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Old 07-27-2017, 05:10 PM
 
2,297 posts, read 1,063,159 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
Center City (aka Philly's downtown) is a pretty well agreed upon area (for the most part). The CBD is within that, but not all of Center City.

Because several surrounding neighborhoods seamlessly blend into Center City's traditional borders, and because those neighborhoods have a strong relationship (e.g. business, residential, movement, function, etc.), the CCD branded the larger area as "Greater Center City". I believe the area of "Greater Center City" is something like 6 or 7 square miles.

It's really not unreasonable to think that way, but yes, it's not like Center City grew by 100,000 people over the last few years to get to 190,000 people. It has grown, and is probably closer to 60 - 65,000 people. Center City Philly is only 2 square miles, so it's already a large population, especially when looking across American downtowns (~30,000 ppsm).

Note: I don't think they did this to fool people or to start fights on City-Data.
If adding neighborhoods is the game? Both cities boosters can. Just when its tried Chicago in this thread? posters in this thread argued Chicago couldn't include neighborhoods just north of its official CBD like Old Town? Because say it doesn't look Core enough.... then I just smile at all the Philly neighborhoods that can be totally row-homes said ARE worthy and this it.

I will say ... the day may come University City could have a portion added to CC? Schuylkill Yards re-developed too will be added. But Chicago recently re-zoned parts of its West Loop to - downtown (as a zoned criteria that allows taller high-rises. So it reasons it will be added to its official CBD eventually.

As I keep saying. The 2020 census will give ammunition again to argue over? But both cores are growing in population quite nicely. So it comes down to Greater CBD borders again to debate or other stats too?
For most posting? It still comes down to a favorite, preferred or less liked city to debate on ..... and on ....

This thread wasn't created on someone's reasoning or agenda on C-D? It was on a ACTUAL publication in a Philly sight like Philly.com and this one ...

Center City District Reports Philadelphia's Downtown Population Is Now The Second Largest In The Entire Country

from the link in the Greater CC SIZE used:
- The 7.7-square-mile section extending from South Philadelphia to Fishtown — the area that Center City District dubs greater Center City — has grown in population by 16% since 2000, and is now home to 183,240 residents.

A bit more then CC or Chicago's official CBD it gives on that city's web-sight and the census 2-mile radius as a downtown. But there is NO REASON that Chicago couldn't use a similar 7.7 sq/mi Greater CBD too .....

Last edited by DavePa; 07-27-2017 at 05:23 PM..
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Old 07-28-2017, 07:22 AM
 
Location: Portland, Maine
443 posts, read 399,032 times
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Just for comparison doing a similar exercise with Boston shows Boston having a population of 212,996 people contained in the greater Downtown area which includes: Fenway/Kenmore, South End, South Boston, Back Bay, Downtown (incl. Chinatown/Leather District), Beacon Hill, West End, North End,and Charlestown. All of those neighborhoods are within 2 miles of the CBD and have a combined area of about 8 square miles.
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Old 07-28-2017, 10:18 AM
 
Location: The mountain of Airy
5,145 posts, read 4,985,538 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citylover94 View Post
Just for comparison doing a similar exercise with Boston shows Boston having a population of 212,996 people contained in the greater Downtown area which includes: Fenway/Kenmore, South End, South Boston, Back Bay, Downtown (incl. Chinatown/Leather District), Beacon Hill, West End, North End,and Charlestown. All of those neighborhoods are within 2 miles of the CBD and have a combined area of about 8 square miles.
Boston and Philly are incredibly close in terms of urban character and size in the core. I did radius measures at one point and they are neck and neck up until a point and then Philly becomes larger as you get further out. Philly as a metro is just larger, but they are both so comparable.

While both legacy cities, built in a dense fashion with a reasonable sized core footprint, Boston would be close to the size of Philly if the land area was larger. No different for San Fran either. 3 of my favorites!
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Old 07-28-2017, 10:41 AM
 
Location: Philadelphia/ Rehoboth Beach
262 posts, read 198,078 times
Reputation: 251
While negative perceptions are hard to shed they eventually do die .Here are a couple research articles from JLL that will help bury those old misconceptions .
http://www.us.jll.com/united-states/...6-f5c5b6dfea4d
Market East Named Most Affordable and Desirable Retail Corridor
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Old 07-28-2017, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
8,385 posts, read 9,945,414 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
So basically Philly's CBD 'annexed' a couple of surrounding neighborhoods to surpass downtown Chicago?
Even without the so called "downtown annexation" Philly's central business core is almost twice the populated than Chicago's CBD core.

Philly CBD core: 57,000
Chicago CBD core: 33,000


Chicago is lucky it has a larger overall land area than Philly, because if they were equal, Philly would probably surpass Chicago in city population by 2050.
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Old 07-28-2017, 12:39 PM
 
1,290 posts, read 1,502,298 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly View Post
Even without the so called "downtown annexation" Philly's central business core is almost twice the populated than Chicago's CBD core.

Philly CBD core: 57,000
Chicago CBD core: 33,000


Chicago is lucky it has a larger overall land area than Philly, because if they were equal, Philly would probably surpass Chicago in city population by 2050.
What are you measuring? People who happen to reside in the CBD? what about workers? tourists? Chicago CBD is an order of magnitude larger and more crowded than Philly's.

I don't know what area you are including for each, but 33,000 for Chicago is laughable, there are hundreds of thousands of feet on the streets 7 days a week.
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Old 07-28-2017, 12:47 PM
 
Location: Maryland
3,918 posts, read 5,038,758 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly View Post
Chicago is lucky it has a larger overall land area than Philly, because if they were equal, Philly would probably surpass Chicago in city population by 2050.
This comment seems like a mixture of wishful thinking and sour grapes. If Chicago were all of Cook county, it'd be the second-most populous city in the U.S. by a large margin, but everyone would clearly see it as just smokes and mirrors.
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Old 07-28-2017, 12:49 PM
 
61 posts, read 31,889 times
Reputation: 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
Boston and Philly are incredibly close in terms of urban character and size in the core. I did radius measures at one point and they are neck and neck up until a point and then Philly becomes larger as you get further out. Philly as a metro is just larger, but they are both so comparable.

While both legacy cities, built in a dense fashion with a reasonable sized core footprint, Boston would be close to the size of Philly if the land area was larger. No different for San Fran either. 3 of my favorites!

I kind of wish Boston annexed the other city suburbs around it to make it easier. It makes more functional sense to just add Cambridge, Somerville and Brookline to the city and call them neighborhoods. I think it would be slightly smaller than Philadelphia in total population, but neck and neck in the densest areas.

Even San Francisco. It's far more land-constrained but they could annex further south.
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Old 07-28-2017, 01:01 PM
 
8,638 posts, read 8,771,906 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpinionatedOne View Post
I kind of wish Boston annexed the other city suburbs around it to make it easier. It makes more functional sense to just add Cambridge, Somerville and Brookline to the city and call them neighborhoods. I think it would be slightly smaller than Philadelphia in total population, but neck and neck in the densest areas.

Even San Francisco. It's far more land-constrained but they could annex further south.
I think its kind of good, different towns do different policies and they each learn from each other, and if one screws up it doesn't hurt the whole metro.
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Old 07-28-2017, 01:03 PM
 
61 posts, read 31,889 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4 View Post
I think its kind of good, different towns do different policies and they each learn from each other, and if one screws up it doesn't hurt the whole metro.

I wonder if Philadelphia would be different if they didn't do what Boston did. Not sure about San Francisco.
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