What's Cleveland Hts. Like Now? (Euclid, Cleveland Heights: section 8, sales, real estate)

[normie]

I saw an article that said Shaker Hts. has lost its luster. Violent crimes are happening, foreclosure signs are everywhere, etc. etc. It's very hard to believe something like that could be true. Shaker Hts. always seemed like such a wonderful place with wealthy families that went back generations. Is it still like that? It seemed like the kind of place that could never change, that if I went back for a visit it would look and feel exactly the same. Or is this article a cold slap of reality? It can't be telling the truth--can it?

And more important (to me) what is Cleveland Hts. like now?

I grew up in the Cedar-Lee area on Coleridge Road. Walked to Fairfax Elementary and Roxboro Junior High, and felt very safe, even as a young pre-teen girl walking home from baby sitting jobs. I even remember walking home once from a night time game at the school. The people who lived there were young professionals, including many professors at Case Western Reserve.

The public schools were excellent, nobody in my neighborhood went to private school. We studied Shakespeare in the 5th grade, and read Chinese philosophy in 6th grade. They taught French, and Chemistry, and all sorts of advanced things in elementary school. When my family moved to Miami, I was bumped ahead to 10th grade because of the quality of education.

We rode bikes to Shaker Lakes--it was a pretty park where preteen kids could hang out. We liked to play on the old shaker mills. The only place we were warned to stay away from was the ravine near Roxoboro Jr. High--dubious people hung out there. Also, a path behind the skating rink that led to east Cleveland was said to be dangerous. But it was perfectly safe to ride my bike to the skating rink by myself whenever I wanted to.

There were dozens of tiny mom and pop stores along Lee Road, and the big scandal was when a fast food restaurant (Arthur Treachers) opened near the high school.

I had a friend who lived in one of the fancy mansions along Fairmount. They held pool parties and owned a fire truck that they drove in the 4th of July parade. I thought that street of mansions was the most beautiful place in the world.

Cleveland Hts. was like Shaker Hts., a town that always struck me as the sort of place that would never change. We left in the mid 70's. Is it still like that, or has it all changed? Do any of these things exist anymore?

[BelieveInCleve]

I dont know a whole lot about that area and how its changed but this is what I have seen and heard:

Cleveland Heights has went downhill, but not a whole lot. Shaker Heights is basically still the same. Some say that it has also went downhill a little bit though. The truth is that most of the county has gone downhill. The bad areas spread from Cleveland to East Cleveland and now into some of the Inner ring suburbs. You will find that any area in the suburbs thats close to Cleveland has gotten worse. Like the western part of Cleveland Heights has gotten worse because of its proximity to Cleveland and EC. Overall, they are still nice areas though, and havent changed a whole lot. But like I said, Im not entirely sure about this. Some other people on here may know more about this topic.

[Steve36]

Originally Posted by normie

I saw an article that said Shaker Hts. has lost its luster. Violent crimes are happening, foreclosure signs are everywhere, etc. etc. It's very hard to believe something like that could be true. Shaker Hts. always seemed like such a wonderful place with wealthy families that went back generations. Is it still like that? It seemed like the kind of place that could never change, that if I went back for a visit it would look and feel exactly the same. Or is this article a cold slap of reality? It can't be telling the truth--can it?

I believe the article you are referring to was written by a French "journalist" for a French newspaper. The idiot was actually in east Cleveland someplace but changed details of the story and claimed it was Shaker Heights. He claimed it was an honest mistake but he not only confused the name of the area but also switched the names of roads to fit his article. The story got picked up by the AP. There was a feeble attempt to correct the misinformation but journalistic integrity as long been dead so no one really noticed. My guess is the guy was trying to land a job with the New York Times so he just made stuff up.

And more important (to me) what is Cleveland Hts. like now?

I grew up in the Cedar-Lee area on Coleridge Road. Walked to Fairfax Elementary and Roxboro Junior High, and felt very safe, even as a young pre-teen girl walking home from baby sitting jobs. I even remember walking home once from a night time game at the school. The people who lived there were young professionals, including many professors at Case Western Reserve.

The public schools were excellent, nobody in my neighborhood went to private school. We studied Shakespeare in the 5th grade, and read Chinese philosophy in 6th grade. They taught French, and Chemistry, and all sorts of advanced things in elementary school. When my family moved to Miami, I was bumped ahead to 10th grade because of the quality of education.

We rode bikes to Shaker Lakes--it was a pretty park where preteen kids could hang out. We liked to play on the old shaker mills. The only place we were warned to stay away from was the ravine near Roxoboro Jr. High--dubious people hung out there. Also, a path behind the skating rink that led to east Cleveland was said to be dangerous. But it was perfectly safe to ride my bike to the skating rink by myself whenever I wanted to.

There were dozens of tiny mom and pop stores along Lee Road, and the big scandal was when a fast food restaurant (Arthur Treachers) opened near the high school.

I had a friend who lived in one of the fancy mansions along Fairmount. They held pool parties and owned a fire truck that they drove in the 4th of July parade. I thought that street of mansions was the most beautiful place in the world.

Cleveland Hts. was like Shaker Hts., a town that always struck me as the sort of place that would never change. We left in the mid 70's. Is it still like that, or has it all changed? Do any of these things exist anymore?

I'm far from an expert on Cleveland Heights but I do visit Coventry, Cedar-Fair, and Cedar-Lee very often and we looked at buying there before buying in Shaker. The nicer end of CH is still nice. Personally, I didn't care much for the rest of CH, the town's leadership, or the public schools as a whole (although some of the neighborhood elementary schools seemed like they might still be ok). The better areas are probably holding up pretty well from when you last saw them; the sketchy areas have probably grown since you left and infected nearby areas. I think as long as the Clinic, UH and Case are around, the nice areas will be ok since they are so convenient for those that work there and offer a quality of living and housing stock you can't just find anywhere. I do know that even though home values in the nicer areas have fallen off (along with values everywhere else), homes in the nicer neighborhoods in CH still seem to be selling pretty well. We had our eye on a couple of places waiting for the price to fall a little more but they sold way faster than we expected.

[costello_musicman]

^^The article about Shaker Hts was wrong--but as we can see, damage was done.

Cedar Lee area is pretty decent, around where you grew up. Cleveland hts had pockets of good and bad. I would saw most people have indifferent feelings towards Cleveland Hts.

[normie]

Thanks for the replies. I've actually had a very entertaining afternoon looking up Cleveland Hts. on the internet. I can see that what you are saying is true--that article was ridiculous. Both CH and SH look more or less the same as I remember.

It's amazing what you can find on the internet. Someone had posted the school pictures from my elementary school, and I saw all my old teachers again. I checked out old real estate info for a few houses on my old street. Those houses all seemed to sell, and for decent prices. No sign of neglected lawns, aluminum being stripped off or foreclosure signs on the house next door. (And, much to my amusement, a kid I had a crush on in the second grade is now a realtor!)

Roxboro is now a middle school, and it's won a bunch of awards lately... so education isn't being completely neglected. The best thing I found was an in depth essay and photo album about CH's history. You gotta love the internet.

[andrew61]

To the original poster: Here's a good article about today's Shaker Heights from the New York Times... This came out shortly after a heinous crime took place in one of the Shaker neighborhoods bordering Cleveland:

A Suburb Looks Nervously at Its Urban Neighbor

All in all, I would say that the wealthier areas of both Shaker and Cleveland Heights are as good as they ever were. It's the less affluent areas, particularly the parts that border rougher areas of Cleveland or East Cleveland, that are getting a little rough around the edges, i.e., experiencing more "urban" problems.

Most of Cleveland's inner-ring suburbs these days are in trouble to some extent or other, due mostly to regional economic stagnation and lack of growth coupled with increasing development of the hinterlands (i.e., outer suburbia and exurbia) and more and more people of means moving further out.

[BelieveInCleve]

Thats ridiculous how they could mistake East Cleveland for Shaker Heights. That goes from 40%+ poverty in EC, to Less than 10% in Shaker Heights. Im sure the guy knew it though, and had a hidden agenda.

[jaym12]

I used to live in Coventry from 84-91. Went to Coventry elementy to Wiley middle school. I re-visited Cleveland Heights in 2000, not much has changed with the expection of a new parking garage, wish I still lived there...

[PhxBarb]

Oh My. I graduated from Case Western Reserve School of Nursing in `65, and 2 other nurses and I rented our first apt. in Shaker Hgts that year. We thought we were so cool cause of our address. I saw Dr. Zhivago at Shaker Square theater. In my spare time I dreamed about having one of the mansions on Fairmount Blvd. Sometimes they would have estate sales and it was an incredible experience actually getting inside the house ! Cleveland Hgts was old money and rich rich people when I was there. Loved the area; the big trees; the huge snowfalls and the Italian restaurant in Little Italy, what was it called?, around the corner from Euclid Ave and the nursing school dorm. Just one street of so called questionable people, but great food at that restaurant. I had a great time there then. Hope its all the same. Thanks for the trip down memory lane....

[zig_zag_stitch]

I was raised in Cleveland Heights (early '60's), left for awhile and came back in '93 and bought a home near Monticello Jr. High.

I always knew I wanted to come back to Cleveland Hts., I LOVED growing up in this city, and it was safe, summers at Cumberland pool, winters sledding at Cain Park, hanging out at Severance Mall (back when it was a thriving indoor mall).

I'm still here, but I'm not liking what I see on many (but not all) streets - Section 8 housing, which is a cancer in any community, IMO. Since I moved back in '93, I've noticed that streets with duplexes that are owned by absentee landlords are the first to go bad. The owners gladly rent to Section 8 because it's a guaranteed rent check every month from the government, and as long as they get paid they don't care who lives in the house or what they do to the neighborhood. Some owners live out of state, some live in the affluent suburbs - as long as they don't have to live in the bad areas, they don't care.

I'm speaking from experience, my parents almost bought a house in the Forest Hills area in 1975, but back then FH had it's own housing board, and they did not allow blacks, jews, italians, and other ethnicities in - so, my liberal parents (who were "qualified" to live there), said "forget it" and bought a house one street away (near Park Synagogue). The FH housing board ended a few years later, and that area is now mixed and still is a very nice neighborhood.

However, the street my parents bought on, just a stone's throw across Mayfield Rd., is the opposite of what Forest Hills is like. Because there is a combination of homes and duplexes, Section 8 landlords have purchased the duplexes over the past 10 years, and this area has seen a real decline. (Area of Oak, Whitethorn, Ivydale and Sycamore roads, with Sycamore the worst).

Section 8 tenants, at least a portion, appear to want to get out of the urban slums of Cleveland, however they have brought the ghetto lifestyle with them, and refuse to change the lifestyle. The parents can't/don't control the kids, and that brings another level of chaos to the neighborhood.

noise - in cars and houses, extremely loud rap music, with obscenities, and talking (screaming, actually) at all hours, swearing/vulger speech

filth - some Section 8 dwellings have trash strewn all over - they don't care,
kids throw food wrappers on the ground like the sidewalk is the trash can.
I thought Tijuana, Mexico was bad when I was there 10 years ago, this looks like that.

drugs - are being sold openly on some streets, although the kids usually hide when the cops show up.

safety - kids walk in the center of streets, not moving to get out of the way for a car, which sends the message that they (obviously) don't respect their neighbors.

To the credit of Cleveland Hts. city government and the housing dept., police dept., in the past 2 years they have been more agressive in monitoring the parts of Cleve. Hts., at least in our area, and it has helped. But between the forclosures (which are happening in all the suburbs around here, affluent or not), and Section 8, it's a real problem.

To be honest, I am not at the point where I fear for my safety, but I have adjusted my life - I don't walk my dog after 9pm, and I carry pepper spray.

Had I known that this area was going to go downhill, I would have encouraged my Mom to sell her house 10 years ago when it was worth more.

Now for the positives of Cleveland Heights - Cain Park in the summer, lots of entertainment events. Coventry - great shopping and dining, proximity to University Circle and museums (10 minute drive), Zagara's grocery store, Cedar-Lee area for art, dining, and independant films.

There are pockets of Cleve. Hts. that have not been negatively impacted, (in terms of section 8/foreclosure), I think it is still very possible to buy a home in a good neighborhood, but buyers need to do their research.