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View Poll Results: Which is LESS southern, Austin or NOVA(North Virginia)?
Austin 34 21.38%
North Virginia 125 78.62%
Voters: 159. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-21-2009, 08:51 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by City Fanatic View Post
I never stated that there wasn't some cultural crossover or overlapping. In general, however, it's still southern.



You're talking about a very small minority composed primarily to the desert areas of California and Bakersfield. In terms of California, the population is so small that its influence on the state is almost nil. However, in the areas of Texas out to Odessa, the "southern" population is in the majority, and it influences the culture hugely.



Not amongst the white population. Illegal-Alien descended Mexicans are Catholic.



A very tiny population of blacks who came from the South. I can find Chinese in Georgia, it doesn't make Georgia Chinese.



Wal-Mart is nationwide. What's your point?



Charlotte is by far larger and more dynamic than Austin.
Austin is a larger city then Charlotte
EVERYONE in California's descendants are from out east
How do you know EVERYONE in Odessa is Southern? Especially when the Mexican population is on the rise.
You mentioned going to WalMart in Odessa, and I didn't see the southern significance in it.
You're right with the Georgia comment. But how does finding southern cuisine in Austin make it southern? Especially when ALL of that cuisine came from out east.
You won't find Catholicism in large amongst Whites anywhere in the US except for the northeast and SOME parts of the Midwest.
The southern culture that you find in Austin was imported from out East, he SAME way a lot of the Mexican culture as many claim, wasn't always part of Texas.
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Old 06-21-2009, 08:54 PM
 
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West Austin isn't southern^^^^
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Old 06-21-2009, 08:57 PM
 
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And Catholicism has been apart of that are for a LOOOONG WHILE with the Spaniards, the French, the Tejanos, the Polish, the Germans.
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Old 06-21-2009, 10:31 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89 View Post
West Austin isn't southern^^^^
Agreed. You go out any reasonable distance west (into the hills), and it's filled with CA transplants. I know, because they are my neighbors... and I'm originally a northern transplant (RI)...

I'm not sure what would make the other poster feel that those older West Austin neighborhoods are more Southern.. Maybe architecture? I suppose it is possible that because those neighborhoods were around when Austin was only 100K or so in population... that could make them more Southern, as Austin was probably a more Southern city at that time. But the rest of the 1.4M that moved in... that's a different story.

Also, Austin has only a handful of what might be called southern-cuisine restaurants. And believe me, you won't find them anywhere near West Austin. No true soul food restaurants, just some comfort-food ones (like Threadgills, Hoover's, Dots, etc). By comparison, you can find hundreds of Vietnamese noodle places. And probably thousands of Tex Mex or Mexican, of course.
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Old 06-22-2009, 12:08 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atxcio View Post
Agreed. You go out any reasonable distance west (into the hills), and it's filled with CA transplants. I know, because they are my neighbors... and I'm originally a northern transplant (RI)...

I'm not sure what would make the other poster feel that those older West Austin neighborhoods are more Southern.. Maybe architecture? I suppose it is possible that because those neighborhoods were around when Austin was only 100K or so in population... that could make them more Southern, as Austin was probably a more Southern city at that time. But the rest of the 1.4M that moved in... that's a different story.

Also, Austin has only a handful of what might be called southern-cuisine restaurants. And believe me, you won't find them anywhere near West Austin. No true soul food restaurants, just some comfort-food ones (like Threadgills, Hoover's, Dots, etc). By comparison, you can find hundreds of Vietnamese noodle places. And probably thousands of Tex Mex or Mexican, of course.
EXACTLY. You're not gonna find many of the TRUE soul food you'll find in Houston. Austin is more like Tex Mex. Austin OVERALL has more of a frontier West feeling. Southern baptist churches doesn't give the area FULL feeling of the South at all. People think just because a place has southern baptist churches, then that place has a southern feeling. What about all the Catholic churches and missions that existed BEFORE the Southern Baptist denomination. Does that not count towards Austins southwesterness? Even if ALOT of the hispanics are recent arrivals, they still had a history in that area.
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Old 06-22-2009, 03:11 AM
 
Location: Austin, Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atxcio View Post
Agreed. You go out any reasonable distance west (into the hills), and it's filled with CA transplants. I know, because they are my neighbors... and I'm originally a northern transplant (RI)...

I'm not sure what would make the other poster feel that those older West Austin neighborhoods are more Southern.. Maybe architecture? I suppose it is possible that because those neighborhoods were around when Austin was only 100K or so in population... that could make them more Southern, as Austin was probably a more Southern city at that time. But the rest of the 1.4M that moved in... that's a different story.

Also, Austin has only a handful of what might be called southern-cuisine restaurants. And believe me, you won't find them anywhere near West Austin. No true soul food restaurants, just some comfort-food ones (like Threadgills, Hoover's, Dots, etc). By comparison, you can find hundreds of Vietnamese noodle places. And probably thousands of Tex Mex or Mexican, of course.
Hoover's is ridiculously good!!!
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Old 06-22-2009, 05:07 AM
 
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Based on my visits to both areas, I would say that Northern Virginia is less southern, hands down. It isn't close.
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Old 06-22-2009, 06:29 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89 View Post
Austin is a larger city then Charlotte
Metro-wise, Austin is smaller. The physical built-up area of Austin is a little smaller, too. Hence, the urbanized region of Charlotte, which in general determines city size, just as much as population does, particularly when the metro population is also higher, is more dynamic.

Quote:
EVERYONE in California's descendants are from out east
Have you ever been to California? It's about as "southern" as Ohio or Montana. California was settled by a combination of southerners, midwesterners, northeasterners, and various immigrant groups. One doesn't tend to dominate. In fact, the accents merged to form a general American accent more than anything.

Quote:
How do you know EVERYONE in Odessa is Southern? Especially when the Mexican population is on the rise.
Everyone in Odessa is not southern. However, I've been there enough to get an overall vibe. I've studied the predominance of accents, the southern Baptist Church, as well as various other examples of southern culture to know that the dominant culture is "southern" in nature. Texas Reb lives in Texas, just ask him.

Most of the Mexican population is that of illegals, or children of illegals. I refuse to acknowledge their invading selves, as they are nothing more than parasites to thousands of cities across the nation.

Quote:
You mentioned going to WalMart in Odessa, and I didn't see the southern significance in it.
There isn't anything southern about Wal-Mart. What I said was that the people in Wal-Mart had easily identifiable southern accents. I provided an example.

Quote:
You're right with the Georgia comment. But how does finding southern cuisine in Austin make it southern? Especially when ALL of that cuisine came from out east.
Texas is still southern, regardless if it is not in the southeast. It's part of the western south.

Can you find southern cuisine outside of the black community in places outside the South? Do people outside the South eat southern cuisine for home-cooked meals to the degree that they do in Texas?

Quote:
You won't find Catholicism in large amongst Whites anywhere in the US except for the northeast and SOME parts of the Midwest.
You're correct. I was responding to the comment about the growing Catholic population in Texas, and I explained that such was from the growing illegal alien Mexican population more than anything.

Southern Baptist should be the marker, however, Saddleback Church in Orange County, California is one of the largest southern Baptist Churches in the nation.
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Old 06-22-2009, 12:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by City Fanatic View Post
Metro-wise, Austin is smaller. The physical built-up area of Austin is a little smaller, too. Hence, the urbanized region of Charlotte, which in general determines city size, just as much as population does, particularly when the metro population is also higher, is more dynamic.



Have you ever been to California? It's about as "southern" as Ohio or Montana. California was settled by a combination of southerners, midwesterners, northeasterners, and various immigrant groups. One doesn't tend to dominate. In fact, the accents merged to form a general American accent more than anything.



Everyone in Odessa is not southern. However, I've been there enough to get an overall vibe. I've studied the predominance of accents, the southern Baptist Church, as well as various other examples of southern culture to know that the dominant culture is "southern" in nature. Texas Reb lives in Texas, just ask him.

Most of the Mexican population is that of illegals, or children of illegals. I refuse to acknowledge their invading selves, as they are nothing more than parasites to thousands of cities across the nation.



There isn't anything southern about Wal-Mart. What I said was that the people in Wal-Mart had easily identifiable southern accents. I provided an example.



Texas is still southern, regardless if it is not in the southeast. It's part of the western south.

Can you find southern cuisine outside of the black community in places outside the South? Do people outside the South eat southern cuisine for home-cooked meals to the degree that they do in Texas?



You're correct. I was responding to the comment about the growing Catholic population in Texas, and I explained that such was from the growing illegal alien Mexican population more than anything.

Southern Baptist should be the marker, however, Saddleback Church in Orange County, California is one of the largest southern Baptist Churches in the nation.
I agree, Texas IS Southern, but only in certain parts. And I believe Austin is not one of them. And why not count the Mexicans? Texas before whites came was essentially part of Spain and then Mexico,BOTH of which brought the Catholic religion with them. And I was about to say the same thing about Saddleback church in CA. I don't know, people might eat southern cuisine for dinner outside the south. As a matter of fact a lot of the southern cuisine we see might be the same cuisine of someone who lives in rural PA or rural NY or rural IL might eat. How do you people in the south eat southern cuisine for dinner?
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Old 06-22-2009, 02:04 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polo89 View Post
And why not count the Mexicans? Texas before whites came was essentially part of Spain and then Mexico,BOTH of which brought the Catholic religion with them.
Yes, but here is an important point to remember, Polo (and I hope you know I respect your opinion! ). That is, the rise, decline, then later (recent) rise in the Catholic Church has to be qualified.

As concerns Texas, yes, the Spanish, then later Mexican ownership, is definitely reflected in place names and old missions and a Catholic presence. But none was ever really dominant in the whole scheme of things.

For instance, when Texas was opened up to settlement, it was a requirement that the newcomers become Catholic. However, it was all a big joke. It was never enforced by the Mexican government and, far as that goes, most of those guys were a bunch of adventerous hell-raisers who probably never set foot in a church in their lives, and it made little difference what they might nominally be. All they wanted to do was fight and drink whiskey! LOL

After the Texas Revolution though, many Mexicans (even Tejanos) left the state and the settlement from the Southern United States increased ever more. The Catholic Church influence (which again, was really superficial) declined and the religious patterns in Texas very much reflected that of the South at large. That is, Protestant and especially Southern Baptist. This is the one which became entrenched and still dominates. Sure, there was still a Catholic influence, but it paled in comparrsion. Heck, it was certainly less than that in southern Louisiana. Just my opinion, of course, but I do believe that this (majority Southern Baptist) is a relevant indicator of how "Southern" a place (whether state or city) might be.

To bring it up to date, yeah, there is an ever rising percentage of Catholics in Texas. But as CF said, this component is relatively recent and indicitive of an ever growing -- much of which is illegal -- hispanic population and northern transplants. It is not really part of the dominant history and culture of Texas.
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