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Old 06-27-2017, 12:55 AM
 
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Philly has a great downtown but Chicago is obviously on another scale.
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Old 06-27-2017, 01:40 AM
 
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Philly has a better and more vibrant downtown than Chicago.
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Old 06-27-2017, 07:45 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays25 View Post
Philly has a great downtown but Chicago is obviously on another scale.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the topper View Post
Philly has a better and more vibrant downtown than Chicago.
But are they safe and suitable for families to live? Do they have good schools, grocery stores etc? It is not a rhytoric question.
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Old 06-27-2017, 08:22 AM
 
Location: In the heights
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
But are they safe and suitable for families to live? Do they have good schools, grocery stores etc? It is not a rhytoric question.
Yes
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:47 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly View Post
Your stats are kinda misleading. The Greater Center City area wasn't as large in the past as it is today when it comes to land area. The CBD and Greater CC population were virtually the same back then.
Didn't I post that two years ago when this thread started? Why bring it up now? It's not a massive stretch to say that "downtown Chicago" is roughly everything from the South Loop and McCormick up to around North Ave. One area I would say is getting away from downtown is that tier up by North Ave, but it's included in the community area of which it is incredibly easy to get population stats as they're official, so in general it's good enough. I'm not trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes.

It's not PERFECT, as there's no PERFECT description of "Downtown Chicago" to draw the stats, but it's damn close.

If anything you're leaving out the areas west of the river into the West Loop, which is very much "downtown" out to around Halsted or Morgan. Swap that area for those up by North Ave and you're still pretty much on target. Everywhere north, south and west in the downtown area is growing like weeds right now.
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:50 AM
 
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^ I posted this recently that looked at it all the way down to census tract levels, pulling in a tighter description of "downtown" keeping it south of Division but including areas directly west of the Loop which are also downtown:

Quote:
If I look at actual census tracts and only include things south of Division, north of McCormick and east of Orleans above the river and including the first sections of tracts west of the river (that's certainly "downtown" to most everyone even though it's technically the West Loop neighborhood) then you get:

2000: 86,223
2010: 118,638

There have been 30,000 housing units built in the city since 2010, and a large majority of them are in the downtown area overall. I would expect that population to increase to around 133,000 or so by 2015.

Much of that area of course is the entire business district of the loop and retail/entertainment district.

If you bring it in even more compact and only look at areas east of the Kennedy, north of Roosevelt and south of Chicago ave (east of Orleans):

2000: 27,972
2010: 52,251

A majority of this area of course is buildings for hundreds of thousands of office workers, all the government buildings and the retail and entertainment areas. I'm actually surprised how many people live there.
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:53 AM
 
Location: The Left Toast
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westburbsil View Post
Wow, I feel bad I contributed to this thread. Yes we took a full day to walk from south Philly to Germantown. Not all bad, some shady areas. We biked as well so that helped.

Getting back to Chicago only CD people would think Philly architecture or downtown is larger than Chicago.

I say this complimentary, Philly feels like a big town, not a fast paced city.
NYC and to me DC is the most fast paced cities in the u.s. DC with its crazy layout and during traffic times is nuts. Chicago is much slower and to me better. Didn't know fast paced= better. Just means a faster pace.

Philly was great, but as a city only people on this forum would consider its downtown nicer or larger than Chicago. More dense streets and no alleys, yes. But who cares?

Oh well, enjoy summer everyone!

Again....It's residential population that the original article spoke of. Also as I stated as Philly continues to build up the waterfronts and Central North Philly with Temple's developments as well as what Penn & Drexel continues to do in West Philly, and a few other key projects with job developments and the demise of the city wage tax will put the city where it rightfully belongs.
It will never be a city of 3 Million as Chicago has, but I can see our recovered loss of 2 Million plus maybe another 250,000 residents will suit out 135 Sq.Mile city just fine. With that said I'm knowing Center City will continually expand and grow with residents because it was originally built that way and continues to enlarge it's footprint.

I don't see how that's a problem with people, because the same posters will come to New York's side when we speak of Trenton-Mercer county being apart of the New York Metro even though it's right across the bridge from Philly. Of course the talk of commuting patterns to and from work, etc; seems to be the justifiable metric used to back up those claims....So with that said, the areas of North & South Philly that surround the core of Center City has taken on those same characteristics as new residents have filled the brownstones in Springarden and Fairmount as well as bringing an influx of new businesses and newly built homes and apartments. Same with the river wards and their 3 story rows, which were just as bombed out as anywhere in North Philly 15-20 years ago.

Most of it's new residents are working in Center City or the hospitals and their biking, walking, or taking a short ride on the El or Sub into CC and surrounding neighborhoods, and if they're working far elsewhere it's still in CC where they've been doing the most of their hanging out, shopping, dining, etc;. So, the expanded area warrants the term "Greater Center City." Kinda like Phoenix and those western cities that have annexed the surrounding towns., and now their populations have continuously grown overnight....& that all seems to just be fine here on CD.

Lastly: I think we are using different metrics as far as what seems fast paced and laid back... When you said DC. I surely knew that was the case. lol
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Old 06-27-2017, 11:14 AM
 
8,222 posts, read 4,418,380 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
But are they safe and suitable for families to live? Do they have good schools, grocery stores etc? It is not a rhytoric question.
There are tons of young children/families in Center City/Greater Center City Philadelphia.
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Old 06-27-2017, 12:56 PM
 
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Again Chicago gets Grant Park, Millennium Park, Maggie Daley Park and Monroe Harbor in Lake Michigan itself in its Census 2-mile radius. . But the CENSUS needs a standard as downtowns and CBD's vary greatly.
Also as mentioned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaton View Post
I love Philly, I really do. But calling Center City a "downtown" paints sort of a misleading picture. Virtually every other U.S. downtown was depopulated during the mid-20th century. Philadelphia not only escaped urban renewal relatively unscathed, but up until a few decades ago the suburbs were the preferred location for office jobs due to the rather hefty commuter tax. Neighborhoods like Old City, Society Hill, and Rittenhouse Square, and Fitler Square are predominantly rowhouse in nature, for example. As such, it had a huge head start on other cities when it came to boosting "downtown" population even higher.
Chicago had to GROW a population in its core from - EXTREMELY LOW live-in population last 40-years. That it did.

River North (part of the CBD) was with abandoned warehousing now filled with Loft living and High-rises to Skyscraper living. Streeterville (again the CBD) huge in high-rise to skyscraper living today and the New East Side totally new skyscraper living over rails air-rights proved highly successful in Chicago.

Chicago's CBD -- CLEARLY LOOKS CORE. Any adding a Greater Core HAS SOME HERE SAY IT CAN'T?? It is a neighborhood and doesn't look it. Yet Philly's is filled with Row-home neighborhoods. KIND OF A DOUBLE-STANDARD.

Chicago's Gold Coast has only a small portion officially even in its CBD. The Gold Coast was Chicago's high-rise living region 40-years ago yet not even in its CBD.

Again, no one should deny, try to lessen (as it isn't huge by far) This OFFICIAL CHICAGO CBD by the City of Chicago itself ....

https://data.cityofchicago.org/Facil...rict/tksj-nvsw

This far from any Greater downtown whatsoever. No pushing a boundary limit to add totally residential neighborhoods that those -- boasting for Philly say Chicago CANT ADD ANY OTHER AREAS.

Those in this boundary will NOT see a area NOT LOOKING LIKE A CORE. Why Chicago gets a GRANDER and LARGER LOOKING CORE POINTS HERE.

Downtown Chicago official neighborhoods ALL LOOK LIKE A CORE.

--- Streeterville --- River North --- Looking into the Loop

Last edited by DavePa; 05-01-2018 at 08:15 AM..
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Old 06-27-2017, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
8,386 posts, read 9,964,665 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago60614 View Post
Didn't I post that two years ago when this thread started? Why bring it up now?
There are a lot of post made on this thread and I must've missed it by mistake or something. Anyway, it's being addressed now.

It's not a massive stretch to say that "downtown Chicago" is roughly everything from the South Loop and McCormick up to around North Ave. One area I would say is getting away from downtown is that tier up by North Ave, but it's included in the community area of which it is incredibly easy to get population stats as they're official, so in general it's good enough. I'm not trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes.

It's not PERFECT, as there's no PERFECT description of "Downtown Chicago" to draw the stats, but it's damn close.

If anything you're leaving out the areas west of the river into the West Loop, which is very much "downtown" out to around Halsted or Morgan. Swap that area for those up by North Ave and you're still pretty much on target. Everywhere north, south and west in the downtown area is growing like weeds right now.
I didn't say your Chicago stats were misleading but how you drew Philadelphia's downtown boundaries when you posted your population for Philly by decade. You included the modern day downtown boundaries even though it didn't exist in the past decades. Back then the downtown area and the CBD were exactly the same land area. So yes, your stats for Philly were misleading. You tried to make it seem like downtown Philly was so much larger and more populated than downtown Chicago when that wasn't the case.
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