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Old 01-29-2010, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Pasadena
7,413 posts, read 3,011,989 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
Again, talk about the pot calling the kettle black. You are by far on of the biggest, most biased CA homers on this site. What evidence have you provided? I don't see any links or any articles to support what you are saying. In a previous post I provided numerous links to show how many counties in Southern Ca lean republican in presidential elections after you claimed that no counties in Southern CA were republican.

You seriously need to improve your reading comprehension. I didn't say it was more liberal than LA or SF or had more social welfare policies, I said it ranked up there with them. Rent control, housing subsidies, etc.. similar to programs in LA and SF.

And look up how each county in NYC votes in presidential elections, they vote more democratic than LA County does.
A small amount of weed in NY is no different than CA, they're both misdemeanors with $100 fines. Do some damn research before you pretend to know what you're talking about KID.

New York - NORML
California - NORML

Weed is decriminalized in NY state like it is here in CA.
Really? That's funny b/c I bought my weekly 1/8th last night and have bought weed in NYC before. Have you?

Are you sure about that?

Same-sex marriage in New York - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The idea of legislating same-sex marriage may have majority support among the New York population, according to recent opinion polls, and the New York State Assembly passed same-sex marriage legalization bills multiple times. However, the New York Senate rejected it in a vote on December 2, 2009."

So just like CA, they tried and still don't have it. The end result is the two states are the same when it comes to gay marriage, neither have it.

I am stating what I believe and what others believe. You are in the minority and the ONLY PERSON on this thread who believes CA is the most liberal state. You are a kid, not an adult, in HIGH SCHOOL with no college education, very little travel outside of CA and probably LA County, and little life experiance but like a typical thick headed teenager believes they know everything at such a young age. It's actually quite amusing. Hopefully one day you'll grow up and gain some real knowledge.
Please spare me your condescending lectures but I am at least glad you finally got up off you butt & looked up a few things. The only trouble with your bias is that it clearly shows your willingness to stretch the truth. So you bought weed in NYC? Was it a legal act? Do you honestly want to argue that marijuana policies in New York are the same as California? The same with your attempt to make it sound like New York has made as many strives in gay marriage as California. You know better so I am not going to repeat the facts again. You seem to want to argue for argument sake & it only diminishes your shaky credibility when you distort or intentionally mislead. Not a very good example as an adult who thinks he is smart. Did you graduate from high school?
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Old 01-29-2010, 01:04 PM
 
Location: Northridge, Los Angeles, CA
2,685 posts, read 3,651,445 times
Reputation: 2247
Just to keep in mind about reliable democratic areas in the state of California, they are really only limited to the Bay Area (along with Santa Cruz, Mendocino, and Humboldt County), Los Angeles County, and Imperial County. At most, you are talking about areas that make up 17,975,945 people, or around 49.1% of California's population.

Outside of the two major cities, you have areas that are more moderate, or in the case of Orange County and Placer/Nevada/El Dorado Counties (Eastern Sacramento suburbs), very Republican.

California may be the BIGGEST state that's trending blue, but it isn't the most blue. There's a complete difference between that and some of the northeastern states. Remember, California has huge swaths of rural areas that have millions of people too.
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Old 01-29-2010, 01:16 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
10,134 posts, read 13,056,856 times
Reputation: 5336
Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
Please spare me your condescending lectures
No problem, as long as you actually do the same instead of being such a hypocrite. This whole post of yours is condescending by the way.
Quote:
The only trouble with your bias is that it clearly shows your willingness to stretch the truth
.Too bad your bias restricts you from seeing the truth and reality.
Quote:
So you bought weed in NYC? Was it a legal act?
No and neither is it when I buy here in CA. What was the point of this?
Quote:
Do you honestly want to argue that marijuana policies in New York are the same as California?
Did I ever claim they were the same? No, but you said weed was not decriminalized in NY state when it clearly is. You were WRONG on that and can't admit it, what a surprise.
Quote:
The same with your attempt to make it sound like New York has made as many strives in gay marriage as California
You claimed there was no movement to embrace this issue and were WRONG AGAIN. There has been several attempts to legalize gay marriage.
Quote:
You seem to want to argue for argument sake
And how is that any different than what you are doing? Take two people to argue genius and you've done plenty on here, more than me too. Take a look in the mirror and stop being so damn hypocritical.
Quote:
it only diminishes your shaky credibility when you distort or intentionally mislead.
HAHA, the irony coming from you. What credibility do you have? You're in high school, no college, little travel experiance, little life experiance, and a pretty low reputation on this site.
Quote:
Not a very good example as an adult who thinks he is smart. Did you graduate from high school?
I never proclaimed anything about my intelligence and yes I have graduated high school as well as college, have you?

Also in case you forgot, NO ONE agrees with you on here.
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Old 01-29-2010, 01:23 PM
 
Location: Pasadena
7,413 posts, read 3,011,989 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifeshadower View Post
Just to keep in mind about reliable democratic areas in the state of California, they are really only limited to the Bay Area (along with Santa Cruz, Mendocino, and Humboldt County), Los Angeles County, and Imperial County. At most, you are talking about areas that make up 17,975,945 people, or around 49.1% of California's population.

Outside of the two major cities, you have areas that are more moderate, or in the case of Orange County and Placer/Nevada/El Dorado Counties (Eastern Sacramento suburbs), very Republican.

California may be the BIGGEST state that's trending blue, but it isn't the most blue. There's a complete difference between that and some of the northeastern states. Remember, California has huge swaths of rural areas that have millions of people too.
I think the point that a state or county votes Democratic isn't a reliable indicator of liberalness. Many of the East Coast states with long histories of voting Democratic may do so out of tradition, loyalty & ethnicity [Senator Kennedy was replaced with a Republican]. Areas with high minority populations [most large U.S. cities] also vote Democratic but that doesn't mean they are all liberal. If most states do not allow their voters to cast a vote on things like marijuana or gay marriage it can not be considered that the state is liberal. Among the Blacks in Los Angeles, gay marriage was rejected yet they never vote for a Republican.

This is not a discussion necessarily about Democrats always being liberal because we know that they are not. A Republican politician from the Northeast [if there are any left] does not vote like a Republican from the South and in the case of someone like governor Schwarzenegger is far more liberal than many Democrats. If a person wants to remain in office they generally need to vote in accordance with their constituency or they will lose.

I would be interested in someone defending Democratic states in the Northeast as liberal in policies with some facts to back up their assertions [unlike some who try to distort or minimize the facts].

Los Angeles county is nearly a 3rd the entire population of California. Add the Bay Area and almost half the state or more is centered in those two metro regions. All the coastal counties with the exception of Del Norte & Orange counties voted Democratic. The big red regions in California are the least populated [desert & mountains]. The California assemby is about 2/3 Democrat [same with the Senate] and has been for decades. In New York state the two parties are about equal & that is why New York has problems passing liberal policies. I think it is important to state the facts not just wishful thinking.
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Old 01-29-2010, 01:28 PM
 
Location: Pasadena
7,413 posts, read 3,011,989 times
Reputation: 1802
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
No problem, as long as you actually do the same instead of being such a hypocrite. This whole post of yours is condescending by the way.
.Too bad your bias restricts you from seeing the truth and reality.
No and neither is it when I buy here in CA. What was the point of this?
Did I ever claim they were the same? No, but you said weed was not decriminalized in NY state when it clearly is. You were WRONG on that and can't admit it, what a surprise.
You claimed there was no movement to embrace this issue and were WRONG AGAIN. There has been several attempts to legalize gay marriage.
And how is that any different than what you are doing? Take two people to argue genius and you've done plenty on here, more than me too. Take a look in the mirror and stop being so damn hypocritical.
HAHA, the irony coming from you. What credibility do you have? You're in high school, no college, little travel experiance, little life experiance, and a pretty low reputation on this site.
I never proclaimed anything about my intelligence and yes I have graduated high school as well as college, have you?

Also in case you forgot, NO ONE agrees with you on here.
Seriously sav858, you sound more immature than anyone. It is a waste of time because you react without thinking through your statements. Your attack on me is a poor reflection on you, in my opinion. But I will no longer engage you since you prefer senseless & feeble arguments to honest discussion. BTW, no offense.
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Old 01-29-2010, 01:38 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
10,134 posts, read 13,056,856 times
Reputation: 5336
Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
Seriously sav858, you sound more immature than anyone. It is a waste of time because you react without thinking through your statements. Your attack on me is a poor reflection on you, in my opinion. But I will no longer engage you since you prefer senseless & feeble arguments to honest discussion. BTW, no offense.
Attack on you? Kind of like these attacks:
Quote:
Please spare me your condescending lectures

Not a very good example as an adult who thinks he is smart. Did you graduate from high school?
Give me a break, I've haven't said anything any worse that what you have said to me, you just get way more sensitive and defensive about it, probably the age thing there. But unfortunately you fail to realize how hypocritical you are being when you attack me personally and get very defensive when I point that out.

I didn't attack you, you just get extremely defensive when you are proved wrong time and time again, and by multiple people btw. You refuse to address questions when you have been proven wrong too. Instead of addressing issues and facts that I have brought up you just get upset and start attacking me.

But go ahead and keep arguing that CA is the most liberal state despite the fact no one actually agrees with you here.
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Old 01-29-2010, 05:13 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 13,004,061 times
Reputation: 6444
Quote:
Originally Posted by californio sur View Post
I think the point that a state or county votes Democratic isn't a reliable indicator of liberalness.
True, but looking at the thread's title again it actually asks about "most reliably Democratic and Republican." So it would seem that for the purposes of the thread how Democratic or Republican a state/county is would actually matter.

The most Democratic state is Massachusetts and New York is slightly more Democratic than California.

Political Party Affiliation: 30 States Blue, 4 Red in 2009 So Far
Democrats Hold Party ID Edge Across Political Battleground - Pew Research Center

The meaning of "reliably" is maybe a tad unclear. It could mean the one that is Democratic or Republican for the longest period of time. If we mean Presidential elections than the state that has went Democratic the longest is, I believe, Minnesota. Minnesota is the only state that Reagan never won. Although no one here, I don't think, would argue Minnesota is the most liberal. On the Republican I believe I calculated once that South Dakota is the most consistently Republican in Presidential elections. Woodrow Wilson never won South Dakota and William Jennings Bryan, popular on the Plains, seems to have only won the state once. Also South Dakota went for Wendell Willkie in a big way.

1940 Presidential Election Statistics

Kansas, Nebraska, and North Dakota might have been nearly as reliably Republican and possibly as reliably Republican. The most strongly Republican states at present are Utah, Wyoming, and Idaho.

In terms of counties I already had some theories on that. Duval and Starr County in Texas seem to be the most consistently Democratic. One of the most consistently Democratic in a "blue state" might be St. Louis County, Minnesota which is known for Duluth. The most consistently Republican I remember finding was Ogle County, Illinois as it's went Republican in every election since Fremont and before Fremont it went Whig. Tioga County, Pennsylvania went strongly for both Lincoln and McCain with LBJ being the only Democrat to win the county since Franklin Pierce. The most consistently Republican in a "Red State" might be Doniphan County, Kansas which I think has went for the Republican since statehood.

Presidential election of 1864 - Map by counties
Presidential election of 1932 - Map by counties


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Old 01-29-2010, 05:42 PM
 
Location: Pasadena
7,413 posts, read 3,011,989 times
Reputation: 1802
Agree with you, Thomas. In-fact, I'm not sure how the discussion veered into "liberal" and "conservative" since these principles are relative to a region\ electorate. I am responsible for misunderstanding that blue or red doesn't mean liberal or conservative though it is a natural assumption. Texas is a good example for being heavily Democratic then going heavily Republican. I don't think the voters in Texas were ever "liberal" per se & then just decided to change their minds & switch to Republican. The conservative Democrats in the South left the Democratic party but the reason why is still a bit unclear to me. Wonder if anybody can shed light on this phenomena.
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Old 01-29-2010, 06:04 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 13,004,061 times
Reputation: 6444
I may have started or contributed to the confusion in the posts on "01-26-2010, 11:02 PM" and "01-27-2010, 01:57 AM."
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