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Old 01-14-2010, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Upper East Side, NYC
404 posts, read 1,207,715 times
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Dallas and LA, while they have made tremdous progress towards providing public transit to their populations are staticticly NOT car free cities. Perhaps this will change, but car culture is inherent in these cities. If both of you live in these cities, respectively, do you own cars? My guess would be yes. I live in manhattan, no car. I think that illustrates it. Ive never known ANYONE that lives in LA without a car, or who would do so volluntarily. You can post all the subway maps you want of a texas subway system, but the fact is, these cities are not subway cities. period. thats ok, its just not their culture. CAN you do it? perhaps, but you will be the overwhelming minority, and your social life will suffer. Again, Im not talking about COMMUTING, Im talking about LIVING.
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Old 01-14-2010, 02:58 PM
 
7,848 posts, read 17,526,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adambos View Post
Dallas and LA, while they have made tremdous progress towards providing public transit to their populations are staticticly NOT car free cities. Perhaps this will change, but car culture is inherent in these cities. If both of you live in these cities, respectively, do you own cars? My guess would be yes. I live in manhattan, no car. I think that illustrates it. Ive never known ANYONE that lives in LA without a car, or who would do so volluntarily. You can post all the subway maps you want of a texas subway system, but the fact is, these cities are not subway cities. period. thats ok, its just not their culture. CAN you do it? perhaps, but you will be the overwhelming minority, and your social life will suffer. Again, Im not talking about COMMUTING, Im talking about LIVING.
The thread is not about the "culture" of a city...the thread topic is about best cities for living car-free. Dallas, L.A., Atlanta, Portland, etc aren't THE BEST cities for living car free, but they are among the cities where it's possible to easily live without a car.

It's not about "can you do it"...like I said, many thousands of people DO IT in these cities, some by choice and some not. Believe me, it's true. It's easy to sit in NYC and make stereotypical judgements about transit in other cities, but we live in those other cities and experience them every day.

For the record, I don't live in either Dallas or L.A.
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Old 01-14-2010, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia,New Jersey, NYC!
6,967 posts, read 17,473,884 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adambos View Post
Los Angeles without a car easily? Seriously??? I lived in LA, and not having a car is NOT an option. You can live in, say, West hollywood or Santa Monica and get around those neighborhoods on foot, but life in LA will take you to other parts. what if you want to head to westwood, or to the south bay? Sure, you can take the bus, but it is going to be a long, hellacious commute. Ive lived in LA, ATL, Phoenix, Boston and New York. Boston and NY are the only two cities where you could TRULY be car free. Even in Boston for the most part it would be easier to have a car. NYC is the only city where owning a car can actually indicate LOW socio-economic status. The fact that you cant afford to live in manhattan. NY is its own thing. Having a car in manhattan makes your life hell.
or high. some people who own a car like to have one to get away on a given weekend. and that means paying rent to store your car in a nearby undergound lot. it'll run you an additional $500-600 a month
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Old 01-14-2010, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Baltimore
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Most people in DC that I know(other than people with my job), don't have a car. It can actually be harder having a car here than not having one just like NYC. Traffic is some of the worst in the nation and there's no parking. The public transit is great and makes things much easier.
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Old 01-14-2010, 03:16 PM
 
Location: where my heart is
5,642 posts, read 7,456,646 times
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NYC, but Manhattan that is, not the other boroughs. I did not start driving until I was 30, moved to Queens, and had a kid. You can get from one place to another in the boroughs, IF you don't mind taking a couple of buses and transfering, and spending a very long time doing it.
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Old 01-14-2010, 07:37 PM
 
5,455 posts, read 13,303,299 times
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Originally Posted by DeaconJ View Post
I agree with your list, but there are other cities where one can easily live without a car...but they aren't usually recognized as such. Dallas, Atlanta, Portland, Los Angeles, and St. Louis all come to mind.

Then there are many cities with limited but established rail transit, but I'm not sure how extensive it is or how easy it would be to live car-free...Cleveland, Baltimore, Miami, Seattle, New Orleans, and a couple of others.

Then there are many cities with newer but limited rail systems, and most seem to be expanding the systems but I doubt it would be considered easy to live without a car without further expansion...Charlotte, Phoenix, Norfolk, Houston, etc.

In all cities, as long as you live and work near a rail station or can easily drive to one, it's possible to live car-free and be happy.
No, you don't even need a rail system. A good bus system'll do ya fine if you live in the right n'hood! (E..g., Milwaukee)
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:08 PM
 
7,848 posts, read 17,526,722 times
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Originally Posted by Ben Around View Post
No, you don't even need a rail system. A good bus system'll do ya fine if you live in the right n'hood! (E..g., Milwaukee)
I agree...but decided not to open that can of worms.
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:50 PM
 
Location: Searching n Atlanta
785 posts, read 1,646,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Around View Post
No, you don't even need a rail system. A good bus system'll do ya fine if you live in the right n'hood! (E..g., Milwaukee)
Add Charlotte to this list, cities with good bus service but no rail, I lived with my mom and older brother for the First 8 years of my life with no car and been everywhere in that city.

40 or so route meeting in one place makes the bus service great.
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:57 PM
 
Location: ITP - City of Atlanta Proper
7,763 posts, read 11,465,782 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adambos View Post
Los Angeles without a car easily? Seriously??? I lived in LA, and not having a car is NOT an option. You can live in, say, West hollywood or Santa Monica and get around those neighborhoods on foot, but life in LA will take you to other parts. what if you want to head to westwood, or to the south bay? Sure, you can take the bus, but it is going to be a long, hellacious commute. Ive lived in LA, ATL, Phoenix, Boston and New York. Boston and NY are the only two cities where you could TRULY be car free. Even in Boston for the most part it would be easier to have a car. NYC is the only city where owning a car can actually indicate LOW socio-economic status. The fact that you cant afford to live in manhattan. NY is its own thing. Having a car in manhattan makes your life hell.
The 1.4 Million people in Los Angeles, 482,000 people in Atlanta, and 206,000 people in Dallas who use public transportation on a daily basis disagree with you. (Source) Try coming with facts before you start laying out the standard misconceptions.

Are there a lot of people joined at the hip to their cars in those three cities? Yes, but there are also a awful lot of people who aren't. It is also cheaper to park and own a car on those cities, so guess what most people will do.

But the fact remains that all three cities have great public transportation systems. And I'm just talking about the cities themselves. Don't start talking about some suburb if you care to respond.
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:02 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
3,995 posts, read 8,512,602 times
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Since many are making the fact known that if you live in an area served by great rail, bus, and circulator sevice (like downtown areas, central cities, etc) I'd add Phoenix to the list. Not only can you get to three urban centers (downtowns) in metro Phoenix via rail (Phoenix, Tempe, Mesa), you can get to many other downtowns via LINK, RAPID, or Express services. In Phoenix you can get to the airport, universities, hospitals, stadiums, arenas, the largest and most dense central business districts in the state (downtown, uptown, midtown, Gateway, Tempe, and near Metro Center), among other heavily visited cultural centers and amenities (Childrens Museum, Science Centers, art museums, theaters/performing arts, Desert Botanical Gardens/Zoo, Heard Museum, etc etc) by rail.
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