U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S. > City vs. City
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-26-2017, 03:18 PM
 
Location: California x North Carolina (soon)...
3,312 posts, read 2,238,620 times
Reputation: 3660

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
Raleigh is one of the fastest growing areas, especially economically and in population, that we have seen in recent history. IMO I do not get the big draw but certainly all the research universities and research triangle are 90%. It's a nice town, I just don't get why everyone is flocking there when there are many other mid sized southern cities which IMO are more urban and in some ways, nicer.
A major appeal of Raleigh besides what others have mentioned is that it's the capital of one of the most prosperous states in the country. It helps cultivate that prosperity and also reaps the benefits of it. From that perspective, I definitely see the appeal--few states in modern America are as appealing and/or doing better than North Carolina, across a variety of factors...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Aristotle View Post
Ok, if you say so but I beg to differ having lived and traveled all over this fair country. It does fairly well in those categories depending upon where you wanna live in the metro. I mean where do you people live with all that superior urbanity, walkability, yada yada...Noo York?...as they say...Git-da-f-outta hear wid dat.

So a city's walkability or vibrancy score is 10pts higher in some useless index and that makes it better? Really, come on, 2-3 more blocks of urbanity in "insert city name" and the superiority attitude? I always get a kick out that one. "We have more culture, urbanity, walkable, etc"...but but RDU keeps growing, why? Because that shat is overrated and RDU does ok for what most folks need or desire...ya'll ain't NYC or Philly.
Raleigh is doing well in all those areas besides urbanity and walkability--it has porous walkability and even you have to admit that. It's urbanity Is that typical North Carolina suburban/urban thing, where living in the central and most popular neighborhoods still have a high suburban character. I suppose that suburban-urban dynamic is still a type of urbanity on some level, and many people enjoy it comfortably, so whatever. But don't act like peer cities have just "two or three" more blocks of urbanity. Raleigh has several, if not most, of its peer cities that are far more urban than it...

But to reiterate, it is doing very well for itself otherwise and has a better vibrancy than people realize...

Raleigh's appeal to me are it's low crime, comfortable living, has one of the highest wealth and income rates in its weight class with one of the lowest poverty rates, is one of the most diverse cities in its weight class, and offers good educational routes and has workable nightlife and other cultural amenities. I appreciate it for those reasons. I would never choose Indianapolis over it--i value NC over Indiana, I value Raleigh's location more, a few other things...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-26-2017, 03:39 PM
 
3,382 posts, read 2,951,927 times
Reputation: 3242
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter1948 View Post
No....like pretty much all of Raleigh's peer city beat it in architecture, urbanity, and culture. Some similar size cities even crush it there.

The fact is, Raleigh was a small town for 95% of its history, and just recently came into its own as a medium-large metro.

A city like Indy has been a medium large city for 120 years. I actually prefer Raleigh to Indy for various reasons, but Indy blows it out as far as downtown, urbanity, architecture, etc.

Raleigh's advantages are weather, the universities, and research triangle. What happens is a lot of smart students graduate and say hey, this is easy living, cheap. Let me make a life here. You get that plus a lot of in migration from the urban northeast and you get an economic and population boom. Raleigh also was smart to build the freeways outside of the urban core (which is TINY compared to even Indy).
I have lived in both places and the things you've emphasized are in fact not that big a deal for most people. Now if someone prefers the hustle bustle of NYC or Chicago, that might be a deal breaker. I don't think you can "trick" people into settling if a certain level of culture, urbanity, etc was devoid. If the OP prefers a "city" that has some of those big city elements, Indy is a great compromise.

I have never put much weight on culture, arch, etc preference because that is extremely subjective and y'all making Indy sound like Rome. I like Indy a lot but the hyperbole is out of control.

I do get where you're coming from that Indy is underrated and lil ole tired ass Raleigh is hyped like Rome for some people...relax, other metros just don't have the branding expertise because I don't think many people expected this level of interest. Again, I saw it coming being an under devoloped and under utilized area on the East Coast...

Last edited by Big Aristotle; 06-26-2017 at 03:54 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-26-2017, 03:56 PM
 
6,295 posts, read 13,173,944 times
Reputation: 2789
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Aristotle View Post
I have lived in both places and the things you've emphasized are in fact not that big a deal for most people. Now if someone prefers the hustle bustle of NYC or Chicago, that might be a deal breaker. I don't think you can "trick" people into settling if a certain level of culture, urbanity, etc was devoid. If the OP prefers a "city" that has some of those big city elements, Indy is a great compromise.

I have never put much weight on culture, arch, etc preference because that is extremely subjective and y'all making Indy sound like Rome. I like Indy a lot but the hyperbole is out of control.

I do get where you're coming from that Indy is underrated and lil ole tired ass Raleigh is hyped like Rome for some people.
I don't totally disagree. In fact, 90% of your "typical American" probably prefer the "newer, cleaner" feel of Raleigh. But urban nerds who populate these internet sites will always prefer the historic charm, density, and walkability. Indy blows Raleigh out of the water there, and trust me, I am no fan of Indy as outside of a 2 mile radius from downtown, and a small section on the north side in Broad Ripple, the city is full of lots of crime and decay until you get to the suburbs. In fact, Carmel IN reminds me very much of Cary, NC. I noticed that on a recent trip to NC
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-26-2017, 05:26 PM
 
1,480 posts, read 1,287,072 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Aristotle View Post
I lived there and it felt isolated compared to Raleigh/Durham where Indy is surrounded by corn fields. Greensboro, Greenville, Columbia, SC all have metros close to or over 1 million people. Plus when you get to DC you're basically in the NE corridor (Baltimore, Philly, etc).

Driving 100 miles out there seems like 300 miles. Dress it up all you want to, it's extremely different travel along the east coast hitting town/city after town/city than it was out there. Even traveling from the east coast was tough having to cross the mountains at some point.
I don't get your point. Indy is closer to more major metropolitan centers point blank. Cornfields have nothing to do with proximity to other cities. That's like me saying I see plenty of trailer homes driving through North Carolina (which isn't relevant to the topic yet true).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-26-2017, 06:05 PM
_OT
 
Location: Miami
2,051 posts, read 1,292,138 times
Reputation: 1657
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Aristotle View Post
Ok, if you say so but I beg to differ having lived and traveled all over this fair country. It does fairly well in those categories depending upon where you wanna live in the metro. I mean where do you people live with all that superior urbanity, walkability, yada yada...Noo York?...as they say...Git-da-f-outta hear wid dat.

So a city's walkability or vibrancy score is 10pts higher in some useless index and that makes it better? Really, come on, 2-3 more blocks of urbanity in "insert city name" and the superiority attitude? I always get a kick out that one. "We have more culture, urbanity, walkable, etc"...but but RDU keeps growing, why? Because that shat is overrated and RDU does ok for what most folks need or desire...ya'll ain't NYC or Philly.
lol where? Raleigh when compared to it's peers, lacks very much in the Urbanity department considering that those other cities were much more developed DECADES before Raleigh really even started to grow and develop. We're not talking about 2-3 more blocks, we're talking about 2-3 more neighborhoods. Raleigh's only cohesive walkabile/urban area is it's Downtown...

Millennials are attracted to Culture, Urbanity, Walkability, and etc. It really depends on the individual, it might be overrated to you, but it's a real large draw to bring in Millennials into certain cities. And from what I've seen, Raleigh doesn't really have any distinct culture, ground-level vibrancy, urbanity, or a large array of things to do. But that doesn't mean it's not one of the largest growing cities in the US. Different strokes for different folks...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-26-2017, 07:05 PM
 
1,480 posts, read 1,287,072 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by murksiderock View Post
Raleigh's appeal to me are it's low crime, comfortable living, has one of the highest wealth and income rates in its weight class with one of the lowest poverty rates, is one of the most diverse cities in its weight class, and offers good educational routes and has workable nightlife and other cultural amenities. I appreciate it for those reasons. I would never choose Indianapolis over it--i value NC over Indiana, I value Raleigh's location more, a few other things...
You're not a Indy fan and have an east coast bias which is ok. But seriously, Indianapolis metropolitan area has area which are quite a bit wealthier than Raleigh metropolitan. Raleigh has no area with the level of affluency of a Boone or Hamilton county. Also, Indy has better nightlife and cultural amenities than Raleigh.

This Census Bureau interactive map illustrates my point. Compare Indy Metro (central Indiana) to anything in North Carolina.

https://www.census.gov/dataviz/visualizations/019/

CD likes to rag on Indy but as a city it isn't the rag people try to make it out to be.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-27-2017, 07:08 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
20,955 posts, read 15,267,317 times
Reputation: 23722
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyadic View Post
I don't get your point. Indy is closer to more major metropolitan centers point blank. Cornfields have nothing to do with proximity to other cities. That's like me saying I see plenty of trailer homes driving through North Carolina (which isn't relevant to the topic yet true).
Yeah, I don't understand how someone can claim Raleigh is more centrally located than Indy to other desirable destinations. It's really in a fairly far flung places. It's not really close to the metros in SC like Charlotte or Asheville. The parts of VA it's close to, IMO, aren't that desirable. Eastern NC doesn't have much.

I haven't been to Raleigh in several years, but one thing that I was always got me was just how difficult it is to get to from east TN. There is no short or convenient way to get there.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-27-2017, 08:04 AM
 
Location: California x North Carolina (soon)...
3,312 posts, read 2,238,620 times
Reputation: 3660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyadic View Post
You're not a Indy fan and have an east coast bias which is ok. But seriously, Indianapolis metropolitan area has area which are quite a bit wealthier than Raleigh metropolitan. Raleigh has no area with the level of affluency of a Boone or Hamilton county. Also, Indy has better nightlife and cultural amenities than Raleigh.

This Census Bureau interactive map illustrates my point. Compare Indy Metro (central Indiana) to anything in North Carolina.

https://www.census.gov/dataviz/visualizations/019/

CD likes to rag on Indy but as a city it isn't the rag people try to make it out to be.
This is where you have me confused and it's clear that you are just looking for a fight with anyone who opposes Indy:

I'm not "ragging" on Indianapolis. The reasons in which I stated Raleigh appeals to me, aren't because I said Indianapolis doesn't have those things. What appeals to me about Raleigh has nothing to do with Indianapolis at all, and would be appealing to me no matter what city I'm comparing to...

I said Raleigh has one of the best income and poverty rates of its size class. No matter who I compare Raleigh to, that would hold true, so you reading that as a "rag" on Indy is an insecurity on your part...

I said that I prefer North Carolina to Indiana and Raleigh's location to Indianapolis. Once again these arent meant as disrespects to Indy. I'm also not the person who called Indy isolated and I don't agree with that statement, so my preference of Raleigh's location has nothing to do with Indy other than I don't value it's location more. North Carolina is a much more enticing state than Indiana, to me, on many levels that I consider important....

So you're meaning to reaffirm that Indianapolis isn't one of my favorite cities; but hell, neither is Raleigh. Both are highly suburban. Both have largely unimpressive architecture. I wouldn't even consider the Durham portion of the Triangle because personally I'm not a Durham fan and would rarely, if ever, venture to that side of the metro; that side has little value to me. Indianapolis has the look and feel and presence of a much larger city than Raleigh and as a city is in a higher class. Yet Raleigh is more diverse, is geographically prettier, and is in a state I find much more interesting, overall...

Im not sure who has better nightlife and vibrancy, but I will say that Raleigh is underrated for its vibrancy. It certainly isn't the most vibrant city but it has more to offer than I think people realize, and you know what? I'd characterize Indy the same way: a city that pales in urban scale and vibrancy to some of its peers but is a lot closer, with more things to do, than people give it credit for. And I'm not the biggest fan of either city, so either I'm "ragging" on neither, or I'm "ragging" on both...

Tuck your insecurities away....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-27-2017, 08:16 AM
 
27,720 posts, read 24,737,149 times
Reputation: 16450
Quote:
Originally Posted by murksiderock View Post
I wouldn't even consider the Durham portion of the Triangle because personally I'm not a Durham fan and would rarely, if ever, venture to that side of the metro; that side has little value to me.
Really? That's interesting since Durham has more of that urban, gritty aesthetic that you like (more reminiscent of Richmond than Raleigh, especially with the tobacco history) and its downtown has come a long way in recent years.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-27-2017, 08:43 AM
 
Location: California x North Carolina (soon)...
3,312 posts, read 2,238,620 times
Reputation: 3660
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Really? That's interesting since Durham has more of that urban, gritty aesthetic that you like (more reminiscent of Richmond than Raleigh, especially with the tobacco history) and its downtown has come a long way in recent years.
Yeah, I'm not a fan. Last time I was in Durham was last summer, went to a nightclub downtown with an old friend (can't remember the name) Last July or August and wasn't too impressed. I've been back to Raleigh several times since then, at least 4 times, and I never think about going to Durham...

I have a long history with Durham. Though I never lived there, I worked there on 751 for several weeks with an old company I worked for. I dated a girl there that i really liked but didnt work out (lol), and I've had a list of former associates and such I used to hang out with there. It's too sleepy for me, and the local culture is just...uninspiring. I can think of a few other adjectives but this is probably a convo best suited for private or off this board so as to not offend anyone...

I do like how downtown has turned. The first time I visited Durham as a 17-year old in 2006 to today, it has taken on very impressive growth. The downtown and the city are still too small-townish for my tastes, though, and besides Southpoint and DPAC on occasion, I can't think of another Durham location I'd frequent if I moved to The Triangle...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > General U.S. > City vs. City
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top