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WHen I went to Dallas a few years back, I was pretty impressed by the DART system. It was clean, well ran and efficient. MARTA here in Atlanta is useless outside of I-285, And it's funding is usually cuckholded by a hostile state government. It also doesn't help that the system is poorly managed.
DART has some very impressive expansion plans for their rail system.
Are there plans to stick to the honor system or does DART plan to implement a farecard/smartcard system in the future?
Atlanta has folks with "country slang", but they are VERY urban in their mindsets. They ride the MARTA everywhere. Many (females) raise their children without the "baby daddy's" help. Many of the "baby daddy's" have records. This is something that you will find in Atlanta's poorest areas (and also Atlanta's least dense areas). There is NOTHING suburban about the mentality of Atlanta's lesser dense areas of town.
This is something that I find myself having to educate Northern transplants on from time to time. They move to the south, they see less density, and they automatically think "WOW, this is soooo nice, clean, and suburban". Then they b$tch 6 months later about the "high crime" and the "thugs" in their neighborhood. Little had they realized that they'd moved to "da hood" when they thought they moved down south to the "burbs" (or "the country").
That's why when transplants say "we would like to stay in the burbs" on their opening post, I sometimes direct message them to find out what their idea of "the burbs" are. Most times, they are looking for an area of town with less density and low crime. The problem is that most towns in the south are the most urban (ie, dangerous) where density is low. This is because low density areas are cheap enough for the poor folks to live.
And please, don't anyone get offended by my "poor folks" comment. I grew up in a housing project in Charlotte (Southside homes). I dated a girl awhile back that lived in an Atlanta Housing project (Bankhead Courts).
Unmarried mothers, crime, and "da hoods" do not make a place urban. You can find plenty of unmarried mothers in MS, AL, etc., and plenty of poor, violent areas in the rural South. Fifth Ave (NY) is urban, the "Gold Coast" in Chicago is urban, just as much as the West Side of Chi and the South Bronx are urban. The Metropolitan Museum of Art is as urban as the grafitti-covered subway stations and Central Park.
The best answer would be: just put all these cities names in a hat and pick.
They are all interchangeable IMHO. All these places' downtowns look almost identical, except for Miami since it's on a waterfront, and they are filled with strip malls, fast food and chain restaurants. I have lived in Dallas and Atlanta and have visited Houston and Miami several times so it's not like I'm talking out of my arse.
Comparing them would be like comparing Wendy's, Mc Donalds, Jack in the Box and Burger King.
This is so true. I live in Atlanta and have visited all four. both Houston and Dallas felt like Atlanta, Texas. Miami has a different flavor, but still similar in size.
The Dallas plan is massive and if you add Fort Worth light rail systems that is in the works its even bigger. Good insight LA Native and it seems Dallas/Fort Worth is a sleeping giant on city-data. There are alot of major projects going on in the metro area that people are not aware of. DFW is really starting to look and peform like a real metropoltian area. The fact that Dallas is land locked from expanding is exciting. We are seeing a shift from Dallas growing Horizontal to vertical growth.
Dallas on Flickr - Photo Sharing! (http://www.flickr.com/photos/ninjatune/3756565733/in/photostream/ - broken link)
Dallas Skyline is looking slick as hell in this picture. I like the fact that it's creating an actual core, instead of making multiple skylines spread through the city.
Unmarried mothers, crime, and "da hoods" do not make a place urban.
Yes, but would you call this an urban trait or a suburban trait huh? Again, urbanity is two things (people density and mentality). Both has to exists for a place to be urban IMO. If you don't agree, let's just agree to disagree and move on.
The US census (I think) defines ANYTHING with over 1,000 people per sq/mi as being "urban". If you don't agree, take it up with the US census. Be sure to tell them in your letter that city-data poster "Ben Around" LOL knows what urbanity is better than our government does.
Honestly, I understand your arguments. Really I do. However, there is a suburban mentality in MANY dense so called urban areas of our major metros. Their is a reason why hip-hop music is called "urban" music. There is also a reason why Atlanta (a down south "suburban" city) has taken hip-hop over. Atlanta does not have the urban density of NYC, but the people of Atlanta most certainly have the urban mentality. Plain and simple. City/Urban folks, with "country" grammar. That's the ATL.
Yes, but would you call this an urban trait or a suburban trait huh? Again, urbanity is two things (people density and mentality). Both has to exists for a place to be urban IMO. If you don't agree, let's just agree to disagree and move on.
The US census (I think) defines ANYTHING with over 1,000 people per sq/mi as being "urban". If you don't agree, take it up with the US census. Be sure to tell them in your letter that city-data poster "Ben Around" LOL knows what urbanity is better than our government does.
Honestly, I understand your arguments. Really I do. However, there is a suburban mentality in MANY dense so called urban areas of our major metros. Their is a reason why hip-hop music is called "urban" music. There is also a reason why Atlanta (a down south "suburban" city) has taken hip-hop over. Atlanta does not have the urban density of NYC, but the people of Atlanta most certainly have the urban mentality. Plain and simple. City/Urban folks, with "country" grammar. That's the ATL.
Most large urban areas have that "urban" mindset. Eatting at World-Class resturantes, shopping at Macy's, Neiman Marcus, or Dior, going to the theater or museum, etc
Many people would argue Atlanta being the most "country" and also more slow-paced compared to the other cities because of how it's retained more of its southerness compared to other cities.
Location: The Greatest city on Earth: City of Atlanta Proper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LAnative10
While that may be true for now, once 2012 hits, Dallas will have the largest rail system in the Southeastern states. It looks like it will stay that way too since: 1) Atlanta doesnt have plans on expanding MARTA right now, 2) Houston and Miami have expansion plans, but their rail systems wont be as big as Dallas' will.
But I think it take more than good rail to make a city urban.
Its going to be intersting since of all the cities (and their surround communities), Dallas is projected to grow the most, closely followed by Houston.
No, they will have the largest light rail system in the southeast. Which is great and all, but it's not a subway like Atlanta has.
While MARTA isn't considering any major expansion, that doesn't mean we're sitting still transit wise. Four new new stations (3 or the north line, 1 on the west line) are likely to be built within the next 10 years.
The Belt Line, a loop of Light Rail transit around the inner city that will link 45 neighborhoods directly to the MARTA subway, is already under construction and right of way acquisition.
The planning for the Peachtree St. Streetcar line, covering at least 7 miles from Buckhead to Downtown, is in it's final stages and is likely to get federal matching funds before the year is out. Two other lines down Ponce De Leon and Piedmont Avenues are being considered as well.
There are also several well developed proposals for commuter rail into the City from the major suburbs that would get moving...if we got the right leadership in the Governors Mansion. That remains to be seen unfortunately. To see all of those proposals, plus the ones discussed before, look here http://www.cfpt.org/documents/worldclass_map.pdf.
As for the "density issue", the numbers don't lie. Here are the current population densities for each city:
1. Miami: 413,201 people, 35 sq mi, 11583 people per square mile
2. Atlanta: 537,958 people, 131 sq mi, 4083 people per square mile
3. Houston: 2,242,193 people, 579 sq mi, 3870 people per square mile
4. Dallas: 1,279,910, 342 sq mi, 3736 people per square mile
People like to assume that since because Atlanta is the only one of the four that was not planned on a street grid that it is inherently less dense. I'm not sure why that is when a little math would give you the answer, and when places like Boston (also not planned on a grid) don't get the same flack.
Even that though doesn't give an accurate picture of how dense Atlanta really is. The population of the city proper is mostly confined in a loop from stretching from the central westside, down through the southwest and southeast side, up to the northeast side. This was the original boundaries of the City prior the annexation of the Northwest section of the city in 1952 (which is primarily low density and in large parts undeveloped land). What this translates into is that about 80% of the population of Atlanta resides in a 40 sq mile area. That's about 10,000 people per square mile. Not to shabby IMHO.
Lastly, the current mantra for most development in the city of Atlanta proper is density, density, density. I'm not aware of any major plans in the city for any type of low density, car centered, residential or commercial developments.
But alas, all of this will fall on deaf ears. According to CD Atlanta is just a sprawled out behemoth that's just a waste of space and time. Nevermind how that only relates to the suburbs of Atlanta and is a problem in every other city on this and in this country.
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If you want urban, go to White Castle! 
