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Old 06-08-2020, 12:35 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
9,849 posts, read 9,140,958 times
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Speak of the devil, E 79 & Euclid, the Villa: looted again today. Boards ripped off and big time looting once more. I gotta say, I don't understand it.
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Old 06-08-2020, 04:17 PM
 
Location: Mexico City, formerly Columbus, Ohio
15,941 posts, read 15,291,242 times
Reputation: 7195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland_Collector View Post
Where did I say there wasn't some level of organization? Even the Hough riots were organized to some degree. The problem with blaming a fringe group for the lion's share of the responsibility is that the long slow burn of our president's almost daily idiocy combined with some fairly acute dire circumstances - the real underlying reason for the outburst - gets completely marginalized by many. Now clearly, the violence we all witnessed was terrible and uncalled for. But let's please save the politically motivated conspiracy theories until there's some hard evidence.
We know it largely wasn't Antifa for a lot of reasons. Antifa has no leaders, no organization. At best, it's a philosophy, so it's almost impossible to blame them when they essentially don't exist. Furthermore, there have been widespread reports confirming that a lot of the violence was perpetuated by white supremacist groups hoping to create more chaos and a "civil war". Otherwise, those looting and protesting were just opportunists without any real political philosophy.

Now that the violent stage of this seems to mostly be behind us (hopefully), it seems to be morphing into a full-fledged national (maybe even global) movement. I've never seen anything like it, because it's not just happening in large, liberal cities, but even in small towns in the reddest of states. People finally seem tired of the status quo in ways they never were before, perhaps related to all of the chaos and crises of recent years and the seeming lack of any real leadership. It's no doubt a very scary time to be a racist after they were at peak the last few years.
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Old 06-08-2020, 08:51 PM
 
106 posts, read 24,423 times
Reputation: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24 View Post
Speak of the devil, E 79 & Euclid, the Villa: looted again today. Boards ripped off and big time looting once more. I gotta say, I don't understand it.
You live in Cleveland, get used to it.

And get used to major homicide increases this year. Homis are up 55% from same date last year. This scary increase even while CLE was in lockdown pandemic.

Where are the woke white folks on this level of lost black lives?

Last edited by LNQ20; 06-08-2020 at 09:14 PM..
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Old 06-08-2020, 08:53 PM
 
106 posts, read 24,423 times
Reputation: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
We know it largely wasn't Antifa for a lot of reasons. Antifa has no leaders, no organization. At best, it's a philosophy, so it's almost impossible to blame them when they essentially don't exist. Furthermore, there have been widespread reports confirming that a lot of the violence was perpetuated by white supremacist groups hoping to create more chaos and a "civil war". Otherwise, those looting and protesting were just opportunists without any real political philosophy.

Now that the violent stage of this seems to mostly be behind us (hopefully), it seems to be morphing into a full-fledged national (maybe even global) movement. I've never seen anything like it, because it's not just happening in large, liberal cities, but even in small towns in the reddest of states. People finally seem tired of the status quo in ways they never were before, perhaps related to all of the chaos and crises of recent years and the seeming lack of any real leadership. It's no doubt a very scary time to be a racist after they were at peak the last few years.
Who are the white supremacist groups? No one has mentioned the names of the groups. Why?

ANTIFA had active leadership in large progressive blue cities. I've seen them and in action in more than one city.

If the alt-left is saying it's the alt-right and the alt left is ANTIFA, what is the alt right counterpart that you're saying actually was behind the violence?
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Old 06-08-2020, 09:04 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
9,849 posts, read 9,140,958 times
Reputation: 8847
Quote:
Originally Posted by LNQ20 View Post
You live in Cleveland, get used to it.

And get used to major homicide increases this year. Homis are up 55% from same date last year. This scary increase even while CLE was in lockdown pandemic.

Where are the woke white folks on this level of lost black lives?
Well I mean, I have never once set foot at the Villa, so it doesn't really mean much to me personally. I just don't understand looting in general. Self destructive.
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Old 06-08-2020, 09:15 PM
 
106 posts, read 24,423 times
Reputation: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24 View Post
Well I mean, I have never once set foot at the Villa, so it doesn't really mean much to me personally. I just don't understand looting in general. Self destructive.
I know what you mean, but get to used to it regardless.

Even if it doesn't have a personal effect, is not good for Cleveland's ability to actually attract population. Self-destruction is one things, destruction of other peoples' lives is another thing altogether.

Last edited by LNQ20; 06-08-2020 at 10:30 PM..
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Old 06-09-2020, 07:18 AM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
5,050 posts, read 8,215,079 times
Reputation: 4835
I don't know, it seems to me that looting is only hard to understand if you assume it's related to George Floyd's death, and the resulting protests, in a meaningful way. IMO, the looting is not much different than burglary, except that the perpetrators are able to hide behind the legitimate protests.

Last edited by JR_C; 06-09-2020 at 07:48 AM..
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Old 06-09-2020, 04:31 PM
 
Location: Mexico City, formerly Columbus, Ohio
15,941 posts, read 15,291,242 times
Reputation: 7195
Quote:
Originally Posted by LNQ20 View Post
Who are the white supremacist groups? No one has mentioned the names of the groups. Why?

ANTIFA had active leadership in large progressive blue cities. I've seen them and in action in more than one city.

If the alt-left is saying it's the alt-right and the alt left is ANTIFA, what is the alt right counterpart that you're saying actually was behind the violence?
Several groups have been mentioned over the last few weeks. The one I saw mentioned the most were the Bougaloos. The incident of the guy shooting at protesters in Seattle recently was a member of the KKK.

Again, there is no actual leadership structure and I would challenge you to actually show people claiming to be Antifa leaders in any city. Antifa, it seems, is anyone who you seem to think is part of the left. That's really not how it works.
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Old 06-09-2020, 06:46 PM
 
106 posts, read 24,423 times
Reputation: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Several groups have been mentioned over the last few weeks. The one I saw mentioned the most were the Bougaloos. The incident of the guy shooting at protesters in Seattle recently was a member of the KKK.

Again, there is no actual leadership structure and I would challenge you to actually show people claiming to be Antifa leaders in any city. Antifa, it seems, is anyone who you seem to think is part of the left. That's really not how it works.
Well, I've seen ANTIFA live and person in Portland, Washington DC, and Philadelphia. Not sure who would acknowledge actual leadership but there were people directing on May 30, unless they're disguised Boogaloo members.

So, no, not everyone on the left is ANTIFA just like not everyone on the right is Boogaloo. Boy the Boogaloo sure was a swingin' dance back in the '60s; good Saturday morning kids show as well. Shame to see such a fun name association ruined by racists.

I read that the man involved in the Seattle incident was arrested but hadn't read anything on his ID and KKK affilation. Gotta be an old man by now though if was a former KKK member.
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Old 06-09-2020, 07:27 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH
9,849 posts, read 9,140,958 times
Reputation: 8847
Quote:
Originally Posted by LNQ20 View Post
Well, I've seen ANTIFA live and person in Portland, Washington DC, and Philadelphia. Not sure who would acknowledge actual leadership but there were people directing on May 30, unless they're disguised Boogaloo members.

So, no, not everyone on the left is ANTIFA just like not everyone on the right is Boogaloo. Boy the Boogaloo sure was a swingin' dance back in the '60s; good Saturday morning kids show as well. Shame to see such a fun name association ruined by racists.

I read that the man involved in the Seattle incident was arrested but hadn't read anything on his ID and KKK affilation. Gotta be an old man by now though if was a former KKK member.
ok, what is this boogaloo thing? Can someone explain this?
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