U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Ohio > Cleveland
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-05-2020, 08:39 AM
 
146 posts, read 62,022 times
Reputation: 214

Advertisements

I grew up in NE Ohio in a smallish town. I have lived in both Boston/Metro Boston (current) and Chicago. And due to my work, I have spent a considerable amount of time in Tampa, Santa Barbara, San Francisco and Seattle. My family is in both NEO and Ann Arbor. At this time of year, I constantly debate moving to Metro Cleveland to be closer to my family (specifically Rocky River, Lakewood, Shaker and/or Cleveland Heights). Then, I return to New England and say to myself, are you crazy????

I LOVE New England....the scenery, the ocean, the history. And, although my house is crappy looking, it abuts a great 60 acre town park where my dog can run free. And I'm only 7 miles to the Financial District (20 minutes without traffic, 45 minutes in rush hour). But it's darn expensive and due to the nature of my work (IT Consulting with lots of travel) I have lost touch with a lot of friends over the years (or they've moved away).

I want to look for a new job (IT Mgmt) and I am seriously considering buying investment properties (I'm less than 10 years from retirement). So, CLE could be a place to look.

I know about Cleveland's weather, Lake Erie (my grandparents had a place on Catawba), CCF, sports (tho I loathe football), arts scene, Cedar Fair, and burgeoning food scene. All of which are good. And I know about the urban blight (my Mom has had LOTS of experiences at CCF and we've had plenty of time to explore the crappy East side). I grew up an hour from CLE and we used to go 'event' shopping at Beachwood Mall (which still looks the same, lol).

If I moved back to NEO, I could sell my Boston house and, with the profit, (almost) pay cash for a small house in one of the towns noted above. Or, put a big down payment down on an investment property. And, I could be much closer to my family (whom I adore).

But I am concerned about missing New England, particularly the cute small towns, the liberal leanings (I am a dogged democrat and OH has swung WAY right in 40+ years), the hiking and skiing in VT/White Mountains. Holiday Valley ain't no Mad River Glen or Stowe. And, I can fly direct to a gazillon locations in Europe, Mexico and the Caribbean, which is important to me as I like to escape. But, if I sell, move, and hate it, there is NO way I could move back to my current town. Housing prices have skyrocked in 10 years and I could not afford to buy my house now.

On the plus side of moving, I could buy a small house in a CLE 'burb, and when I ease into retirement, have enough $$$ to become a Caribbean snowbird. I don't think I could do that being in Boston, as I have a lot of equity tied up in my current house.

Anyone else move from a Coastal Big City (or Chicago) to CLE? What tipped your hand? Do you regret it?

Last edited by TechieTechie; 01-05-2020 at 09:14 AM..
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-05-2020, 09:29 AM
 
Location: Cleveland
912 posts, read 520,403 times
Reputation: 1173
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechieTechie View Post

But I am concerned about missing New England, particularly the cute small towns, the liberal leanings (I am a dogged democrat and OH has swung WAY right in 40+ years), the hiking and skiing in VT/White Mountains. Holiday Valley ain't no Mad River Glen or Stowe. And, I can fly direct to a gazillon locations in Europe, Mexico and the Caribbean, which is important to me as I like to escape.
Don't worry, we already have NE here. You may laugh, but drive from Chagrin Falls to Waite Hill through the Chagrin Valley. Or drive through Amish Country (Holmes Cty). Or visit downtown Hudson, OH. Plenty of options all of them very reasonably priced.

Catching rainbow trout: https://youtu.be/3pLRisJsDcA?t=8
Chagrin Falls: https://youtu.be/0MJsevEo6tE?t=7
Hiking Cuyahoga Valley NP: https://youtu.be/Zv2TDO0HX58?t=14
Kayaking: https://youtu.be/2Ygw_bXz4dQ?t=7 and https://youtu.be/J_am4gKoZWI?t=30
Various Waterfalls: https://youtu.be/prKHZnMB_Yg?t=16
Big ships: https://youtu.be/p5-J4Hy4rcE?t=85
Sunsets: https://youtu.be/jI0M8KczKj4?t=8 and https://youtu.be/Hpem7k-qXdM?t=6

Been working here for 30 years doing electronic hardware design. Plenty of jobs.
Good luck whatever you decide.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 09:42 AM
 
146 posts, read 62,022 times
Reputation: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by 216facts View Post
Don't worry, we already have NE here. You may laugh, but drive from Chagrin Falls to Waite Hill through the Chagrin Valley. Or drive through Amish Country (Holmes Cty). Or visit downtown Hudson, OH. Plenty of options all of them very reasonably priced.

Been working here for 30 years doing electronic hardware design. Plenty of jobs.
Good luck whatever you decide.
Thanks 216. Chagrin is cute (didn't know it existed), but I have a boat, was hoping to be closer to the lake. But all is relative and tradeoffs, I guess No Amish country, I grew up right square in the middle of that, don't need it again!

Cuyahoga Valley is beautiful (I grew up around running around Nelson Ledges and Mohican)...but it is not the same as the NH Presidentials or the Mahoosics (or Kathadin) in Maine. The Ohio Valley (and western PA) is beautiful, but certainly not on the same scale.

But, then again, I can buy 3 duplexes in Lakewood for what I can probably sell my house for in MA.

I really want to hear from transplants.



Argh!!!!
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Central Ohio
947 posts, read 435,121 times
Reputation: 2244
Not sure how helpful this reply will be, but I grew up in New England, lived the bulk of my adult life on the West Coast (Seattle area), spent 5 months renting in Cleveland (Shaker Square) and now retired in North Central Ohio. I, like you are thinking, was able to use the profit from my Seattle area home to buy a very nice house here with cash. Makes a world of difference in retirement. I don't think I have the $$ you do, so I think you could really enjoy it! IMHO, Cleveland is improving rapidly, although it has a way to go. I think investing in property in Lakewood, before things get more expensive, is also a good idea. I haven't researched the price of a flight to Boston from here, but it's not so very far away that you couldn't visit as frequently as you like. Sorry to hear that you don't like Amish country, as I love it and driving through the area, and Mohican country completely relaxes me....as we drove south from Cleveland exploring the area, it completely reminded me of the New England countryside....fields, forests, streams, etc. Since you didn't move away from the East to the West Coast, things like Blue Jays, lightning bugs, monarch butterfiies, are probably not something you've missed! They were just an added bonus for me! Anyway, best wishes whatever you decide to do!
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 11:56 AM
 
9,635 posts, read 6,404,686 times
Reputation: 5565
Did you see this thread? You can use private messaging to contact posters.

https://www.city-data.com/forum/clev...xperience.html

Many of your questions could best be answered by long-time residents. E.g., perhaps select questions that don't ask for comparisons with Boston and post them here. Only you can weigh the financial considerations. However, read through the following thread for several years and definitely ponder post 3698 carefully regarding the decision to reinvest in Cleveland with Boston proceeds; timing is everything.

https://www.city-data.com/forum/clev...sions-370.html

Read through this thread and the nested links beginning with post 25.

https://www.city-data.com/forum/city...s-2020s-3.html

See posts 115 through 129 in this thread.

https://www.city-data.com/forum/city...banity-12.html

I wonder how coastal airports (e.g., Logan, JFK) will deal with rising sea level and increased storm risks in coming decades, and how fares will be impacted.

As you want to be near marinas, cities closer to Cleveland with marinas in the city or nearby would include Rocky River, Lakewood, Edgewater neighborhood of Cleveland, and Mentor (with very good nature preserves and beaches; check out the Mentor Lagoons Nature Preserve and Marina). Fairport Harbor is a quaint harbor town, but be conscious that in 2006 a supposed 500-year flood wiped out marinas on the Grand River. I believe Fairport has another marina on Lake Erie adjacent to the very good Lake Metroparks Lakefront Park that may be much less vulnerable to a repeat massive flood event, which becomes more likely with slower moving storms due to climate change. Willoughby, Kirtland, and Kirtland Hills are adjacent to Mentor, as are many Lake Metroparks and the wonderful Holden Arboretum.

Cleveland Hts. should be worth a look. Housing in that city may be a bargain (partially due to higher taxes and concerns over schools), but especially the neighborhoods near University Circle offer easy access to the Red Line (downtown, airport) and to several Lake Erie marinas as well as the great cultural institutions of University Circle and Little Italy restaurants.

Bratenahl also offers easy access to Lake Erie marinas from Gordon Park (East 55th St.) westward.

To the west of Cleveland, Vermilion likely is the most charming city on Lake Erie, but its marinas had access difficulties due to high Lake Erie levels last spring.

Due to flooding risks, I would prefer Lake Erie marinas to river marinas.

You're unlikely to reach a conclusion without seriously spending some time in Cleveland and exploring, especially during boating season if that remains a priority for you.

BTW, Cleveland is 2 1/2 hours to Allegheny National Forest; 3 1/2 hours to Letchworth State Park and Niagara Falls; 2 hours to the Chautauqua Institution; 90 minutes to Magee Marsh and the Ottawa National Wildlife Refuge; 4 1/2 hours to the Lake Michigan Gold Coast; and 4 1/2 hours to the New River Gorge National River for the best rafting and kayaking east of the Mississippi River; and 3 hours to the Hocking Hills State Park, and 90 minutes to Presque Isle State Park.

http://www.biggestweekinamericanbirding.com/

https://www.babble.com/travel/5-maje...ns-gold-coast/

Admittedly different than the multitude of attractions available from Boston, but considerations often overlooked by prospective residents.

Last edited by WRnative; 01-05-2020 at 12:11 PM..
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 12:04 PM
 
146 posts, read 62,022 times
Reputation: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
I wonder how coastal airports (e.g., Logan, JFK) will deal with rising sea level and increased storm risks in coming decades, and how fares will be impacted.

As you want to be near marinas, cities closer to Cleveland with marinas in the city or nearby would include Rocky River, Lakewood, Edgewater neighborhood of Cleveland, and Mentor (with very good nature preserves and beaches; check out the Mentor Lagoons Nature Preserve and Marina). Fairport Harbor is a quaint harbor town, but be conscious that in 2006 a supposed 500-year flood wiped out marinas on the Grand River. I believe Fairport has another marina on Lake Erie adjacent to the very good Lake Metroparks Lakefront Park that may be much less vulnerable to a repeat massive flood event, which becomes more likely with slower moving storms due to climate change. Willoughby, Kirtland, and Kirtland Hills are adjacent to Mentor, as are many Lake Metroparks and the wonderful Holden Arboretum.

Cleveland Hts. should be worth a look. Housing in that city may be a bargain (partially due to higher taxes and concerns over schools), but especially the neighborhoods near University Circle offer easy access to the Red Line (downtown, airport) and to several Lake Erie marinas as well as the great cultural institutions of University Circle and Little Italy restaurants.

Bratenahl also offers easy access to Lake Erie marinas from Gordon Park (East 55th St.) westward.

To the west of Cleveland, Vermilion likely is the most charming city on Lake Erie, but its marinas had access difficulties due to high Lake Erie levels last spring.

Due to flooding risks, I would prefer Lake Erie marinas to river marinas.

You're unlikely to reach a conclusion without seriously spending some time in Cleveland and exploring, especially during boating season if that remains a priority for you.

Thanks WR. I've actually spent a TON of time driving around (and eating around) CLE while my Mom underwent multiple treatments at CCF. Probably 4-6 weeks worth of exploring in total. Mentor, Fairport and Vermillion are too far out (driven thru them all). I would need to be closer to downtown since I want to be close to good ethnic eateries and easy driving distance to a marina. (and I don't need to worry about schools). Bratehnahl, although filled with gorgeous homes, is too isolated. I think Cleveland Heights, Lakewood and Rocky River would be the 3 top locations, but first I need to decide if CLE area is a viable option...that's why I want to talk to transplants.

I'll follow up on those links. Thanks again.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 12:38 PM
 
9,635 posts, read 6,404,686 times
Reputation: 5565
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechieTechie View Post
Thanks WR. I've actually spent a TON of time driving around (and eating around) CLE while my Mom underwent multiple treatments at CCF. Probably 4-6 weeks worth of exploring in total. Mentor, Fairport and Vermillion are too far out (driven thru them all). I would need to be closer to downtown since I want to be close to good ethnic eateries and easy driving distance to a marina. (and I don't need to worry about schools). Bratehnahl, although filled with gorgeous homes, is too isolated. I think Cleveland Heights, Lakewood and Rocky River would be the 3 top locations, but first I need to decide if CLE area is a viable option...that's why I want to talk to transplants.

I'll follow up on those links. Thanks again.
There are good ethnic eateries in and nearby Mentor, especially Italian and Mexican. I guess it depends upon what you mean by "near" and your ethnic food preferences. E.g., you could walk to Littly Italy eateries from southern Cleveland Hts. neigbhorhoods!

https://www.yelp.com/biz/the-origina...oughby-hills-2

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Restaura...unty_Ohio.html

Although it's take-out, Kuhar's has some of the best Wienerschnitzel in Greater Cleveland, but if Hungarian is your ethnic favorite, nobody tops the Balaton on Shaker Square. Euclid also has a variety of ethnic restaurants, such as Maria's, Mama Catena, Marta's, and Irie Jamaican Kitchen (take-out) on East 185th St.

https://www.kuhars.com/

https://www.yelp.com/biz/irie-jamaican-kitchen-euclid

Painesville, adjacent to Mentor, offers some of the best authentic tacos in Greater Cleveland at El Senor and La Casita.

https://www.cleveland.com/life-and-c...ing-guide.html

https://www.clevescene.com/scene-and...in-painesville

https://www.yelp.com/biz/la-mexicana-painesville

Regardless of where you live in Greater Cleveland, you likely will find good ethnic food nearby.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 02:06 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
9,858 posts, read 9,185,994 times
Reputation: 8889
Just moved from Boston not long ago. Honestly, there are areas around here that will remind you of New England. The Cleveland Metroparks are in my opinion just as good as Mass Audobon sanctuaries. Cuyahoga Valley National Park is excellent. Of course Lake Erie can meet your boating needs. Towns that will remind you of New England: Chagrin Falls, Chardon, Peninsula, Brecksville, Willoughby, Fairport Harbor, Madison, Oberlin.

Several areas of Cleveland proper and its suburbs also have Boston analogues. Public Square is quite similar to Copley Square. University Circle-Fenway, Little Italy-North End, Shaker Heights-Newton, Lakewood-Somerville, Seaport-the Flats, West Park-Watertown, Euclid-Lynn, Ohio City-Jamaica Plain, Old Brooklyn-Dorchester. If that helps...

Sounds to me like you would love Edgewater, Detroit Shoreway, or Lakewood. Nearby the most New Englandy places are Chagrin Falls and Shaker Heights. I moved from Boston in August and have been back to Boston twice since then. I still like Boston and New England in general, but I am more than ok with not living there anymore. Northeast Ohio doesn't have some things that make New England special, such as the White Mountains, the Maine coast, Cape Cod, etc. But in terms of day to day life, I prefer it here. Does anyone finish work and then go to Bar Harbor? No. There is no reason you couldn't live in Ohio and visit New England relatively frequently. But also not to sell anything in Ohio short either. There is a ton here to keep you occupied. My quality of life is so much higher now. I had 4 roommates in Brighton as recently as this summer. Now I live by myself in a one bedroom at Playhouse Square downtown (kinda similar to Downtown Crossing).

Let me know if you have any other questions. I know both areas quite well.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 07:28 PM
 
146 posts, read 62,022 times
Reputation: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
BTW, Cleveland is 2 1/2 hours to Allegheny National Forest; 3 1/2 hours to Letchworth State Park and Niagara Falls; 2 hours to the Chautauqua Institution; 90 minutes to Magee Marsh and the Ottawa National Wildlife Refuge; 4 1/2 hours to the Lake Michigan Gold Coast; and 4 1/2 hours to the New River Gorge National River for the best rafting and kayaking east of the Mississippi River; and 3 hours to the Hocking Hills State Park, and 90 minutes to Presque Isle State Park.
Thanks for the reminder of Hocking Hills...have spent many weekends hanging out in their cabins (and have camped in the Northern Alleghenies too...though it was LONG ago).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicorn hunter View Post
Not sure how helpful this reply will be, but I grew up in New England, lived the bulk of my adult life on the West Coast (Seattle area), spent 5 months renting in Cleveland (Shaker Square) and now retired in North Central Ohio. I, like you are thinking, was able to use the profit from my Seattle area home to buy a very nice house here with cash. Since you didn't move away from the East to the West Coast, things like Blue Jays, lightning bugs, monarch butterfiies, are probably not something you've missed! They were just an added bonus for me! Anyway, best wishes whatever you decide to do!
Thank you...if you don't mind me asking, where did you live in Seattle. I spent a year commuting to a client in Bellevue, and have family in Redmond. I would have LOVED to move to Seattle before the boom....but the value prop just isn't there any more. Oh, and I miss lighting bugs. And, summer sunsets at 9:30p.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
You could walk to Littly Italy eateries from southern Cleveland Hts. neigbhorhoods! Although it's take-out, Kuhar's has some of the best Wienerschnitzel in Greater Cleveland, but if Hungarian is your ethnic favorite, nobody tops the Balaton on Shaker Square. Euclid also has a variety of ethnic restaurants, such as Maria's, Mama Catena, Marta's, and Irie Jamaican Kitchen (take-out) on East 185th St. Regardless of where you live in Greater Cleveland, you likely will find good ethnic food nearby.
Thanks...I've eaten at several places in Little Italy, including Mia Bella (1st time GREAT, 2nd time very mediocre) and Trattoria on the Hill (bad, dusty). Mom and I wanted to go to Balaton (my Dad is 2nd generation Romanian) but they were closed on the particular day we had planned. Good curried goat is hard to find, I'll have to check out Irie. The challenge is that most of the places I've tried don't measure up to the best places in Metro Boston. I just (literally 20 minutes ago) had hand pulled Hunan noodles (with spiced lamb) delivered to my doorstep. The 2 good Szchewan places I've eaten at in CLE (Szechuan Gourmet and Szechuan Cafe) don't deliver to the neighborhoods I'm looking at. I'm not trying to bash CLE restaurants, there are good ones, I know that (The marrow at Lolita is to DIE for; and Urban Farmer is very, very good steak for the money). But it's the convenience and Boston's sheer depth of quality that I would have to get over if I move to CLE.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24 View Post
Several areas of Cleveland proper and its suburbs also have Boston analogues. Public Square is quite similar to Copley Square. University Circle-Fenway, Little Italy-North End, Shaker Heights-Newton, Lakewood-Somerville, Seaport-the Flats, West Park-Watertown, Euclid-Lynn, Ohio City-Jamaica Plain, Old Brooklyn-Dorchester. If that helps...

Sounds to me like you would love Edgewater, Detroit Shoreway, or Lakewood. Nearby the most New Englandy places are Chagrin Falls and Shaker Heights. I moved from Boston in August and have been back to Boston twice since then. I still like Boston and New England in general, but I am more than ok with not living there anymore. Northeast Ohio doesn't have some things that make New England special, such as the White Mountains, the Maine coast, Cape Cod, etc. But in terms of day to day life, I prefer it here. Does anyone finish work and then go to Bar Harbor? No. There is no reason you couldn't live in Ohio and visit New England relatively frequently. But also not to sell anything in Ohio short either. There is a ton here to keep you occupied. My quality of life is so much higher now. I had 4 roommates in Brighton as recently as this summer. Now I live by myself in a one bedroom at Playhouse Square downtown (kinda similar to Downtown Crossing).

Let me know if you have any other questions. I know both areas quite well.
Thank you for the side by side comparison. It's interesting you equate Lakewood to Slumerville (lol). I was surprised when I google mapped the Lakeville area south of 6...those lots are tiny (which, you are absolutely right, just like Somerville). And I flat out love Cleveland and Shaker Heights. You are right, it's Newton Centre. And, it's funny, I did find a house in Edgewater that I loved...but it had just been pulled from the market.

But I want a park where I could take my dog off leash. My town (Rt 2/128 corridor) has off leash hours before 9am...and it seems like Metroparks are leash only (which SUCKS with a 15 month old Shepherd mutt who loves to RUN). Seems like CLE has not yet caught up with dog friendly parks. Am I wrong?

You have a fair point regarding not bopping up to Bar Harbor or down to Ptown after work. But I loved running down to the Cape on a warm Spring weekend day to cycle (few tourists, often warmer that Boston) and exploring the coast of Maine on my boat (my Mom and I spent 2 weeks this past summer exploring all the harbors just south of Acadia). And, I would definitely miss my ski house in VT. I would have to reverse commute for my vacations...again, I know it can be done....but it's a mind shift. Guess I could be like 1/2 the folks in Colorado and fly out West to ski 1 or 2 times per year. On the positive side, I'd have more money to travel due to my lower COL.

What do you REALLY miss about Boston?

Last edited by TechieTechie; 01-05-2020 at 07:37 PM..
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-05-2020, 10:46 PM
 
9,635 posts, read 6,404,686 times
Reputation: 5565
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechieTechie View Post
The marrow at Lolita is to DIE for; and Urban Farmer is very, very good steak for the money). But it's the convenience and Boston's sheer depth of quality that I would have to get over if I move to CLE.
I think the bone marrow in Cleveland is an overpriced joke. Anybody could make their own much more cheaply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TechieTechie View Post
But I want a park where I could take my dog off leash. My town (Rt 2/128 corridor) has off leash hours before 9am...and it seems like Metroparks are leash only (which SUCKS with a 15 month old Shepherd mutt who loves to RUN). Seems like CLE has not yet caught up with dog friendly parks. Am I wrong?
I think most dog parks in Greater Cleveland are off leash. Check them out in each community or perhaps at the following websites. This may be one of the larger off-leash parks.

Canine Meadow Dog Park in Kirtland, Ohio - Lake Metroparks | Lake Metroparks

https://www.bringfido.com/attraction...eveland_oh_us/

https://chparks.com/181/Dog-Park

It's true that national parks, state parks, and county ("Metro" in Ohio) parks generally have leash requirements. So do most localities. Growing up, most dogs roamed off leash. No longer.

Edgewater Park, Fairport Harbor (the latter is part of the Lake Metropark Fairport Lakeshore Park) have dog beaches, apparently off-leash, as do apparently other beaches.

http://doglifeincle.com/edgewater-park/

https://wagwalking.com/lifestyle/bea...dgewater-beach

https://dogsinthecle.com/dog-friendl...eland/beaches/

https://wagwalking.com/lifestyle/beaches/oh

https://www.yelp.com/biz/south-eucli...fsAIL-ZxwHmJ-g

https://patch.com/ohio/cleveland/cle...ur-pooch-leash
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Ohio > Cleveland

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2021, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top