know this and want to distance themselves from blacks as much as possible. That is, unless it makes them look cool. What Paul Mooney said was no lie.

Last edited by LunaticVillage; 03-02-2015 at 07:36 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-03-2015, 01:38 AM
 
Location: Baltimore, MD
3,504 posts, read 2,728,798 times
Reputation: 2688
Yea, I'm late to the party, but I guess I'll contribute, since I happen to be half African-American and half-Dominican from the East Coast.

I can't speak on Texas or the West Coast, outside of what I see on television/rap videos, but here out East, it's a strong relationship for the most part, but with definite fault lines. As has been mentioned, most Puerto Ricans are actually whiter looking (skin color wise; body wise not so much, as they're usually curvier/shorter than whites). Your Tego Calderon types are actually the minority for Puerto Ricans, who tend to skew more John Leguizamo/Jennifer Lopez. Miami Cubans, too, tend to be whiter than African-Americans and Dominicans (think Marco Rubio, Gloria Estefan). Since they're whiter looking on average (still distinctive from I guess 'normal' white people), Puerto Ricans and Cubans are less likely to intermingle with African-Americans than with their own kind, though it does happen more than 'regular' white people. In my opinion, this makes them more nationalistic than Dominicans. They hang out with blacks (and Haitians) but are less likely to intermarry/have kids. Plus, they've both been here longer than Dominicans, and have attained more political and social power.

For Dominicans, it's a bit more complex. Dominicans are darker on average, and are harder to tell apart from African-Americans (though I still think there's a significant difference). 'White' Dominicans like Kimberly Castillo (who's actually of Italian heritage) tend to be the minority. As such, Dominicans do tend to intermingle/assimilate more with African-Americans than Puerto Ricans/Cubans. The complicated part though is that culturally, Dominicans (and Puerto Ricans and Cubans) are very different from traditional African American culture. So a cultural gap remains, if not a race one (see Washington Heights/Inwood vs Harlem/Bed Stuy). There's still friction between the groups. Furthermore, Dominicans have been the worst of the Latino groups with reconciling their African heritage. Trujillo (who bleached his skin, Sammy Sosa style) really did a number on the psyche of the nation, and it's still expressed with the treatment of Haitians. This is why many Dominicans hate identifying as black. Culturally and linguistically, they're really not, and racially, colorism used to run rampant in the Caribbean (Cuba and Puerto Rico included. Most black Cubans, the poor ones, remained on the island). It's an ugly legacy of self-hate.

Nowadays, a lot of the colorism of Puerto Ricans, Cubans and Dominicans has faded away with the newer generations. The longer they've been here, the more they've assimilated into American culture, particularly black American culture, as all groups have been socially marginalized in ghettos with black Americans. It's mainly the older generations and brand new immigrants who do not have strong relationships with African Americans. Most 2nd/3rd generations under the age of 50 are pretty 'tight' with African Americans.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-03-2015, 08:00 AM
 
14,006 posts, read 21,961,418 times
Reputation: 4085
Quote:
Originally Posted by LunaticVillage View Post
What are you even talking about? There is no real "black community", stupid. Blacks from different sides of the same city don't even get along let alone blacks raised in the city and blacks raised in the suburbs. Your thought process is an internalization of white racism that all blacks are the same when they are not. BET was bullsh!t because it perpetrated the idea that all black people are like ghetto black people from the hood. That's like saying all white people are rural white trash and that there is a "white American cultural community" based in these values, when there is not. Blacks from different areas and cities have different opinions on race relations, stupid. And that even varies further from person to person because *gasp* individual black people are individuals just like white people or anyone else.

Bottomline, in Northern California, blacks and non-black Latinos get along fine in even some of the worst ghetto neighborhoods. Why? Because people are too busy trying to survive and help each other out to be divided along arbitrary racial lines created by an oppressive white society. Please, I beg you, go to East Oakland and tell all the Mexicans and Asians out there that they are "acting black" because you will not come home in one piece to your privileged upper middle class bougie lifestyle.

And you going on about Puerto Ricans and Dominicans having black blood is a joke seeing as the majority of Puerto Ricans see themselves as NOT being black at all. 80% of Puerto Ricans on the island define themselves as white. At the very least, PR's and DR's define themselves as Latino first and foremost, but never as black when it comes to a North American historical context. Do you ever hear your favorite Puerto Rican celebrities saying that they are black? No. Whiteness is prized over blackness in Latino culture just like American culture because Latino culture is the biproduct of the same European colonization. I have heard countless Dominicans and Puerto Ricans go out of their way to tell people that they are not black. Blacks are seen as the permanent underclass of American society and immigrants of all races know this and want to distance themselves from blacks as much as possible. That is, unless it makes them look cool. What Paul Mooney said was no lie.
Your last paragraph is the truth. Many don't even want to be Black, unless it benefits their career. Just picking and choosing their blackness.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-03-2015, 08:04 AM
 
14,006 posts, read 21,961,418 times
Reputation: 4085
Quote:
Originally Posted by qworldorder View Post
Yea, I'm late to the party, but I guess I'll contribute, since I happen to be half African-American and half-Dominican from the East Coast.

I can't speak on Texas or the West Coast, outside of what I see on television/rap videos, but here out East, it's a strong relationship for the most part, but with definite fault lines. As has been mentioned, most Puerto Ricans are actually whiter looking (skin color wise; body wise not so much, as they're usually curvier/shorter than whites). Your Tego Calderon types are actually the minority for Puerto Ricans, who tend to skew more John Leguizamo/Jennifer Lopez. Miami Cubans, too, tend to be whiter than African-Americans and Dominicans (think Marco Rubio, Gloria Estefan). Since they're whiter looking on average (still distinctive from I guess 'normal' white people), Puerto Ricans and Cubans are less likely to intermingle with African-Americans than with their own kind, though it does happen more than 'regular' white people. In my opinion, this makes them more nationalistic than Dominicans. They hang out with blacks (and Haitians) but are less likely to intermarry/have kids. Plus, they've both been here longer than Dominicans, and have attained more political and social power.

For Dominicans, it's a bit more complex. Dominicans are darker on average, and are harder to tell apart from African-Americans (though I still think there's a significant difference). 'White' Dominicans like Kimberly Castillo (who's actually of Italian heritage) tend to be the minority. As such, Dominicans do tend to intermingle/assimilate more with African-Americans than Puerto Ricans/Cubans. The complicated part though is that culturally, Dominicans (and Puerto Ricans and Cubans) are very different from traditional African American culture. So a cultural gap remains, if not a race one (see Washington Heights/Inwood vs Harlem/Bed Stuy). There's still friction between the groups. Furthermore, Dominicans have been the worst of the Latino groups with reconciling their African heritage. Trujillo (who bleached his skin, Sammy Sosa style) really did a number on the psyche of the nation, and it's still expressed with the treatment of Haitians. This is why many Dominicans hate identifying as black. Culturally and linguistically, they're really not, and racially, colorism used to run rampant in the Caribbean (Cuba and Puerto Rico included. Most black Cubans, the poor ones, remained on the island). It's an ugly legacy of self-hate.

Nowadays, a lot of the colorism of Puerto Ricans, Cubans and Dominicans has faded away with the newer generations. The longer they've been here, the more they've assimilated into American culture, particularly black American culture, as all groups have been socially marginalized in ghettos with black Americans. It's mainly the older generations and brand new immigrants who do not have strong relationships with African Americans. Most 2nd/3rd generations under the age of 50 are pretty 'tight' with African Americans.
Fresh perspective. Trujillo legacy last till this day in the DR. And skin bleaching is a huge problem all over the greater African Diaspora communities. Sammy Sosa looks like a darn vampire. It's a shame how some Dominicans are so ashamed of their blackness.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-03-2015, 08:17 AM
 
52,631 posts, read 75,477,928 times
Reputation: 11627
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDPMiami View Post
What city? Buenaventura?

I went to Colombia, other than the Caribbean coast it's not black.
Actually, the Pacific Coast is the Blackest part of the country. Buenaventura and Quibdo are about 85 and 95% Black respectively. This isn't even getting into the smaller communities nearby. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GoWAxO9g9hQ

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NRjYKCRoXKc

Afro-Colombian - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Afro-Colombians

Last edited by ckhthankgod; 03-03-2015 at 08:48 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S. > City vs. City
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top