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I can't believe I forgot to mention Boston. I was told it was "small" by people from NY and Philly before, and I've read on this very board NY and Philly posters calling it the same. Bit Boston has such an outstanding influence, I thought I was in for a very large city...
It's large, but I've written this before: the perfect "real feel" comp for Boston is Atlanta. Boston feels noticeably (though not dramatically so) smaller than DC and SF. Which falls in line with it feeling smaller than Philadelphia, too. It's not just that it's compact and tight. It lacks the same degree of traffic and frenzied public transportation usage as those cities, on an overall scale...
But it absolutely feels about Atlanta-sized (and Dallas, too). The MSA, CSA, and Necta all manage to get Boston wrong lol. A real feel is somewhere in the ballpark of 5.7 to 5.8 million. Larger than its MSA/Necta and comparable to Dallas and Atlanta (in size), but smaller than I believed I was getting upon going there...
San Francisco feels a little larger definitely, somewhere in the 6-6.5 million range...
I think that when walking around the city centers, Boston, DC, Philly, and San Francisco all feel very similar in size. All of them feel larger than Atlanta or Dallas. But as you get out of the center, things start to change a bit.
I would definitely agree that San Francisco feels larger than Boston when you take in the whole area. Part of it is the sustained density in the developed areas (the peninsula and hills force even the more distant suburbs to be more densely developed), but part of it is that SF is part of a trifecta of larger cities (along with Oakland an San Jose). Boston's metro population is a little more decentralized extending from Providence in the South to Manchester in the North and Worcester to the West. It's much lower density over that area, again, due to topographic interruptions in the built environment in the Bay Area. To me, the Bay Area feels the largest of the bunch by a decent margin.
I agree that Philadelphia feels bigger than Boston too. It's a larger city and you can feel that.
I still think DC and Boston feel pretty comparable. I've lived in Both. I'd argue that Boston actually feels like a slightly larger city at the core, but DC gets the edge in the 'burbs due to the higher density development around transit stations. If you asked me which other city in the US feels most similar in size to Boston, it'd be DC.
I think Boston feels notably larger than Atlanta or Dallas in the city center. Both get too much flak for being "suburban" cities, but they are much less dense, and far more spread out. In the downtown area and the inner neighborhoods, Boston feels quite a bit bigger because it's far more dense and the population and activity are so much more centered around the core.
I think that when walking around the city centers, Boston, DC, Philly, and San Francisco all feel very similar in size. All of them feel larger than Atlanta or Dallas. But as you get out of the center, things start to change a bit.
I would definitely agree that San Francisco feels larger than Boston when you take in the whole area. Part of it is the sustained density in the developed areas (the peninsula and hills force even the more distant suburbs to be more densely developed), but part of it is that SF is part of a trifecta of larger cities (along with Oakland an San Jose). Boston's metro population is a little more decentralized extending from Providence in the South to Manchester in the North and Worcester to the West. It's much lower density over that area, again, due to topographic interruptions in the built environment in the Bay Area. To me, the Bay Area feels the largest of the bunch by a decent margin.
I agree that Philadelphia feels bigger than Boston too. It's a larger city and you can feel that.
I still think DC and Boston feel pretty comparable. I've lived in Both. I'd argue that Boston actually feels like a slightly larger city at the core, but DC gets the edge in the 'burbs due to the higher density development around transit stations. If you asked me which other city in the US feels most similar in size to Boston, it'd be DC.
I think Boston feels notably larger than Atlanta or Dallas in the city center. Both get too much flak for being "suburban" cities, but they are much less dense, and far more spread out. In the downtown area and the inner neighborhoods, Boston feels quite a bit bigger because it's far more dense and the population and activity are so much more centered around the core.
I think that when walking around the city centers, Boston, DC, Philly, and San Francisco all feel very similar in size. All of them feel larger than Atlanta or Dallas. But as you get out of the center, things start to change a bit.
I would definitely agree that San Francisco feels larger than Boston when you take in the whole area. Part of it is the sustained density in the developed areas (the peninsula and hills force even the more distant suburbs to be more densely developed), but part of it is that SF is part of a trifecta of larger cities (along with Oakland an San Jose). Boston's metro population is a little more decentralized extending from Providence in the South to Manchester in the North and Worcester to the West. It's much lower density over that area, again, due to topographic interruptions in the built environment in the Bay Area. To me, the Bay Area feels the largest of the bunch by a decent margin.
I agree that Philadelphia feels bigger than Boston too. It's a larger city and you can feel that.
I still think DC and Boston feel pretty comparable. I've lived in Both. I'd argue that Boston actually feels like a slightly larger city at the core, but DC gets the edge in the 'burbs due to the higher density development around transit stations. If you asked me which other city in the US feels most similar in size to Boston, it'd be DC.
I think Boston feels notably larger than Atlanta or Dallas in the city center. Both get too much flak for being "suburban" cities, but they are much less dense, and far more spread out. In the downtown area and the inner neighborhoods, Boston feels quite a bit bigger because it's far more dense and the population and activity are so much more centered around the core.
This is pretty much all we need to know about cities and how large or small they feel.
To me it does, and in real life, they are around the same size
Metros of same size feel the same size regardless of density, or the size of the central city...imo.
But if I had to choose, Philly feels, ever so slightly, smaller than DC and Atlanta.
To me it does, and in real life, they are around the same size
Metros of same size feel the same size regardless of density, or the size of the central city...imo.
But if I had to choose, Philly feels, ever so slightly, smaller than DC and Atlanta.
Someone living in Decatur generally will actually be in Atlanta much more than someone from Tucker, GA. Just because it's like 1/2 the distance someone is more likely to go into town for dinner or shopping or whatever.
So even if City population isn't a great indicator a sprawling metro doesdetract from the size a city feels because people on the outskirts on average will go in to the city in leisure less.
Stand on Walnut or Market in Center city vs Peachtree in Atlanta and tell me those cities feel the same size.
Someone living in Decatur generally will actually be in Atlanta much more than someone from Tucker, GA. Just because it's like 1/2 the distance someone is more likely to go into town for dinner or shopping or whatever.
So even if City population isn't a great indicator a sprawling metro doesdetract from the size a city feels because people on the outskirts on average will go in to the city in leisure less.
Stand on Walnut or Market in Center city vs Peachtree in Atlanta and tell me those cities feel the same size.
Actually if you're standing on Peachtree in downtown proper, especially closer to Fairlie-Poplar, the two cities don't feel all that different in size and activity, at least during daytime hours. But it goes without saying that Center City is much more fully built out and dense than the core of Atlanta so there will be more parts of Center City that give you a bigger city feel than in Atlanta.
I'll throw some down from my corner of the nation. Some of these are better known cities locally:
Seattle is bigger than I initially believed. I'm from Portland Oregon and always thought the two cities were comparably sized.
On the flip side of that same coin, Portland seems smaller than it is. it is a moderate sized city and metro of 600k to 2.5m people, but I am always impressed with how little activity there is or how few resources considering the population size.
Spokane Washington is smaller than Boise Idaho. I have always sworn with my life that the opposite was true.
Billings Montana is much larger than any city in Montana has any right to be.
And lastly; Salt Lake City feels way larger than it actually is. Except on Sundays, when the entire city demonstrates its impressive ability to go quieter and darker than a Wyoming cowboy town.
Everywhere else I have been is about the right size by my own observations.
Someone living in Decatur generally will actually be in Atlanta much more than someone from Tucker, GA. Just because it's like 1/2 the distance someone is more likely to go into town for dinner or shopping or whatever.
So even if City population isn't a great indicator a sprawling metro doesdetract from the size a city feels because people on the outskirts on average will go in to the city in leisure less.
Stand on Walnut or Market in Center city vs Peachtree in Atlanta and tell me those cities feel the same size.
Ironically, that's what makes Atlanta feel like a large city/metro. You know that around 6 million are around somewhere, so there has to be other places around with some action. That's exactly what it feels like when you're there: something is going on somewhere. And as much that goes on in Atlanta, there usually is.
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