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Old 10-09-2009, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
15,989 posts, read 30,667,906 times
Reputation: 7280

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Well, compared to Houston and the Metroplex? He is supporting his argument by citing the work of a research institute. Plus, they all have similar-sized economies, metro populations, and growth. The three places look pretty comparable in influence and importance.
That's the problem. We are always put together as if we aren't different and offer the same thing. Houston has one of the fastest growing economy's in the country and widening the gap between it and Dallas, and closing it between it and Boston. No other city in the south has the importance that Houston has.

You're going to actually sit here and say Coke, UPS, CDC, and CNN all are equally as importance to the US economy as oil and energy? That's not going to fly.

Five of the 6 supermajor energy companies are located in Houston (Shell, BP, Exxon Mobil, Conocophillips,and Chevron). *Note I said located, not headquartered*

The Houston metro area accounts for 31% of all US jobs in Oil and gas extraction. Home to 13 of the 20 largest US natural gas transmission companies. Two of the four largest US refineries. Ports rank 1st in International commerce and 6th biggest in the world. 1st in foreign tonnage and 2nd in overall tonnage.

Atlanta can NOT compete with this.

Last edited by blkgiraffe; 10-09-2009 at 08:08 AM..
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:25 AM
 
Location: In the heights
22,119 posts, read 23,634,230 times
Reputation: 11611
Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
That's the problem. We are always put together as if we aren't different and offer the same thing. Houston has one of the fastest growing economy's in the country and widening the gap between it and Dallas, and closing it between it and Boston. No other city in the south has the importance that Houston has.

You're going to actually sit here and say Coke, UPS, CDC, and CNN all are equally as importance to the US economy as oil and energy? That's not going to fly.

Five of the 6 supermajor energy companies are located in Houston (Shell, BP, Exxon Mobil, Conocophillips,and Chevron). *Note I said located, not headquartered*

The Houston metro area accounts for 31% of all US jobs in Oil and gas extraction. Home to 13 of the 20 largest US natural gas transmission companies. Two of the four largest US refineries. Ports rank 1st in International commerce and 6th biggest in the world. 1st in foreign tonnage and 2nd in overall tonnage.

Atlanta can NOT compete with this.
Atlanta's obviously competing on a lot of metrics according to the substantial evidence otherwise. The two are not the same, but are in the same ballpark when it comes to influence. Besides, natural resources doesn't equate to power--this should be evident from the resource-rich countries around the world that are impoverished and the resource-poor that are wealthy.

Atlanta has a strong, diverse economy of comparable size to Houston's. Why would this not put Atlanta in the same ballpark? And of course it's not just the few things you've listed, but the many things that posters from Atlanta have listed. It's not just CNN, but Turner Broadcasting. It's not just the CDC, but also the presence of very strong research universities. And obviously Atlanta doesn't have a port, but its airport is one of the busiest in the world and the city is host to the largest commercial airline (Delta) and package delivery service (UPS), so it is a major player in people and objects that have to be moved with speed (the seas are great for sheer bulk, but definitely not for speed).
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
15,989 posts, read 30,667,906 times
Reputation: 7280
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Atlanta's obviously competing on a lot of metrics according to the substantial evidence otherwise. The two are not the same, but are in the same ballpark when it comes to influence. Besides, natural resources doesn't equate to power--this should be evident from the resource-rich countries around the world that are impoverished and the resource-poor that are wealthy.

Atlanta has a strong, diverse economy of comparable size to Houston's. Why would this not put Atlanta in the same ballpark? And of course it's not just the few things you've listed, but the many things that posters from Atlanta have listed. It's not just CNN, but Turner Broadcasting. It's not just the CDC, but also the presence of very strong research universities. And obviously Atlanta doesn't have a port, but its airport is one of the busiest in the world and the city is host to the largest commercial airline (Delta) and package delivery service (UPS), so it is a major player in people and objects that have to be moved with speed (the seas are great for sheer bulk, but definitely not for speed).
Houston beats Atlanta in research as well. I think what knocks Houston down far is its dominance over the oil in the country. However, that doesn't mean were any less important. We lack appeal and publicity as well. Those things you mention still doesn't qualify ATL has a top 5 ranking city. Houston has a strong hold over oil in this country ,and no other city comes close.

Why do you think Houston gets some of the most funding in the country for Homeland Security? The only other cities that get a large funding is NYC,LA, CHI, and SF. They go through a strict process in determining which cities need the most funding with three steps called Threats, Vulnerability, and Consequences.

They first determine what will terrorist target or want to target the most (Oil, Technology, government, finanace, transportation,etc). Ports have lots of do with the funding due to be the most vulnerable near the coast. However, another thing they think about is how much an impact will it make on the US if attacked. This alone lets you know how much of beast Houston is when it comes to the US economy. NASA is also an easy target.
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Houston
2,026 posts, read 3,674,536 times
Reputation: 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
That's the problem. We are always put together as if we aren't different and offer the same thing. Houston has one of the fastest growing economy's in the country and widening the gap between it and Dallas, and closing it between it and Boston. No other city in the south has the importance that Houston has.

You're going to actually sit here and say Coke, UPS, CDC, and CNN all are equally as importance to the US economy as oil and energy? That's not going to fly.

Five of the 6 supermajor energy companies are located in Houston (Shell, BP, Exxon Mobil, Conocophillips,and Chevron). *Note I said located, not headquartered*

The Houston metro area accounts for 31% of all US jobs in Oil and gas extraction. Home to 13 of the 20 largest US natural gas transmission companies. Two of the four largest US refineries. Ports rank 1st in International commerce and 6th biggest in the world. 1st in foreign tonnage and 2nd in overall tonnage.

Atlanta can NOT compete with this.
The American branch of Shell is based out of Houston, but the company it's self based out of Indonesia. ExxonMobil (the largest company in the country and only second to Shell in the world) is based out of Dallas, but also has a branch in Houston.

I've already made this argument for Houston and Dallas on a different thread and here's what I said:

The Atlanta metro only has 12 Fortune 500 and 24 Fortune 1000. Even then, the whole state of Texas has 118 Fortune 1000 (as apposed to Georgia's 29) and only about 10-12 of them are outside of the DFW and the Houston metro. So that's a little over 100 companies divided between the DFW and Houston (almost in half but Houston with a slight edge). So each of Texas metros have MORE THAN TWICE as many Fortune 500 AND Fortune 1000 companies. Here's a link of Texas' Fortune 1000 if you want to check it out:

Fortune 500 2009: States: Texas Companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

Also, the DFW companies include ExxonMobil (1) and AT&T (8).
Houston companies include ConocoPhillips (4) and Marathon Oil (23).

And all 4 of those companies rank above Atlanta's #1 company, HomeDepot (25).

You would have to really manipulate the numbers and facts for Atlanta to even come close to the corporate power that Houston and Dallas have. You're not going to win that one.


Here is Georgia's Fortune 1000 as well:

Fortune 500 2009: States: Georgia Companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

And in addition, here is a of the city ranking's of the US cities over all over all fortune 500:

Fortune 500 2009: Cities with most companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

And as far as I know, the DFW has about 26 Fortune 500 and Houston has about 28 in it's metro.

So Atlanta's, Houston's, and Dallas's metro ranking's are:

Fortune 500:

Atlanta: 12

Dallas: 26

Houston: 28

So both Houston and Dallas have MORE THAN TWICE the corporate power of Atlanta.

And further more, Houston and Dallas also have a significantly higher GDP and a larger metro population than Atlanta (Houston by over half a million and Dallas over a million).

So anyway I just wanted to add that to your post
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Old 10-09-2009, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
15,989 posts, read 30,667,906 times
Reputation: 7280
Quote:
Originally Posted by wpmeads View Post
The American branch of Shell is based out of Houston, but the company it's self based out of Indonesia. ExxonMobil (the largest company in the country and only second to Shell in the world) is based out of Dallas, but also has a branch in Houston.

I've already made this argument for Houston and Dallas on a different thread and here's what I said:

The Atlanta metro only has 12 Fortune 500 and 24 Fortune 1000. Even then, the whole state of Texas has 118 Fortune 1000 (as apposed to Georgia's 29) and only about 10-12 of them are outside of the DFW and the Houston metro. So that's a little over 100 companies divided between the DFW and Houston (almost in half but Houston with a slight edge). So each of Texas metros have MORE THAN TWICE as many Fortune 500 AND Fortune 1000 companies. Here's a link of Texas' Fortune 1000 if you want to check it out:

Fortune 500 2009: States: Texas Companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

Also, the DFW companies include ExxonMobil (1) and AT&T (8).
Houston companies include ConocoPhillips (4) and Marathon Oil (23).

And all 4 of those companies rank above Atlanta's #1 company, HomeDepot (25).

You would have to really manipulate the numbers and facts for Atlanta to even come close to the corporate power that Houston and Dallas have. You're not going to win that one.


Here is Georgia's Fortune 1000 as well:

Fortune 500 2009: States: Georgia Companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

And in addition, here is a of the city ranking's of the US cities over all over all fortune 500:

Fortune 500 2009: Cities with most companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

And as far as I know, the DFW has about 26 Fortune 500 and Houston has about 28 in it's metro.

So Atlanta's, Houston's, and Dallas's metro ranking's are:

Fortune 500:

Atlanta: 12

Dallas: 26

Houston: 28

So both Houston and Dallas have MORE THAN TWICE the corporate power of Atlanta.

And further more, Houston and Dallas also have a significantly higher GDP and a larger metro population than Atlanta (Houston by over half a million and Dallas over a million).

So anyway I just wanted to add that to your post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
Five of the 6 supermajor energy companies are located in Houston (Shell, BP, Exxon Mobil, Conocophillips,and Chevron). *Note I said located, not headquartered*
That's why I stated "Note I said located, not headquartered" at the end of that sentence. Other than that; thanks for helping me out
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:00 AM
 
Location: Atlanta ,GA
9,086 posts, read 13,283,787 times
Reputation: 2929
Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
That's the problem. We are always put together as if we aren't different and offer the same thing. Houston has one of the fastest growing economy's in the country and widening the gap between it and Dallas, and closing it between it and Boston. No other city in the south has the importance that Houston has.

You're going to actually sit here and say Coke, UPS, CDC, and CNN all are equally as importance to the US economy as oil and energy? That's not going to fly.

Five of the 6 supermajor energy companies are located in Houston (Shell, BP, Exxon Mobil, Conocophillips,and Chevron). *Note I said located, not headquartered*

The Houston metro area accounts for 31% of all US jobs in Oil and gas extraction. Home to 13 of the 20 largest US natural gas transmission companies. Two of the four largest US refineries. Ports rank 1st in International commerce and 6th biggest in the world. 1st in foreign tonnage and 2nd in overall tonnage.

Atlanta can NOT compete with this.
Yeh we know,YOU sound like a broken record:Houston is the CEnter of the world importance because of OIL that they if anything refine not necessarily produce.Tell you what,why dont you drive through many cities in North Texas like Wichita Falls and look at the beautiful grand buildings built in the early 1900's during the first oil boom and see how they are just empty towns with dilapidated building and populations that are now gone.But almost every publication in the world that studies these things rank it well below only YOU are trying to make it appear.Houston is essential to our economy but like I said before,Its NOT the only place in America that could do the job if needed. America would not crumble to the ground without it.Only NYC is maybe the only city that would cause that to happen
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:03 AM
 
Location: Underneath the Pecan Tree
15,989 posts, read 30,667,906 times
Reputation: 7280
Quote:
Originally Posted by afonega1 View Post
Yeh we know,YOU sound like a broken record:Houston is the CEnter of the world importance because of OIL that they if anything refine not necessarily produce.Tell you what,why dont you drive through many cities in North Texas like Wichita Falls and look at the beautiful grand buildings built in the early 1900's during the first oil boom and see how they are just empty towns with dilapidated building and populations that are now gone.But almost every publication in the world that studies these things rank it well below only YOU are trying to make it appear.Houston is essential to our economy but like I said before,Its NOT the only place in America that could do the job if needed. America would not crumble to the ground without it.Only NYC is maybe the only city that would cause that to happen
Yes we all heard how wonderful everything was in Atlanta when Hurricane Ike rolled through.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEJpc4cgbUM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmdBR...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvfjU...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_Mj9...eature=related

Yes; This country doesn't need Houston.
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:08 AM
 
Location: In the heights
22,119 posts, read 23,634,230 times
Reputation: 11611
Quote:
Originally Posted by wpmeads View Post
The American branch of Shell is based out of Houston, but the company it's self based out of Indonesia. ExxonMobil (the largest company in the country and only second to Shell in the world) is based out of Dallas, but also has a branch in Houston.

I've already made this argument for Houston and Dallas on a different thread and here's what I said:

The Atlanta metro only has 12 Fortune 500 and 24 Fortune 1000. Even then, the whole state of Texas has 118 Fortune 1000 (as apposed to Georgia's 29) and only about 10-12 of them are outside of the DFW and the Houston metro. So that's a little over 100 companies divided between the DFW and Houston (almost in half but Houston with a slight edge). So each of Texas metros have MORE THAN TWICE as many Fortune 500 AND Fortune 1000 companies. Here's a link of Texas' Fortune 1000 if you want to check it out:

Fortune 500 2009: States: Texas Companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

Also, the DFW companies include ExxonMobil (1) and AT&T (8).
Houston companies include ConocoPhillips (4) and Marathon Oil (23).

And all 4 of those companies rank above Atlanta's #1 company, HomeDepot (25).

You would have to really manipulate the numbers and facts for Atlanta to even come close to the corporate power that Houston and Dallas have. You're not going to win that one.


Here is Georgia's Fortune 1000 as well:

Fortune 500 2009: States: Georgia Companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

And in addition, here is a of the city ranking's of the US cities over all over all fortune 500:

Fortune 500 2009: Cities with most companies - FORTUNE on CNNMoney.com

And as far as I know, the DFW has about 26 Fortune 500 and Houston has about 28 in it's metro.

So Atlanta's, Houston's, and Dallas's metro ranking's are:

Fortune 500:

Atlanta: 12

Dallas: 26

Houston: 28

So both Houston and Dallas have MORE THAN TWICE the corporate power of Atlanta.

And further more, Houston and Dallas also have a significantly higher GDP and a larger metro population than Atlanta (Houston by over half a million and Dallas over a million).

So anyway I just wanted to add that to your post
The number of Fortune 500 and 1000 companies in Houston and the Metroplex are good arguments in favor of Houston and Dallas though "more than twice" the corporate power of Atlanta is an odd stretch of the facts, isn't it?

However, where are you getting the GDPs and metro populations for the three? I'm using the MSA table on wikipedia sourced from the US Census Bureau for 2008 and those numbers list Atlanta as the smallest but smaller than less than a half a million compared to Houston and less than a million for the Metroplex.
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Atlanta ,GA
9,086 posts, read 13,283,787 times
Reputation: 2929
Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
I did not say it that way.You just cannot realize that.There are other places that could after a short time that could refine oil like Houston.Just a set back.Ill deal with you later I gotta get to work.
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Houston
2,026 posts, read 3,674,536 times
Reputation: 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
The number of Fortune 500 and 1000 companies in Houston and the Metroplex are good arguments in favor of Houston and Dallas though "more than twice" the corporate power of Atlanta is an odd stretch of the facts, isn't it?

However, where are you getting the GDPs and metro populations for the three? I'm using the MSA table on wikipedia sourced from the US Census Bureau for 2008 and those numbers list Atlanta as the smallest but smaller than less than a half a million compared to Houston and less than a million for the Metroplex.
sense you can't seem to do math, I'll do it for you:

12+12=24

24 < 26

24 < 28

And as for the population, all of those list's are estimates. We wont know for sure until the 2010 census come's out.
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