Things that could be done to improve Cleveland? (Cincinnati, Lorain: waterpark, mortgage)

[TheProf]

^Cincinnati should build a subway. They've even got 80-year-old subway tunnels that have never been used. The city had a subway, commuter rail system before the voters, but a couple air-head Republican shoot-from-the-lip pols convinced people to vote against it. Darn shame. I understand, in its place, a downtown streetcar system has been approved.

[hillside]

Originally Posted by Cle440

Cleveland has the least extra money of every city you mentioned on there (except maybe Detroit). The reason Cleveland has one is because it was built a while back when the city still had some money I think. Most the other midwest cities arent big enough or dense enough to even consider wasting money on RTA-like systems. Cincinnati was going to build a subway a while ago but I think they stopped and its now abandoned. I cant remember the reason why they stopped though, maybe it had to do with the city being too small or they ran out of money or something.

The city was too small? Lol.

The city didn't finish the subway because of

A.It was the most corrupt city in America (along with Philly) at the time
B.The Depression hit
C.The state preferred funds to Cleveland for urban development because of the state of Cincinnati at the time

But it gets better. Nowadays, they just use it as a touristy sort of thing. Corrupt in itself, huh? My feeling is that Mayor Mallory will build a streetcar line from downtown to uptown in the next 5 years while the county works out the proposed heavy rail lines from downtown to the I-71 corridor and the one proposed to go along I-75 from downtown. By then something comprehensive will have hit the ballot and it will pass this time IF IF IF they do the aformentioned correctly and efficiently. The subway tunnels WILL eventually be used, but WHEN is always the question in Cincinnati.

[BelieveInCleve]

I couldnt remember the reason why they stopped building it so thats why I said that maybe because it was too small. If Cincinnati did build a subway Im pretty sure that it would be the smallest city in America to have a subway. Since Cincinnati has a lot of hills I think it would do better building something like Pittsburgh and San Francisco has since it would be kind of difficult to build a subway in that terrain, above or below ground.

[hillside]

Originally Posted by Cle440

I couldnt remember the reason why they stopped building it so thats why I said that maybe because it was too small. If Cincinnati did build a subway Im pretty sure that it would be the smallest city in America to have a subway. Since Cincinnati has a lot of hills I think it would do better building something like Pittsburgh and San Francisco has since it would be kind of difficult to build a subway in that terrain, above or below ground.

I know, just pullin your leg. Give us a little credit though. We're not New York, but we're not Columbus either. Apparently Cincinnati used to have several inclines set up all over the city that carried streetcars, so I'm guessing modern engineers can figure this out. Heavy rail is probably the best option in a poor and hilly city like Cincinnati, so I definitely hear your strategy. It would only be right though to have an old city like Cinci to have an underground subway. I think the value of the city would skyrocket because you could get all of the amenities of an East Coast town with Midwestern affordability. But who am I kidding. It's Cinci we're talking about .

[theguv]

pretty good thread here. my suggestions:

cleveland needs to work on connections between established neighborhoods.

take ohio city and tremont for example. the walk down abbey road (the connecting street) is uninteresting at best. if this street was filled with pocket parks, housing, bike lanes, public art, etc., you'd be building on existing investments while strengthening both neighborhoods and creating more non-motorized vehicle traffic on this important connection/gateway btwn two of the cleveland's strongest neighborhoods. if more folks are walking/biking on Abbey, perhaps RTA would consider adding another entry (from Columbus Rd) to the W. 25th Redline station. This could, overtime, boost ridership, which in the longrun, would enable RTA to expand elsewhere. speaking of the W. 25th Redline stop, dense housing could and should be built around it and on top of the right of way. it was proposed a few years ago, but strongly opposed by a few influential neighbors in duck island, which is the three streets perpendicular to Abbey Rd, between Tremont and Ohio City.

speaking of connections, cleveland could do much, for a modest sum of money, to create cycling infrastructure and lanes/shared roads between downtown established/rebounding neighborhoods such as ohio city, detroit shoreway, little italy, univ circle, tremont, glenville, and the LAKEFRONT!

there is also much to be done re: connections, in rebuilding the areas around several redline stops btwn downtown and univ circle. most of these stops have nothing around them. next time you take the redline east, take at a look out the window at any of these stops. why not re-invigorate with transit oriented villages? RTA recently created transit oriented design guidelines and they are working to create a TOD at both the redline univ circle & little italy stations, so it seems to be on the horizon. while this is a more expensive proposition, it strengthens existing infrastructure, and if well coordinated, could be a landing spot for manufacturing companies looking to expand/move to cleveland. once you create jobs there (the harder part), the rest (supplementary companies + retail + residences) will follow. i think this strategy merits more investment than building new rail lines in the suburbs.

Connections! This is the theme of the Cleveland Planning Commissions recently released City Wide Plan:
planning.city.cleveland.oh.us/cwp/cpc.html

[Traveler87]

Cincinnati has plans for downtown streetcars, and they have been approved. So in a year or two you will see the tracks being set up in downtown Cincinnati for the streetcars.

[BelieveInCleve]

The last I heard they were going to shut down the East 79th st. stop because there was hardly anybody getting on at that stop. Maybe if that neighborhood wasnt so bad than more people would be getting on at that stop.

Like I said, I would like to see another line or leg to go to Lakewood and maybe Rocky River too. A lakefront line on the Eastside would be nice too though.

[SoCalClevelander]

I live in Long Beach, CA, (now) another waterfront city with the nation's busiest port (much larger and MUCH dirtier than Cleveland's) and yet, this city has done a tremendous amount with the waterfront. When I first saw it, I thought "this is what Cleveland's lakefront could be, if only...". If only the city "leaders" could stop bickering long enough to actually do something.

The waterfront here has many restaurants, bars, and clubs; the Queen Mary, a couple of hotels, a shopping area (which is actually kinda lame), a movie theater, bike trails, a marina, and a first rate aquarium. Other than the Queen Mary and palm trees, what is here that cannot be developed in Cleveland? Cleveland has the Rock Hall, Great Lakes Science Center and Browns Stadium... but that is it. Nowhere to eat down there. Nowhere to stay and party after a game. No outdoor recreational space, either. To be fair, the weather is gorgeous here like 355 days a year, but still--Cleveland does have at least some time to enjoy the outdoors. Like Cleveland, Long Beach hosts a major auto race in this area.

Here is a picture of some of it:

[costello_musicman]

^^Sucks cuz a lot of the lake of lakefront was due to decisions before our time: i.e. railroads, FREEWAY (blocks off walking access to Edgewater etc!), location of port mostly (but who could blame them I suppose), coast guard, burke airport, and basic city planning. Although I do not mind having the RRHOF, science center, and stadium there, it still could have been set up better with apartments/restaurants/condos/shops.

It still seems there is still somewhat the "leave it to the next generation" mentality, but at least there starting to turn the wheel for relocation of the city port to E. 55. (beginning 2013 I believe?)

[ExCMHer]

I don't think more RTA is going to do very much to improve things in Cleveland. Mass transit is basically an infinite money pit in DC and Atlanta right now, because they can't stay afloat without huge subsidies.

This is coming from a guy who takes the Metro every single day, and I'd like to thank everyone around the country for subsidizing my transportation. I really enjoy sticking you all with that bill.

The three basic things that will need to happen in Cleveland for anything to get better are: more police presence to reduce crime, better educational opportunities so people would actually want to send their children to Cleveland's schools, and a better business climate. I think there needs to be more police officers on the street so that laws are enforced in every square inch of the city all the time.

I believe parents need to be able to send their children to whichever schools they feel will do the best job of educating them. Lastly, taxes and regulation within the city need to be reduced, so that companies will want to locate within the city to create more jobs.

Without these things, I think you'll see another 30 years of people abandoning Cleveland for greener pastures elsewhere. Another individual development project here and there won't get it done. There have to be some very basic, structural changes in the attitudes of Clevelanders for any of this to be possible.

However, my guess is that Cleveland will stay stuck in its old ways of doing things that haven't been working for 30 years, and it will all just be the same old, same old.