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Old 10-20-2015, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Birmingham
11,790 posts, read 12,651,011 times
Reputation: 10007

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A lot of times when people talk Birmingham suburbs they only point out M-B, Hoover, Vestavia Hills, Homewood because that is where the money is.

There are other "black" suburbs that don't have much money like Fairfield, Midfield, Bessemer, Tarrant.

There are other "white" suburbs that don't have much money like Hueytown, Pleasant Grove, Fultondale.

It seems the area is dismissed or panned as being the reference standard for white flight with a poor black city surrounded by all white rich suburbs and that is just not true.

I definitely agree that some aspects of state legislation are against Birmingham's success.

I definitely agree that we are up and coming and meet a lot of the criteria laid out by this thread.
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Old 10-20-2015, 11:57 AM
 
12,204 posts, read 17,581,474 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourian View Post
A lot of times when people talk Birmingham suburbs they only point out M-B, Hoover, Vestavia Hills, Homewood because that is where the money is.

There are other "black" suburbs that don't have much money like Fairfield, Midfield, Bessemer, Tarrant.

There are other "white" suburbs that don't have much money like Hueytown, Pleasant Grove, Fultondale.

It seems the area is dismissed or panned as being the reference standard for white flight with a poor black city surrounded by all white rich suburbs and that is just not true.

I definitely agree that some aspects of state legislation are against Birmingham's success.

I definitely agree that we are up and coming and meet a lot of the criteria laid out by this thread.
Thank you!

The bolded suburbs are becoming blacker as well, especially Pleasant Grove.
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Old 10-20-2015, 12:07 PM
 
27,773 posts, read 24,803,389 times
Reputation: 16495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourian View Post
A lot of times when people talk Birmingham suburbs they only point out M-B, Hoover, Vestavia Hills, Homewood because that is where the money is.

There are other "black" suburbs that don't have much money like Fairfield, Midfield, Bessemer, Tarrant.

There are other "white" suburbs that don't have much money like Hueytown, Pleasant Grove, Fultondale.

It seems the area is dismissed or panned as being the reference standard for white flight with a poor black city surrounded by all white rich suburbs and that is just not true.

I definitely agree that some aspects of state legislation are against Birmingham's success.

I definitely agree that we are up and coming and meet a lot of the criteria laid out by this thread.
The points made about suburbs and white flight weren't absolute, but in comparison to Richmond in particular in relation to the distribution of their Black populations across both metros.

At this point, one of Birmingham's drawbacks within the context of this discussion is lackluster growth among Black educated professionals, which in turn is part of the larger picture of how the city, having successfully transitioned from an economy based on heavy industry early on (which was impressive actually), was passed up by the likes of Charlotte, Raleigh, Nashville, etc. I suspect both local and state issues were to blame for that one.
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Old 10-20-2015, 12:13 PM
 
12,204 posts, read 17,581,474 times
Reputation: 3350
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
The points made about suburbs and white flight weren't absolute, but in comparison to Richmond in particular in relation to the distribution of their Black populations across both metros.

At this point, one of Birmingham's drawbacks within the context of this discussion is lackluster growth among Black educated professionals, which in turn is part of the larger picture of how the city, having successfully transitioned from an economy based on heavy industry early on (which was impressive actually), was passed up by the likes of Charlotte, Raleigh, Nashville, etc. I suspect both local and state issues were to blame for that one.
Tell me more.
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Old 10-20-2015, 12:32 PM
 
52,705 posts, read 75,579,586 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernBoy205 View Post
Thank you!

The bolded suburbs are becoming blacker as well, especially Pleasant Grove.
What is interesting is that if the source I've been using is right(has lined up with American FactFinder), Pleasant Grove is 45% Black and has a Black median household income of $77,569(08-12 info). So, it appears that it is a community that would/does appeal to Black middle class folks. Pleasant Grove, AL Population and Races - USA.com™

Pleasant Grove, AL Income and Careers - USA.com™
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Old 10-20-2015, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Birmingham
11,790 posts, read 12,651,011 times
Reputation: 10007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
The points made about suburbs and white flight weren't absolute, but in comparison to Richmond in particular in relation to the distribution of their Black populations across both metros.

At this point, one of Birmingham's drawbacks within the context of this discussion is lackluster growth among Black educated professionals, which in turn is part of the larger picture of how the city, having successfully transitioned from an economy based on heavy industry early on (which was impressive actually), was passed up by the likes of Charlotte, Raleigh, Nashville, etc. I suspect both local and state issues were to blame for that one.
I wasn't just responding to you, but to the people in general who base their opinion of Birmingham on that idea.

It isn't just that simple. Birmingham is heavy on construction and banking. These two industries were hardest hit by the recession, we can't blame all that on local and state issues. What I can blame on them is that when it is time to open up the coffers to lure new industry to Birmingham, you can bet that unless it is directly tied to the auto industry it won't be coming to Birmingham - the governor's office would rather help his friends in Huntsville which is why I believe they got the Remington and Polaris projects. ALDOT, however, seems onboard with helping Birmingham as all the major road projects going on in the state are happening in the area. And as you said, the private investment into the city center is quite strong and still building momentum.

It is a challenge, but it is moving in the right direction.
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Old 10-20-2015, 12:54 PM
 
27,773 posts, read 24,803,389 times
Reputation: 16495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourian View Post
I wasn't just responding to you, but to the people in general who base their opinion of Birmingham on that idea.

It isn't just that simple. Birmingham is heavy on construction and banking. These two industries were hardest hit by the recession, we can't blame all that on local and state issues. What I can blame on them is that when it is time to open up the coffers to lure new industry to Birmingham, you can bet that unless it is directly tied to the auto industry it won't be coming to Birmingham - the governor's office would rather help his friends in Huntsville which is why I believe they got the Remington and Polaris projects. ALDOT, however, seems onboard with helping Birmingham as all the major road projects going on in the state are happening in the area. And as you said, the private investment into the city center is quite strong and still building momentum.

It is a challenge, but it is moving in the right direction.
Oh I wasn't referring to the Great Recession, but going even further back. At one point Birmingham was the banking capital of the South, and while it still has a solid banking industry in place, it lost that title to Charlotte due to more progressive policies on the state level in NC and more aggressive local business leaders. Huntsville's competitiveness seems to be more of a recent phenomenon and the historic anti-urban bias from a state legislature that has prioritized rural interests at the expense of urban areas has long been in a problem in many Southern states generally. Birmingham has the right ingredients in place, but I just don't see any major changes happening on the state level anytime soon to help it unleash its full potential. I hope I'm wrong.
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Old 10-20-2015, 01:49 PM
 
Location: Arlington
641 posts, read 494,018 times
Reputation: 682
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Although Birmingham has obvious advantages for Blacks, I'm not sure I'd say it's becoming a small black mecca and that's mainly because of an exceptionally regressive state legislature, especially in matters towards Birmingham, and local history. Atlanta is not stranger to a hostile, backwards state legislature too but it also practically carries the whole state on its shoulders so the dynamic is a bit different.
Plus besides being black mecca and an alpha city, Atlanta is the state capital. GA legislators are more exposed to a true black mecca and more likely to get some good paydays under the table.
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Old 10-20-2015, 02:07 PM
 
12,204 posts, read 17,581,474 times
Reputation: 3350
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
What is interesting is that if the source I've been using is right(has lined up with American FactFinder), Pleasant Grove is 45% Black and has a Black median household income of $77,569(08-12 info). So, it appears that it is a community that would/does appeal to Black middle class folks. Pleasant Grove, AL Population and Races - USA.comô

Pleasant Grove, AL Income and Careers - USA.comô
Thanks. I didn't know this.
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Old 10-20-2015, 02:26 PM
 
52,705 posts, read 75,579,586 times
Reputation: 11636
Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernBoy205 View Post
Thanks. I didn't know this.
Here's a census tract within the city: Census Tract 012305 in Jefferson County, Alabama

3 of the 5 census block groups within that tract are predominately Black and have a median household income above the state figure($43,253 09-13 info) as well. Census Block Group 012305-1 in Jefferson County, Alabama

Census Block Group 012305-2 in Jefferson County, Alabama

Census Block Group 012305-4 in Jefferson County, Alabama

Here's the other census tract in the city: Census Tract 012304 in Jefferson County, Alabama

This nearby community is 82% Black and has a Black median household income about 3k over the state figure: Midfield, AL - USA.com™
Midfield (city) QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau
Midfield, AL Income and Careers - USA.com™
Alabama QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau
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