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You're right. There are nice parts of the St. Louis area, but I-70 looks horrible because of the frontage roads.
Frontage roads actually make traffic worse, despite claims to the contrary. Their location directly beside the interstate causes problems with exiting traffic being able to merge onto the secondary roads at the end of the exit ramps. This is because the frontage road is usually only a hop, skip, and a jump away from the interchange, and because it includes a traffic light which, when red, forces traffic to block up the intersection so that it becomes very difficult for exiting traffic to merge onto the secondary street, or to even merge, so that they can then take a left onto the frontage road. It results in large numbers of accidents, I'm fairly certain, not to mention that exiting traffic is often backed up onto the interstate which is dangerous.
Frontage roads are also ripe for cheap development and over-development because developers see the proximity and access to the interstate, as well as visuals from the interstate, as prime ground to locate a business. What happens is that you end up with a hodge podge of large towering signs littering the landscape with a plethora of businesses from RV dealerships to restaurants, to office buildings, often within the same general area without any consistency according to how things are usually zoned. It just looks tacky.
St Charles, which has the only frontage roads in the metro area (excepting a 2 mile stretch in Jeffco on I55) has always pretty much sucked, with the exception of the historic downtown area.
I used to live there.
That being said, St Charles is the way it is due to white flight from south StL in the 50s and 60s.
Nuff said?
Everything. They are awful and they are not in StL for the most part, just way out in St Charles County.
As far as Indy vs StL.
St Louis wins this by quite a bit. I think StL is in a complete different tier than Indy when it comes to cities and what they offer residents and tourists. It's really not even close.
and what exactly does STL offer than Indianapolis doesn't?
Everything. They are awful and they are not in StL for the most part, just way out in St Charles County.
As far as Indy vs StL.
St Louis wins this by quite a bit. I think StL is in a complete different tier than Indy when it comes to cities and what they offer residents and tourists. It's really not even close.
Shocking, the KC photo spammer disses Indy once again. Is there a city you dislike more than Indy? I'm guessing you're opinion of the city is based on driving through it on I-70 a few times. (Nah, this is the internet, you'll say you've got family here or something and you've spent a considerable amount of time here and we'll be expected to believe it.)
Personally, you're beloved KC, which you believe is the brightest beacon of western civilization, does not compare to Indy very well and I know this from living in both. You're a homer so I don't expect you to understand why, but I digress.
As for this comparison, I actually love both cities and believe that both have something different to offer. If I were looking for a great urban neighborhood to live in the StL wins hands down. For anything else, Indy all the way.
Everything. They are awful and they are not in StL for the most part, just way out in St Charles County.
Actually, St Louis has frontage service roads. They may be awful to the eye but it seems to serve it's purpose. It's easier for large vehicles like trucks and tour buses to use them. There's plenty of potential use along the frontage roads. Here check this out.
(scroll to right) potential for an urban like Walmart Supercenter, Target or TA truck stop near the dome. St Louis - Google Maps
Frontage Road along I-70 in St Louis St Louis - Google Maps
Last edited by urbanologist; 12-19-2011 at 12:43 PM..
I'm more than familiar with the thread, I participated in this thread which is why I asked the question. STL doesn't offer anything Indianapolis doesn't and vice versa. Some things STL does better/better suited for and other things Indianapolis is better/better suited for. Both areas have about the same in amenities. STL actually has more hotel rooms than Indianapolis and larger convention center yet, Indianapolis is the better convention city. Professional sports, STL is the better city as the history of the Cards is very rich and deep. STL is older and has more history but Indianapolis is a state capital and plays a more important role in its state and the region where as STL has to compete with Kansas City for everything. Indianapolis doesn't have that issue. Indianapolis has the better downtown but STL has better older neighborhoods downtown adjacent.
The cost of living is about the same, housing is a little cheaper in Indianapolis and Indianapolis still has a better overall economy. The lists can go on and on.
Vlajos: The one thing very prevalent on C-D is that people take into account past histories of cities (when they were at their height and somewhat in a decline TODAY) which often leads to the cities today that are now starting to approach theirs (Austin, CBus, Nashville, Indianapolis, etc) as somehow being less than desirable compared to their older counterparts. No more no less, I've stated in these forums numerous times, if x city was the greatest thing since sliced bread, it would have a population of 300 million, since it doesn't odds are there are places other people find more desirable and fits what they like. New York isn't the end all be all anymore so than Chicago or Boston or LA. We are but a small spec on the world population on C-D and just because we think it doesn't make it so for the world. For example, most people here think living in a suburb is bad even though moving patterns prove that suburbia is preferred by an overwhelming margin from border to border.
Last edited by msamhunter; 12-19-2011 at 01:21 PM..
St Charles, which has the only frontage roads in the metro area (excepting a 2 mile stretch in Jeffco on I55) has always pretty much sucked, with the exception of the historic downtown area.
I used to live there.
That being said, St Charles is the way it is due to white flight from south StL in the 50s and 60s.
Nuff said?
What does "white flight" have to do with frontage roads? There are plenty of areas in this country that developed at the apex of "white flight" and don't have frontage roads.
Frontage roads are also in St Louis so how that ties into "white flight" is beyond me.
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