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However, someone else already mentioned that Philly has much smaller streets and Queens has a lot of very wide ones. I think that parts of Queens that are more densely populated than Philly can sometimes actually be less structurally dense and therefore may actually feel less urban than they are. Some wide streets do have urban benefits though. I always hated how wide Queens blvd was, though the reason for that is for the massive Queens blvd subway line that runs underneath it, which I cannot imagine Queens without.
Not taking issue with your overall points in that post; I agree with them.
But wrt one of mine:
Queens Boulevard = Roosevelt Boulevard with apartment buildings and a subway line.
Philadelphia's most-desperately-needed subway extension would run under "the Boulevard" were it ever to get built (a prospect that continues to recede into the mists of time).
And there was that comparison another (Northwest) Philly resident made between that one Queens neighborhood and Tacony.
Northeast Philly really is our answer to Queens, only far less dense. And that includes the ethnic-diversity part: the Lower Northeast has become Philadelphia's immigrant magnet. You'll find Brazilians, Dominicans, Koreans, Jamaicans, and a few other nationalities scattered across the area from Oxford Circle through Castor Gardens over to the Boulevard at Cottman Avenue. The Russians inhabit the Far Northeast's northwest corner. I think there are even a few Mongolians up that way; the city's only Mongolian restaurant is somewhere along Castor Avenue in either Castor Gardens or Rhawnhurst.
Edited to add: Speaking of houses, I saw an article in The New York Times a few months ago about a couple of guys who have created a Website or documentary or something along those lines featuring photos of Queens' very diverse housing stock. Its name was a no-brainer: "All the Queens Houses."
Population and density are pretty important but I think people often discount the built form and structural density. Philly is so human scaled and with blocks and blocks of connected buildings on narrow streets while Queens often has huge boulevards and many detached homes-even though these homes are often multi-family it gives the appearance of a less urban form.
The same is also true for sections of Philly. The Northeast was largely developed after WWII and has a different urban form from older parts of the city. Even Washington Avenue, which is only a few blocks away from the city's historic urban core, is far from a pedestrian paradise and has been retrofitted to a large degree for automobile use. Then of course, there are large swaths of Northwest Philly that are far more sedate than almost anything in Queens.
The same is also true for sections of Philly. The Northeast was largely developed after WWII and has a different urban form from older parts of the city. Even Washington Avenue, which is only a few blocks away from the city's historic urban core, is far from a pedestrian paradise and has been retrofitted to a large degree for automobile use. Then of course, there are large swaths of Northwest Philly that are far more sedate than almost anything in Queens.
Yeah and some of those areas you're talking about may have semidetached houses, but they're still visually and functionally less urban if they have huge front and side setbacks. I bet a Queens Village block of barely detached SFH would be more dense than some of the aforementioned Philly blocks.
Yeah and some of those areas you're talking about may have semidetached houses, but they're still visually and functionally less urban if they have huge front and side setbacks. I bet a Queens Village block of barely detached SFH would be more dense than some of the aforementioned Philly blocks.
If you were to arrange a list of neighborhoods in each city in the order of most urban to least urban, Philly would lose handily across the board with the exception of Market West. Toss in University City and Philly gets up to two wins.
If you were to arrange a list of neighborhoods in each city in the order of most urban to least urban, Philly would lose handily across the board with the exception of Market West. Toss in University City and Philly gets up to two wins.
Queens only, or all of NYC?
And do you think people underestimate Queens' urbanity due to all the vinyl?
Queens only. You'd have to cherrypick the most urban parts of Philadelphia to make your case while completely ignoring vast spanses of the city. The Northeast is about 1/3rd of the city's land mass and much more of it resembles Rising Sun Avenue than Passyunk Avenue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by l1995
And do you think people underestimate Queens' urbanity due to all the vinyl?
Queens is a mixed bag of residential structures, so it has a noticeably less urban feel than the Brooklyn and the Bronx (though the Bronx has sections that feel rather similar). Some people call it the "family" borough for this reason but there are many parts that are structurally denser than any place in America outside of Manhattan and maybe SF. It's also important to point out that while it's considered an auto-centric borough, it still has a lower rate of car ownership than Philly, DC, SF, Boston and Chicago.
Queens only. You'd have to cherrypick the most urban parts of Philadelphia to make your case while completely ignoring vast spanses of the city. The Northeast is about 1/3rd of the city's land mass and much more of it resembles Rising Sun Avenue than Passyunk Avenue.
Queens is a mixed bag of residential structures, so it has a noticeably less urban feel than the Brooklyn and the Bronx (though the Bronx has sections that feel rather similar). Some people call it the "family" borough for this reason but there are many parts that are structurally denser than any place in America outside of Manhattan and maybe SF. It's also important to point out that while it's considered an auto-centric borough, it still has a lower rate of car ownership than Philly, DC, SF, Boston and Chicago.
Good point.
I don't even find Queens to be that autocentric, I'm in Southeast Queens a lot (which is one of the more autocentric parts of the borough) and many people do not own cars. They even have accordion buses going through SE Queens now.
And the neighborhoods with subway access are generally not autocentric at all. I would argue that most, if not all of the neighborhoods along the 7 train are extremely urban. Does Philly have any residential neighborhoods as intense as Jackson Heights and Elmhurst?
In terms of urban identity, Philly actually does its own thing while Queens is pretty much obscured in Manhattan’s shadow. Brooklyn is the only other borough that can claim some sort of recognizable identity outside of the NY metro.
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