U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Celebrating Memorial Day!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S. > City vs. City
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
View Poll Results: What is the Midwest's second city/metropolis?
Greater Detroit 65 41.67%
Greater Minneapolis/Saint Paul 91 58.33%
Voters: 156. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 05-23-2015, 07:02 PM
 
Location: Carver County, MN
1,395 posts, read 2,072,918 times
Reputation: 1223

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post

I do not even know why we are debating this, to tell the truth. Some posted the data of the GDP ranking of greater areas and Detroits was ahead of Minneapolis. There is no way the the Twin Cities economic output is greater than the Detroit, Windsor, Ann Arbor area combined, which by the way has a smaller geographic footprint than the Twin Cities MSA. Now, if you truncated the Twin Cities, by taking away the St. Paul component of the area, based upon some formula the population split by rivers cannot be counted together, then the Minneapolis MSA and its GDP would be comparable to St. Louis of Cleveland. Then you would say, but there is the St Paul area right next to us....and that really should be counted too. Well, that is the case for the Detroit region.....a lot of population is simply not counted based upon the "formula", that is heavily dependent upon commuter patterns and rates between counties. The Detroit area, unrestricted by commuter rates, and international boundaries, has a greater population and a greater GDP for the area. Yes, I would agree that the Twin Cities has a larger per capita GDP, but not an overall greater GDP.

I would argue that Minneapolis alone would still rank above St. Louis or Cleveland. Minneapolis is the epicenter of the Twin Cities metro (no offense St. Paul, I love you, but we all know its true). I mean, just by looking at the skyline you can tell that Minneapolis has passed places like St. Louis and Cleveland years ago. Also pairing Detroit with Ann Arbor is not the same as comparing Minneapolis and St. Paul. Detroit and Ann Arbor are two metros that just happen to be close to each other and have almost sprawled together. Minneapolis/St. Paul act as one large core city with two CBDs.

 
Old 05-23-2015, 07:37 PM
 
5,318 posts, read 6,620,829 times
Reputation: 2657
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
If you want to get your career on....and get some experience....I would recommend the Twin Cities over places like Atlanta and such....and of course Detroit.

Detroit has far more engineering jobs than the twin cities. Currently, companies in Detroit cannot hire people fast enough. I heard earlier this year General Mills, one of the biggest employers in MSP, had layoffs.
 
Old 05-23-2015, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,332 posts, read 2,887,768 times
Reputation: 3897
Unemployment in Minnesota is currently 3.7% so layoffs are not a big issue here. I am the head chef of a large restaurant kitchen and am finding it very hard to hire in this environment. Wages are starting to rise in the face of chronic labor shortages. They will continue to rise until they are high enough to draw in enough workers from other parts of the country (and world) to meet local demand. Elite line cooks are now making $17/hr, it will be $20/hr within a few years. What do cooks make in Detroit?
 
Old 05-23-2015, 09:44 PM
 
5,318 posts, read 6,620,829 times
Reputation: 2657
Engineers in Detroit fresh out of college are making $70k.
 
Old 05-24-2015, 12:47 AM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,332 posts, read 2,887,768 times
Reputation: 3897
What does that do for someone who didn't go to college? A healthy economy should take care of people at all levels of society, not just the elite.
 
Old 05-24-2015, 07:27 AM
 
8,674 posts, read 6,349,443 times
Reputation: 3779
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Great that you're aware--so why keep bringing it up? It's history and not how global economics works. Manufacturing magically reappearing centered in the US and the conditions of the immediately post World War I and then World War II as well as the immediate turmoil of decolonialization are not going to suddenly happen again.

?

Here's the BEA's report in 2014 of US metro areas by GMP (which tallies up to 2013):
http://bea.gov/newsreleases/regional..._metro0914.pdf

MSP is at: 227,793
Detroit is at: 224,726

However, those are MSAs (and obviously the list does not include Windsor since it's a US bureau). So, pretty close, but MSP is still ahead. I think if you want to go CSA (for Detroit would include Flint, Ann Arbor, Monroe, and Adrian MSAs; for the Twin Cities would include St. Cloud, Faribault-Northfield, Red Wing, and Hutchinson MSAs), then Detroit, especially after considering Windsor, is up ahead. However, it looks like Twin Cities is economically a bit healthier so I stand by what I said in terms of it being "the one with the larger economic clout at this point, and if not now, then very soon." Of course, I might be wrong. Things might turn for both or either in any direction quickly--which then boils back down to the statement NEITHER is soundly second place at this point. Basically, are we talking the MSA in the US or the CSA (or the MSA/CSA plus Canada)? If these factors means placing one above the other, and almost never by a particularly large margin, then I don't see either being soundly second place.

If Floyd Mayweather has the flu....that does not give a lesser fighter the "clout".
 
Old 05-24-2015, 09:56 AM
 
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
1,192 posts, read 1,036,448 times
Reputation: 2089
Quote:
Originally Posted by ram2 View Post
Detroit has far more engineering jobs than the twin cities. Currently, companies in Detroit cannot hire people fast enough. I heard earlier this year General Mills, one of the biggest employers in MSP, had layoffs.
Who cares about engineering jobs? The Twin Cities is far more diversified than Detroit, and as Drewcifer already mentioned, unemployment is next to nonexistent here. The job market is much, much healthier and more robust in MSP than in Detroit, so I'm not sure what the point you're trying to make is. You could also say that Detroit has far more auto industry jobs than the Twin Cities, which is absolutely 100% true. That's why Detroit's economy has floundered and spiraled into abysmal decline for decades.

By the way, it was corporate jobs at Target, not General Mills, receiving the pink slips. Didn't hurt the Twin Cities a bit because it's not an industry we rely on and it had nothing to do with the local economy, but poor sales and management of Target's Canadian stores.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram2 View Post
Engineers in Detroit fresh out of college are making $70k.
So what? How does the rest of your workforce look in Detroit?
 
Old 05-24-2015, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Upper West Side, Manhattan, NYC
14,304 posts, read 17,948,992 times
Reputation: 6255
Greater Minneapolis, no doubt about it.
 
Old 05-24-2015, 10:19 AM
PDF
 
11,386 posts, read 9,871,806 times
Reputation: 6580
Minneapolis is great. I prefer it to Chicago.
 
Old 05-24-2015, 11:09 AM
 
Location: In the heights
20,173 posts, read 21,776,227 times
Reputation: 10254
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indentured Servant View Post
If Floyd Mayweather has the flu....that does not give a lesser fighter the "clout".
Well, that was a pretty nonsensical response. Also, boxing is incredibly stupid.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S. > City vs. City
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top