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Interesting matchup between DC and Miami in this one...I think DC has more hints of "Southerness" throughout the metro but the African American community of Miami is more strongly Southern than any demographic in the DC metro...really tough to pick which is more Southern
A lot of Southern blacks have migrated to the Washington DC area over the years, many of them migrating from the Carolinas or rural Southern Virginia, or the Eastern shore of Maryland...yes, you have a lot
of black transplants from Northern States here too, but I do see a strong Southern element from a lot of black people here...more upper south than lower south, but I’d say it’s a wash between DC and Miami in many ways. A lot of blacks from Miami migrated there from rural Florida or Georgia and have held onto their southern roots too.
Most characteristically Southern to Least characteristically Southern:
1. Atlanta: 5
2. Houston: 4
3. Dallas: 3
4. Washington, D.C.: 2
5. Miami: 1
Lets say the Southern influences by Black folks cancels each other out regarding Miami versus Washington D.C., as there is sufficient evidence that both are influenced by the South with regards to their respective Black populations. Then we have to look at the actual physical metropolitan areas themselves and how they are built and their respective features and stuff like that for further delineation.
Washington D.C. is built more closely to Atlanta than Miami is to Atlanta. There are elements and parts of the DMV area that can pass off as relative cousins to parts and elements of the Greater Atlanta area. In contrast, there is probably next to nothing in common between the built forms of Miami and Atlanta and that's including both the actual cities and their respective metropolitan areas as a whole.
Dallas and Houston are built more in a California-lite/Western-lite manner both in the city and in their suburbs with regards to roadways, infrastructure, ethnic enclaves, grid systems, suburban styles, layout, so on and so forth. With the exception of Houston's inner city orientation relative to Atlanta's, neither of the Texas cities have much in common with Atlanta developmentally. The Houston and Atlanta orientation, the one noticeable thing they share in common, is a superficial similarity more than an aesthetic or physically built up one. For instance, Houston has a downtown and midtown conjoined to downtown by being right next to it, and has an uptown connected to those areas by the city's most prominent road (Westheimer) located in the direction the city favors as its richest, most populous, and most prominent (its west side). That's similar to Atlanta, which also has a downtown conjoined by a midtown next to it and an uptown connected to those areas by the city's most prominent road (Peachtree) located in the direction the city favors the most, which is its north side, and this direction is the richest, most populous, and most important in Atlanta. Both Buckhead Atlanta and Uptown Houston are 4-5 miles from the CBD, both are located in the city's favored direction. Both cities also have ring roads that culturally divide the residents between inner city folks and outer city suburban folks. In Houston those that live inside the Loop (I-610) are called "Inner Loopers" and that is where the original city of Houston is (the original 713 area code) and those that live outside of the Loop are referred to as "Outer Loopers". Atlanta, similarly, is divided in like manner by the ring road the locals refer to as "the Perimeter" (I-285), where you are either designated as living "inside the perimeter" or "outside the perimeter" and like Houston it delineates between the original city and the more recent suburban sprawl tack ons. That's the one, albeit superficial, similarity that I think Atlanta and Houston have in common with one another. Actually for that matter, Washington has a pretty well defined Beltway (I-495) as well that serves in a similar and like manner to Atlanta and Houston in many respects. Houston's Southern attributes are more diluted than Atlanta's as Atlanta played a major and historical role in the development of the South in the 1900s and Houston did not. Houston's version of southern is Gulf Coast style, whereas Atlanta's is the interior Piedmont style, which Washington is closer to emulating than Houston is. Dallas is nothing like any of these cities (save for Houston) and Miami is nothing like any of these at all.
Physically and aesthetically, the Washington DC area, both the city and suburbs are more in line with Atlanta and the Greater Atlanta area; topographically, geographically, perhaps even climatically than Dallas, Houston, or Miami. Atlanta's demographics also more closely resemble the Washington D.C. area than they do Dallas, Houston, or Miami and I am not talking about whites and blacks but really just the whole of it altogether (i.e. N.H. Whites, N.H. Blacks, N.H Asians, and Hispanics). Not saying Atlanta's diversity composition is quite as large as Washington's but it mirrors it more closely on a smaller scale, whereas it doesn't share nearly as much in common with Dallas, Houston, or Miami in this regard. Atlanta's tech industry is also more in line with Washington's among these (with regard to the compartments that make up each of their tech sectors), Atlanta's Life Sciences industry is also most similar to Washington among these, Atlanta's government, defense, and R&D sectors are more in line with Washington's than they have in common with Dallas, Houston, or Miami. Systematically MARTA is more closely aligned with WMATA than the systems in Dallas, Houston, or Miami as well. Atlanta's integration and segregation patterns are much more in line with Washington's than they are with Dallas, Houston, or Miami. I can go on and on all day with this but you get the idea.
I would say that Miami is less Southern all in all than Washington D.C., which itself is less Southern than Dallas, which itself is less Southern than Houston, which itself is less Southern than Atlanta. Atlanta being the most Southern of the bunch all in all by a good distance. However, despite being more Southern than Washington D.C., both Dallas and Houston are less like Atlanta than Washington D.C. is IMO. In that sense, Washington has more in common with the most Southern of these cities (Atlanta) than three of the other contenders do (Dallas, Houston, and Miami) IMO. I have lived in 4 out of 5 of these major metropolitan areas, from the point of view as a resident, I know 80% of these cities really really well and the one that I haven't lived in I have visited and come to know well enough of as well.
Last edited by Trafalgar Law; 11-28-2017 at 06:59 PM..
I think that Houston is set up a little differently in the North suburbs. That area is more Atlanta-like, if you will.
I don't find DC southern AT ALL. Suburban DC is cute and looks similar to parts of Atlanta, but that's about it, IMO. I visited DC and knew that I was "Up North" without a doubt. The way the area moves is different than anything in the South.
If we're basing a lot of this on blacks, then Miami beats DC by far.
I think that Houston is set up a little differently in the North suburbs. That area is more Atlanta-like, if you will.
I don't find DC southern AT ALL. Suburban DC is cute and looks similar to parts of Atlanta, but that's about it, IMO. I visited DC and knew that I was "Up North" without a doubt. The way the area moves is different than anything in the South.
If we're basing a lot of this on blacks, then Miami beats DC by far.
If you spent more time in the farther-out Northern VA suburbs, you would've noticed the more southern aspects/similarities to suburban Atlanta. I do agree that overall, DC is nowhere near as southern as the other cities, but as someone who has lived in both cities, they definitely share aesthetic and demographic similarities to Atlanta (but DC is more cosmopolitan).
As for North Houston, it's layout is more like that of Tampa or Orlando/Central Fl Jacksonville than Atlanta due to the differences in terrain (since ATL is in the Piedmont while Houston, Orlando, and Tampa are all on coastal plains), housing styles, and street layouts.
If you spent more time in the farther-out Northern VA suburbs, you would've noticed the more southern aspects/similarities to suburban Atlanta. I do agree that overall, DC is nowhere near as southern as the other cities, but as someone who has lived in both cities, they definitely share aesthetic and demographic similarities to Atlanta (but DC is more cosmopolitan).
As for North Houston, it's layout is more like that of Tampa or Orlando/Central Fl Jacksonville than Atlanta due to the differences in terrain (since ATL is in the Piedmont while Houston, Orlando, and Tampa are all on coastal plains), housing styles, and street layouts.
I agreed that DC's and Atlanta's suburbs favor. I get more of a northern vibe in DC than anything southern.
Tampa and Orlando are more of a grid than North Houston's suburbs. I see more of a Tallahassee set up in North Houston, since you want to compare Florida cities. Out of the the 5 areas being mentioned in this thread, North Houston shares more in common with some of the Atlanta suburbs. Northern Greater Houston looks and feels a lot different than the rest of Greater Houston, which is more dense and crowded and has more of a grid like pattern.
TBH, FWIW, Houston has a different southern culture than Atlanta; of course, the subsets are related, but they are different in many aspects. Atlanta is more of your "typical" South, which can be found in, again, northern Houston or areas close to the metro like Cleveland. Overall, Houston is more of your coastal and "festive" South.
I agreed that DC's and Atlanta's suburbs favor. I get more of a northern vibe in DC than anything southern.
Tampa and Orlando are more of a grid than North Houston's suburbs. I see more of a Tallahassee set up in North Houston, since you want to compare Florida cities. Out of the the 5 areas being mentioned in this thread, North Houston shares more in common with some of the Atlanta suburbs. Northern Greater Houston looks and feels a lot different than the rest of Greater Houston, which is more dense and crowded and has more of a grid like pattern.
TBH, FWIW, Houston has a different southern culture than Atlanta; of course, the subsets are related, but they are different in many aspects. Atlanta is more of your "typical" South, which can be found in, again, northern Houston or areas close to the metro like Cleveland. Overall, Houston is more of your coastal and "festive" South.
I'm curious which Atlanta suburbs you think can North Houston be compared to? I don't see the comparison at all besides some superficial similarities... I just say that you'd have to explore more areas like East Texas, Northern Louisiana, and even parts of Mississippi (From Jackson on down to Hattiesburg, not the Delta region) to see why I don't think Northern Greater Houston is anything like Metro Atlanta. It's way too close to the Gulf and has a similar lifestyle, terrain, and feel to inland areas in those states rather than the Piedmont Atlantic Region that Atlanta is in. There are nuances and differences in those regions of the south that must be acknowledged. And yes, I'm comparing Florida cities because Houston has quite a bit in common with them. Orlando isn't on as much of a grid as Tampa is BTW thanks to all the lakes throughout Central Florida. Tallahassee is an excellent example as well, although it's only 20 miles from the coast compared to the longer distance The Woodlands, Spring, Conroe, Tomball, and Cleveland are. And Cleveland looks more like McComb, MS or Albany, Georgia than say, Fayetteville or Cumming. I also see a lot of similarities between Northern Greater Houston and Jacksonville too.
Last edited by biscuit_head; 11-30-2017 at 02:06 PM..
I'm curious which Atlanta suburbs you think can North Houston be compared to? I don't see the comparison at all besides some superficial similarities... I just say that you'd have to explore more areas like East Texas, Northern Louisiana, and even parts of Mississippi (From Jackson on down to Hattiesburg, not the Delta region) to see why I don't think Northern Greater Houston is anything like Metro Atlanta. It's way too close to the Gulf and has a similar lifestyle, terrain, and feel to inland areas in those states rather than the Piedmont Atlantic Region that Atlanta is in. There are nuances and differences in those regions of the south that must be acknowledged. And yes, I'm comparing Florida cities because Houston has quite a bit in common with them. Orlando isn't on as much of a grid as Tampa is BTW thanks to all the lakes throughout Central Florida. Tallahassee is an excellent example as well, although it's only 20 miles from the coast compared to the longer distance The Woodlands, Spring, Conroe, Tomball, and Cleveland are. And Cleveland looks more like McComb, MS or Albany, Georgia than say, Fayetteville or Cumming. I also see a lot of similarities between Northern Greater Houston and Jacksonville too.
I've traveled to those areas, BUT I did say that northern Houston is more comparable to the Atlanta suburbs than to any of the 5 areas being compared in this thread. LOL. You didn't have to type of all that.
I've traveled to those areas, BUT I did say that northern Houston is more comparable to the Atlanta suburbs than to any of the 5 areas being compared in this thread. LOL. You didn't have to type of all that.
In other words, you don’t have an answer, so you didn’t have to type any of that either.
I'm curious which Atlanta suburbs you think can North Houston be compared to? I don't see the comparison at all besides some superficial similarities... I just say that you'd have to explore more areas like East Texas, Northern Louisiana, and even parts of Mississippi (From Jackson on down to Hattiesburg, not the Delta region) to see why I don't think Northern Greater Houston is anything like Metro Atlanta. It's way too close to the Gulf and has a similar lifestyle, terrain, and feel to inland areas in those states rather than the Piedmont Atlantic Region that Atlanta is in. There are nuances and differences in those regions of the south that must be acknowledged. And yes, I'm comparing Florida cities because Houston has quite a bit in common with them. Orlando isn't on as much of a grid as Tampa is BTW thanks to all the lakes throughout Central Florida. Tallahassee is an excellent example as well, although it's only 20 miles from the coast compared to the longer distance The Woodlands, Spring, Conroe, Tomball, and Cleveland are. And Cleveland looks more like McComb, MS or Albany, Georgia than say, Fayetteville or Cumming. I also see a lot of similarities between Northern Greater Houston and Jacksonville too.
Agreed agreed agreed. Houston has much more a culture in line with the rest of the Gulf Coast plus Central Florida than it does the Piedmont.
In other words, you don’t have an answer, so you didn’t have to type any of that either.
I love it!
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