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He's not making stuff up. It's just that... well, he is from Toronto. It's natural for people to elevate things from their hometown beyond their actual real world prominence. Almost everyone does it. For example, when I lived in Cleveland I remember everyone saying, as if it was a well-known fact, that the Cleveland Orchestra was the best in the world. It is of course a premier symphony orchestra and a member of America's "big 5" but best in the world? No way. Clevelanders are the only people to think that. Same here. I am not an expert on film festivals but I am pretty sure that in the US at least Sundance has a higher profile than TIFF. Maybe Tribeca too (of course I'd say that! ) I wouldn't be shocked if TIFF surpassed them by some objective metrics, but to pretend that it's the undisputed #2 in the world is a bit homerrific.
Good points all around!
While Cleveland Orchestra is not #1 in the world, it does punch wayyyy above it's level. It's ranked #7 in the world: The world
To bring it back to this thread, however, the best ranked Symphony Orchestra in The Americas (and the only non-European Symphony Orchestra in the elite Top 5) is the Chicago Symphony Orchestra.
In North America the rankings are (world rank in parentheses): 1. Chicago (#5) 2. Cleveland (#7)
3. Los Angeles (#8)
4. Boston (#11)
5. New York (#12-New York Symphony Orchestra, #18-The Met)
6. San Francisco (#13)
In other words, Chicago has every ethnic group in abundance except for Asians. Therefore it is less diverse than Toronto whose minorities are mostly Asian. How does that make Toronto more diverse again? Diversity is not having more Asians. Sorry.
The Big Three film festivals are Berlin, Cannes and Venice. Toronto is not #2 in the world. You really love making stuff up, no? In North America, I would put Toronto behind Sundance even. And in terms of the film industry of course the most important city is Los Angeles, considering those film festivals only serve to build buzz for the Academy Awards, which is the most important film event. Heck, Toronto isn't even the most important film city in Canada! Vancouver is much more important as a filming location and Montreal churns out better indies.
Cannes and Sundance are the most famous film festivals, then maybe Venice. Toronto isn't a well known festival. Is it even more well-known than Tribeca or Berlin? I would doubt it.
Anyways, what does it matter? Cannes and Sundance are nothing towns. A city isn't important because there's some film festival.
Toronto's TIFF is a very well known film festival, and I have often seen it listed as #2 in the world after Cannes. To say that "Toronto isn't a well known festival" is absolutely absurd.
WorldPride is not the largest international LGBT event. The largest international LGBT event is the Gay Games. Now, allow me to post North American hosts of the Gay Games:
1982: San Francisco
1986: San Francisco
1990: Vancouver
1994: New York 2006: Chicago
2014: Cleveland
Where's Toronto?
zzzzzzzz Gaygames - boring lol.. Nothing says gay more than pride and its a yearly event.. Even if I dismiss Worldpride and just count ho hum yearly pride events, Toronto has had a bigger and more prominent one than Chicago has for some time. I would ask any gay to come to both cities - especially the DT core of either and objectively say that Chicago is more gay - umm NO its not - there are more gays in the Eaton Centre than Chicago ..
Djemaa el Fna is a dump. It's literally the most culturally devoid part of Marrakech. Why do people still elevate that square? It's all aggressive businessmen, touts and expensive peanut stands.
Actually you are wrong about that! You don't know the history of the place very well... I will admit its touristic but the storytellers and performances going on there have been around for many centuries.
Expensive peanut stands lol - were you even in Djemaa el Fna or are you confusing it with Wrigley field. Btw is 4 dirhams for a large fresh glass of OJ expensive to you... Hmmmm
typo, meant TIFF isn't in the same league as Cannes. Cannes is much better known. TIFF is one of the biggest definitely, but you must understand that if you have to mention Cannes in order to try to bolster TIFF to the many people here who have never heard of it, then it's a pretty strong signifier that it simply isn't that well known for most people.
Yes, TIFF is definitely one of the largest and most important film festivals and eclipses Chicago's, but there's a significant drop-off in name recognition after Cannes and Sundance for the general public so it's pretty fair to say that even though TIFF is much better known and more important than any and all Chicago film festival, it's funny to think that you would still have to explain to most people outside the industry TIFF's importance while that wouldn't happen nearly as often with Cannes or Sundance. TIFF and its importance is something you mention if you're in the industry or if you're trying to bolster a city on a forum--it's a factoid rather than a commonly known fact.
And Cleveland always warrants a response.
We are comparing Film festivals in Toronto vs Chicago though are we not. Not Toronto vs the world so I stick by what I said - you've eluded to as much and obviously TIFF is an influential festival. As for convincing Oy - im trying to convince the same ole gang in CD that heavily favours Chicago... Think about that! Im providing information to those that want to see things with an open mind.
I like Cleveland but I think you and I both can agree - I think anyway that objectively Toronto it is not. Chicago and Toronto are more apt competitors.
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Originally Posted by Fitzrovian
He's not making stuff up. It's just that... well, he is from Toronto. It's natural for people to elevate things from their hometown beyond their actual real world prominence. Almost everyone does it. For example, when I lived in Cleveland I remember everyone saying, as if it was a well-known fact, that the Cleveland Orchestra was the best in the world. It is of course a premier symphony orchestra and a member of America's "big 5" but best in the world? No way. Clevelanders are the only people to think that. Same here. I am not an expert on film festivals but I am pretty sure that in the US at least Sundance has a higher profile than TIFF. Maybe Tribeca too (of course I'd say that! ) I wouldn't be shocked if TIFF surpassed them by some objective metrics, but to pretend that it's the undisputed #2 in the world is a bit homerrific.
Im not elevating TIFF or even Toronto for that matter - im providing information. I have named places in T.O that have not been named but that people who come here should go.. Coming to Toronto - go to QSW check, go to Distillery check, go to Kensington check go to St Lawrence Market check and these are places I think Toronto has that Chicago just doesn't have an equivalent too - especially within its core. Naturally Chicago has things that Toronto doesn't and if you actually read my posts you would see that but we are all guilty to some degree of confirmation bias.
TIFF is a prominent film festival and more prominent than anything film festival related in Chicago and I have provided sources and information that demonstrated that rather more objectively than the opinions in here. How anyone in here can actually challenge that is absurd.. We aren't debating TIFF vs Cannes or even Sundance or Berlin. I have at the very least posted links with information showing support of that. If some homers or homer supporters in CD want to dismiss that information that is up to them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by North 42
Oh god, never mind!
Yeah he has a difficult time with the Diversity thing when it comes to multiculturalism... A real difficult time....
Quote:
Originally Posted by North 42
Toronto's TIFF is a very well known film festival, and I have often seen it listed as #2 in the world after Cannes. To say that "Toronto isn't a well known festival" is absolutely absurd.
You would have an easier time beaming yourself to Alpha Centauri than convincing someone like NOLA that TIFF is important.. If its in Toronto its crap is his default setting.
While I'm not disagreeing with your opinion, I do think yours is nothing more than preference. (which again is fine).
I do think its quite fair for one to think, that Torontos' clusters of newly built residential high rises, given a vibrant feel throughout the city. I think those clusters of high rises does make Toronto feel a little more urban throughout, even if you do have typical suburban streets very close by. Conversely, the "bombed out" south and west side neighborhoods of Chicago are at suburban density without the suburban beauty. The worst of both worlds. Even once you get beyond Lincoln Square or Logan Square it seems even the north side, has had little built in years.
One can see Toronto Island and some of the ravines close to the city center as being just as unique of an amenity as Chicagos accessible beaches, and something that Chicago has no equivalent of.
Yes, Chicagos museums are beautifully set along the lakefront, and even though LSD may be prettier, the museums are still a little more cutoff than Torontos equivalent. (The art institute being the major exception). I like how Torontos major universities and museums are right in downtown. (IE: university of Toronto with its historic architecture). Contrast that with the University of Chicago which is remote from the action and in a beautiful but cutoff neighborhood surrounded by blighted and burnout neighborhood. I like cities, where the major universities are integrated into the cities core area.
Some people may find bars open late, easy liquor licenses may make a city have a more vibrant nightlife, but it can also make it more rowdy and immature. Tame nightlife is simply more like "mature nightlife for me. I prefer neighborhoods with people one represented from as many different countries as possible. I think outside of River North/Mag Mile/Gold Coast, I have a very hard time believing that Chicago has any more "glitz" than Toronto.
But anyway, just my 2 cents.
I know you aren't a fan of young and rowdy drunk people but don't forget too - The legal drinking age in Toronto is 19 - You should see all them from WNY and MI on a Saturday night at 3AM on King street West or on College Street or on Church street in the gay villiage - anything but tame!. Im glad you mentioned the architecture of the UofT and its proximity to the DT core.. Most people don't experience that when they come to Toronto but they should - its excellent gothic-revival stuff!
The Big Three film festivals are Berlin, Cannes and Venice. Toronto is not #2 in the world. You really love making stuff up, no? In North America, I would put Toronto behind Sundance even. And in terms of the film industry of course the most important city is Los Angeles, considering those film festivals only serve to build buzz for the Academy Awards, which is the most important film event. Heck, Toronto isn't even the most important film city in Canada! Vancouver is much more important as a filming location and Montreal churns out better indies.
I think Vancouver and Toronto are on about the same footing in this regard. Since 2011 Ontario has supplanted B.C as the largest film production region in Canada and 3rd largest in N.A after California and NYS. Toronto also has a the largest film studio in Canada - Pinewood and the largest distribution company - Alliance Atlantis so id give the overall nod to Toronto over Vancouver in 2015.
I would agree about Montreal regarding Indies or local and native productions given that it is the most prominent French Canadian city and is surrounded by a sea of anglo trying to protect itself from that - is it any shock lol..
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) I wouldn't be shocked if TIFF surpassed them by some objective metrics, but to pretend that it's the undisputed #2 in the world is a bit homerrific.
