Does Cleveland Have a "Us vs. Them" Attitude? (Columbus: 2015, city hall)

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by october2007

I am really excited to try the new Collision Bend Brewery which looks to have some amazing views of the Cuyahoga from the outside deck area!

You'll have great views of the Cleveland skyline from the roof of the Hostel, and if you walk downtown on the north side of the Hope Memorial bridge (there's a pedestrian/bike pathway segregated from traffic; it's Cleveland's Brooklyn Bridge).

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attracti...land_Ohio.html

Cleveland wanted to rename the bridge after Bob Hope, a native son who once was a part owner of the Indians, but instead, it reportedly was named instead at Hope's request after Hope's father, an immigrant stone mason who helped build the bridge's famous "Guardians of Traffic."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hope_Memorial_Bridge

If you keep walking past Progressive Field, you'll soon arrive at Aladdin's Bakery (located across from the Hilton Garden Inn) and market, a great place for lunch.

http://www.aladdinbaking.com/his.html

Some of the street level views from Voinovich Bicentennial Park on the North Coast Harbor (beyond the Rock Hall on East 9th St.); from the Cleveland Mall, just northeast of Public Square; and from the Warehouse District are iconic.

Check out the Terminal Tower observation deck open on weekends, and perhaps the new Bar 32 at the Hilton.

Bar 32 at Hilton Cleveland Downtown offers spectacular views of lake, city (photos) | cleveland.com

IMO, especially don't miss the Soldiers & Sailors Monument, The Arcade, and the Cleveland Mall and Fountain of Eternal Life. See the right margin for a dated list of other Cleveland icons. The new "Long Live Rock" sign at the Rock Hall likely now belongs on the list, although I think it detracts from the beauty of the building itself.

https://clevelandmagazine.com/in-the...rs%27-monument

Use the Google Transit tool at the RTA home page to get to destinations using mass transit.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaker_Heights,_Ohio

http://shakerhistoricalsociety.org/

http://shakerhistoricalsociety.org/collections

The "Dining Article" here would interest you as it discusses Cleveland neighborhoods in depth.

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g...Cleveland.html

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g....Overview.html

Here are some convenient attractions if you take the Healthline bus rapid, which runs on Euclid Ave. (Cleveland's original surveyors were fond of naming streets, townships, etc. after famous geometers), Cleveland's Main Street, from Public Square to University Circle (and beyond, including to Lake View Cemetery; get a map at the office to the right just inside the Euclid Ave. gateway).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euclid_Avenue_(Cleveland)

The Arcade & 5th St. Arcades

http://www.clevelandgatewaydistrict....marks/arcades/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Arcade

http://5thstreetarcades.com/

Heinen's at the Cleveland Trust Rotunda (the dome isn't a Tiffany production, but even more interesting IMO), another great place for lunch as well as wine and beer tastings

http://www.cleveland.com/business/in...niversary.html

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Attracti...land_Ohio.html

http://www.cleveland.com/architectur...cher_find.html

PlayhouseSquare at Playhouse Square

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g...usesquare.html

If you stop at Cleveland State University, you can still see the Mather Mansion, perhaps the best surviving example of the legendary Millionaire's Row. It may be open to the public during weekdays (especially if you ask), although not furnished to historical standards (you can see a furnished historic mansion at the Western Reserve Historical Society Museum in University Circle; sign up for tours first thing when arriving at the museum). Some Millionaire's Row residents migrated to Shaker Hts., others to Bratenahl and East Cleveland (or NYC in the case of the Rockefellers), and often finally in the auto age to the great estates of Hunting Valley.

http://www.clevelandhistorylessons.c...he-avenue.html

https://allthingsclevelandohio.blogs...aires-row.html

Use Google Transit to find the nearest Healthline stations to desired destinations.

http://www.riderta.com/healthline/about

http://www.cleveland.com/entertainme...illionair.html

http://www.cleveland.com/insideout/i...ow_photos.html

https://www.wrhs.org/explore/exhibit...oric-mansions/

https://clevelandhistorical.org/item...0#.WQdNBca1u9t

http://photos.clevescene.com/24-vint...lionaires-row/

I believe Dunham Tavern is the oldest surviving structure in Cleveland.

http://dunhamtavern.org/

Galluci's supplies many of the scores of Italian restaurants in Cleveland, as well as Italian American families.

http://www.tasteitaly.com/

Cleveland's free downtown bus trolleys also are convenient ways to explore downtown. The E-line on weekdays and the C-line on evenings and weekends both go to PlayhouseSquare.

http://www.riderta.com/routes/trolley

If you've never been to a Hofbrauhaus, Cleveland's has an outdoor beer garden that reportedly seats 1,000 persons, perhaps busy on a warm, weekend evening. The Hermit Club incorporated into the Hofbrauhaus was an actor's private club serving the performers at Cleveland's PlayhouseSquare vaudeville theaters.

http://hofbrauhauscleveland.com/the-...e-hermit-club/

Hope this provides a few more "local" touches to your trip!

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by gouldnm

I certainly hope that Cleveland isn't segregated. I live in the Chesapeake (Maryland) now, and it has a HUGE African American population. They run the full range from ghetto class to well educated professionals--same as the whites, who go from rednecks to well educated professionals. I would find it very weird to live in a place without African Americans--and I'm white.

Even if a city is segregated, that doesn't stop you from living in the black neighborhoods. You are free to move into any neighborhood you choose.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by WRnative

I don't remember reading of any murders recently in Ohio City's Market District (Lorain Ave. near downtown). What are you talking about? Can you produce a link?

I regularly visit the Market District, including in the evening, and I've never felt at risk.

Strangers, however, should strongly consider using Uber whenever they are uncomfortable. Just good street smarts.

To be fair, I think he lives in Cudell, not Ohio City. Cudell is not a great area. Seems pretty lower class to me. I would recommend moving into Edgewater if possible.

But Cudell is still not as bad as the east side.

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

To be fair, I think he lives in Cudell, not Ohio City. Cudell is not a great area. Seems pretty lower class to me. I would recommend moving into Edgewater if possible.

But Cudell is still not as bad as the east side.

He referenced "near down Lorain" and I assumed he meant Lorain Ave. near downtown. As it could be interpreted that way, I thought clarification would be beneficial.

Hopefully he'll be explicit about the stretch of Lorain that concerns him.

[j_ws]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

But Cudell is still not as bad as the east side.

I actually really enjoy Cudell.

Honestly, it's like the neighborhood embodiment of a crime strawman argument (the term of the day!). We do have pockets with systematic safety issues, but my experience has really been overwhelmingly positive. There's an active base of increasingly engaged residents.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by j_ws

I actually really enjoy Cudell.

Honestly, it's like the neighborhood embodiment of a crime strawman argument (the term of the day!). We do have pockets with systematic safety issues, but my experience has really been overwhelmingly positive. There's an active base of increasingly engaged residents.

I will admit to not knowing much at all about the neighborhood. I can believe that there is good and bad there though.

[j_ws]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I will admit to not knowing much at all about the neighborhood. I can believe that there is good and bad there though.

The disjointed street grid results in the parts on either side of W95 acting almost as two separate neighborhoods. Most of the safety issues seem to concentrate around that line of demarcation, though you do have events elsewhere. It's not without problems, but I'd say it's overwhelmingly on the upswing.

West Blvd to W95 benefits from a fair number of very long-term residents remaining, positive influence of West Blvd, housing being generally stable and in pretty decent shape, I-90 access, rapid access, bus access, bike lane access, and then proximity to Edgewater and upper Detroit-Shoreway. I acknowledge that my section is even more anomalous in that we really don't have any issues, but in general I find that residents are invested in the future of the area. I also live in what is a decent example of the mixed-income neighborhood model to which so many people abstractly aspire, but I think that's more coincidental than anything.

To build on that, I think this type of mentality exists in a lot of Cleveland neighborhoods which is why you see people who are defiant in the face of data that points to Cleveland being awful/the worst city in the world. We can lob tons of criticism on East Side neighborhoods, but that doesn't make motivated residents of East Blvd or Wade Park Ave in Glenville start to hate their neighborhood, or really sway the dedicated residents who want to stabilize and revitalize Hough.

[gouldnm]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Even if a city is segregated, that doesn't stop you from living in the black neighborhoods. You are free to move into any neighborhood you choose.

I think you missed the point of my post. I don't want to live in a community that is either all white or all black. What I would prefer is to live in a diversified community. The town I live in now is 60% white, 30% black, 5% Asian, and 5% Latino. This is normal for me.

[gouldnm]

Originally Posted by pufflesmcfacehair

False. Minority neighborhoods can be just as racist. If the poster is white, they could be targeted for that reason.

Also, this disjointed belief that moving into an area with rampant murder, robbery, rape, and property vandalism is just dandy is, frankly, just another dismissal of the realities happening in these discarded parts of the city. Minorities don't even want to live in these areas.

Good point. I don't want to live in an area with a lot of crime. If Cleveland is the kind of city where there is a 1:1 correlation between minorities and crime, that is a problem, and it doesn't make the area look good to outsiders. Where I live now, there are plenty of middle class minorities, and many of the crimes are committed by redneck whites. Whatever stereotypes I grew up with in Michigan got blown out of the water after moving to Maryland. I really don't want to go back to what I grew up with in Michigan, which was highly segregated.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by gouldnm

I think you missed the point of my post. I don't want to live in a community that is either all white or all black. What I would prefer is to live in a diversified community. The town I live in now is 60% white, 30% black, 5% Asian, and 5% Latino. This is normal for me.

For the record, I think racial and ethnic diversity is one of the most overemphasized notions of the age.

That's just for the record though. Moving on.

University Heights is probably about 70% white and 30% black. Cleveland Heights is 50% white, 40% black and 10% other. Shaker Heights is 55% white, 40% black, 5% asian.

So I think you'd like "the Heights." Overall, some pockets of Cleveland Heights are poor and crime infested. But the majority of the Heights is fine.