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Which PCSA city is the most paradoxical in terms of population metrics? As in which city has the most stark differences when going from one metric to the others relative to its population fluctuating? Another way to ask this is, when you look at each city's population for each metric, which city appears to gain the most when going from one metric to any of the other metrics with regard to population gain?
City: 13. San Francisco: 864,816 (2015)
22. Washington D.C.: 672,228 (2015)
23. Boston: 667,137 (2015)
United States' Urban Area (UA): 08. Washington D.C.: 4,586,770 (2010)
10. Boston: 4,181,019 (2010)
13. San Francisco-Oakland: 3,281,212 (2010)
United States' Urban Agglomerations: 04. Boston: 6,692,295 (2010)
05. Washington DC-Baltimore: 6,585,315 (2010)
06. San Francisco Bay Area: 5,870,212 (2010)
United Nations' Urban Area (UA): 65. San Francisco Bay Area: 5,955,000 (2016)
80. Washington D.C.: 4,950,000 (2016)
91. Boston: 4,490,000 (2016)
Metropolitan Statistical Areas (MSA): 06. Washington D.C.: 6,097,684 (2015)
10. Boston: 4,774,321 (2015)
11. San Francisco-Oakland: 4,656,132 (2015)
Combined Statistical Areas (CSA): 04. Washington DC-Baltimore: 9,625,360 (2015)
05. San Francisco Bay Area: 8,713,914 (2015)
06. Boston: 8,152,573 (2015)
I chose these three places specifically because it seems that they garner the most flak amongst debaters with regard to their different metrics (in particular the controversial CSA metric).
Which city, after viewing through all the various population metrics, has the most paradoxical (contradicting/contrasting) set of metrics available?
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Well all three of the CSA's do "over inflate" the population numbers in these cities, I would say obviously DC is has the most inflated CSA number because it's almost 1 million higher than the next city.
However I think your question should be less about population totals as every CSA is over inflated, even NYC is not 23 million people I mean geez. I think its pretty obvious to people now why the population numbers in CSA's look so over inflated.
The better comparison in these three cities are things like, diversity total and percentage, employment numbers and CBD's the further you get from each central city, cultural amenities/activities/events/convention space, travel and tourism numbers of each city, and maybe even GDP.
To me it's neat to compare how each of these cities/metros change or "add on" the further you expand on those metrics more so than the obvious, population.
Last edited by the resident09; 05-30-2016 at 12:16 AM..
DC. The CSA metric inflates its population from an already large, self-contained metro from another already large city. Does DC really feel like a metro if 9 million people? Better yet, does Baltimore feel like a metro of 9 million people?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KodeBlue
DC. The CSA metric is pulling population from a different metro. Does DC really feel like a metro if 9 million people? Better yet, does Baltimore feel like a metro of 9 million people?
All three of the CSA's do this which is the point of the thread. Does Boston feel like a metro of 8.1 million, or better yet does Providence RI? Heck does NYC feel like 23 million people? Not IMO.
Last edited by the resident09; 05-30-2016 at 10:59 AM..
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Also Red John I think it would have been most fair to post the top two central cities in each metro population at the top of the thread because each of these are multi-nodal CSA's. There is no DC- Baltimore CSA without Baltimore and no SF Bay Area CSA without San Jose etc. Posting the population of SJ, Balt, and Providence may give even more clarity to those who need to see the numbers to reflect how much each city/metro "adds on" as it expands its definition. San Jose city is larger in pop than SF, DC and Baltimore population is almost the same number, only Providence/ Boston has that much of a drastic difference.
All three of the CSA's do this which is the point of the thread. Does Boston feel like a metro of 8.1 million, or better yet does Providence RI? Heck does NYC feel like 23 million people? Not IMO.
I know what the point if the thread is. The Bay Area, I could see, as they seem more cohesive the of the CSAs. Boston, 8 million..no. Baltimore at 9 million??? Hell no. Those cities feel like what their MSA populations suggest. DC feels like a city the size of Philly or Atlanta, Miami, and other cities with similar sized metros. Baltimore feels like a metro of close to 3 million. That's why I personally think that CSAs are a pointless metric.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KodeBlue
I know what the point if the thread is. The Bay Area, I could see, as they seem more cohesive the of the CSAs. Boston, 8 million..no. Baltimore at 9 million??? Hell no. Those cities feel like what their MSA populations suggest. DC feels like a city the size of Philly or Atlanta, Miami, and other cities with similar sized metros. Baltimore feels like a metro of close to 3 million. That's why I personally think that CSAs are a pointless metric.
The CSA metric is far from pointless in a metro like DC-Baltimore because there are two large metros on top of each other merging into one CSA. You're right that's what DC and Baltimore may feel like separate, but unlike Philly Atlanta and Miami they run into each other's metro's 20 minutes out from each central city. But yes I agree the Bay Area is more cohesive, almost like one MSA.
The egregious part of CSA population is not combining places like DC and Baltimore into one region, they are only 35 miles apart. It's adding places like Chambersburg, PA or Hagerstown, MD to the CSA total that over extends. However, this is apparent in CSA metrics across the country not just here.
The reason they have such variant population is all the same. there are sizable cities that are connected to the central city, but not suburbs.
Providence, Worcester, Manchester combined have about 2,000,000 in their MSAs.
SF/Oakland add significantly populated San Jose.
DC adds Baltimore.
Now I think Baltimore is the most iffy, where the central city of that Metropolitan area has the least connection to the most major city in the metro. While Providence, Worcester and San Jose have rather strong connection city to city with Boston or San Francisco, while the DC/Baltimore seems more common suburbs.
They have such a huge difference though because most MSA's add some rural counties not major metropolitan areas.
Well all three of the CSA's do "over inflate" the population numbers in these cities, I would say obviously DC is has the most inflated CSA number because it's almost 1 million higher than the next city.
However I think your question should be less about population totals as every CSA is over inflated, even NYC is not 23 million people I mean geez. I think its pretty obvious to people now why the population numbers in CSA's look so over inflated.
The better comparison in these three cities are things like, diversity total and percentage, employment numbers and CBD's the further you get from each central city, cultural amenities/activities/events/convention space, travel and tourism numbers of each city, and maybe even GDP.
To me it's neat to compare how each of these cities/metros change or "add on" the further you expand on those metrics more so than the obvious, population.
odal.
All of the metrics listed by Red John are valid in their own way. However, at the end of the day the day the population listed does live within whatever definition used, but there is a lot of personal perception, history, and built environment to consider, too.
For example, Houston's MSA is 10k sqmi with 6M+ pop and forumers here are comfortable with that, while Boston CMSA is 10k sqmi with 8M+ and forumers are uncomfortable with that. Those populations really exist within those 10k sqmi boundaries. IMHO, people in Boston's CMSA are as connected as those in Houston's MSA of the same size. A big difference is Boston's CMSA has a number of cities in it that people identify with more than they do with Boston, so while they all drive on the same roads, root for the sports teams, and go to the same beaches, etc, many folks would say I'm from Providence rather than Boston while most people near Houston would say they are from the Houston area even if they live 50 miles outside the city.
The "Bay Area" is a nice moniker to bring all the cities in the CMSA under one roof. Maybe people in Boston, Providence, and Worcester could adopt "southeast New England", but I think there is too much local pride for that.
The CSA metric is far from pointless in a metro like DC-Baltimore because there are two large metros on top of each other merging into one CSA. You're right that's what DC and Baltimore may feel like separate, but unlike Philly Atlanta and Miami they run into each other's metro's 20 minutes out from each central city. But yes I agree the Bay Area is more cohesive, almost like one MSA.
The egregious part of CSA population is not combining places like DC and Baltimore into one region, they are only 35 miles apart. It's adding places like Chambersburg, PA or Hagerstown, MD to the CSA total that over extends. However, this is apparent in CSA metrics across the country not just here.
They feel separate because they are separate. That's why it's not a single MSA.
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