CSU Law - Where from here? (Cleveland, Parma: apartments, renting, crime)

[ECrash11]

Hey. I have been reading over these postings and I need HELP. I am moving to Cleveland for law school in August and am planning on spending some time there this summer. I need to know the best area to live for kid stuff. I am a single mom of an 8 year old, so I need a safe neighborhood with decent schools, possibly near the rapid train, but does not have to be. Maybe with a park close by and good community involvment. I'm talking middle class neighnorhood, apartments will be good too. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

[gtsurfer05]

Well, on the west side there is a variety of choices. Lakewood is a big community, with a more urban feel to it, yet its still safe. You've got many options from renting(either a house or Apartment) to owning. The schools are pretty decent too. The "bad" areas of Lakewood are the areas around W.117th bordering Cleveland (Bird City). In reality its bad compared to the rest of Lakewood, but is still ok. I've got older relatives over there that have lived there most of their lives with little to no problems. There is also a rapid station right on W.117 and Madison with free parking. Overall Lakewood is a pretty good community, slight decline from its heyday, but nothing as compared to its east side counterparts(in terms of crime and decline). Other options on the west involving the Rapid is Brook Park. Its connected to the Berea school system(decent to good), and its another decent community. The area along Brookpark Road is industrial with some adult establishments, and lead down towards the Airport. The actual residential areas are good though, basically middle class, blue collar families. A few other cities that could fit your preferences would be :
Brookyln- Decent Schools, Safe, Good Community Services(especially for the elderly which are alot of the population, good rec center). Close to the Zoo, and they've got their community park which is pretty good too. Its also relatively close to the Brookpark Rapid Station. Only downside is that its slowly experiencing the decay of the Cleveland areas around it. Once Old Brooklyn(cleveland area and one of the two last "good" areas in Cleveland) becomes bad then Brooklyn will be next. Apartment choices are pretty slim too, its mostly houses.
Fairview Park- It borders Cleveland, and has a decent school system. Its within reach of the West Park rapid station(by car or bus), and has a choice of houses or apartments.
Parma- Its a big community, with many many choices of places to live. There is 3 different high schools serving the city(Parma, Parma Heights, and Seven Hills reason for 3 high schools). Schools are pretty decent too. Parma is a good community too, with many area parks.

All of these communities are good communities with decent to good schools(nothing to worry about). They are within close reach of either the highways or the rapid stations on the west side.

As for the East Side, its a toss up. The eastern inner suburbs are in more of a decline than their western counterparts. Shaker Hts, and Shaker Square(Cleveland but part of Shaker school system) have the rapid go through it, pretty safe too. Schools are called excellent but have gone down slightly. Areas around Shaker Square are pretty bad, and the areas where Cleveland and Shaker border are the "bad" areas of Shaker. Areas to avoid would be East Cleveland(ghetto),Euclid, Cleveland Hts(its ok, but overrated and going downhill. Schools are not great, especially the High School), North Randall, Highland Hills, Warrensville Heights, Maple Heights, parts of Garfield Heights.
The east side cities can be a toss up, the inner ring ones can be a toss up between less expensive living, however less decent schools and safety concerns. The outer ones tend to be much more suburban and rich(some of the most expensive houses being on the fringes of the eastern suburbs). A city like Garfield Heights or Cleveland heights can be moderately safe, however its not a place where I'd recommend raising a kid or sending them to their schools.

[Clevelander17]

Originally Posted by gtsurfer05

Well, on the west side there is a variety of choices. Lakewood is a big community, with a more urban feel to it, yet its still safe. You've got many options from renting(either a house or Apartment) to owning. The schools are pretty decent too. The "bad" areas of Lakewood are the areas around W.117th bordering Cleveland (Bird City). In reality its bad compared to the rest of Lakewood, but is still ok. I've got older relatives over there that have lived there most of their lives with little to no problems. There is also a rapid station right on W.117 and Madison with free parking. Overall Lakewood is a pretty good community, slight decline from its heyday, but nothing as compared to its east side counterparts(in terms of crime and decline). Other options on the west involving the Rapid is Brook Park. Its connected to the Berea school system(decent to good), and its another decent community. The area along Brookpark Road is industrial with some adult establishments, and lead down towards the Airport. The actual residential areas are good though, basically middle class, blue collar families. A few other cities that could fit your preferences would be :
Brookyln- Decent Schools, Safe, Good Community Services(especially for the elderly which are alot of the population, good rec center). Close to the Zoo, and they've got their community park which is pretty good too. Its also relatively close to the Brookpark Rapid Station. Only downside is that its slowly experiencing the decay of the Cleveland areas around it. Once Old Brooklyn(cleveland area and one of the two last "good" areas in Cleveland) becomes bad then Brooklyn will be next. Apartment choices are pretty slim too, its mostly houses.
Fairview Park- It borders Cleveland, and has a decent school system. Its within reach of the West Park rapid station(by car or bus), and has a choice of houses or apartments.
Parma- Its a big community, with many many choices of places to live. There is 3 different high schools serving the city(Parma, Parma Heights, and Seven Hills reason for 3 high schools). Schools are pretty decent too. Parma is a good community too, with many area parks.

All of these communities are good communities with decent to good schools(nothing to worry about). They are within close reach of either the highways or the rapid stations on the west side.

As for the East Side, its a toss up. The eastern inner suburbs are in more of a decline than their western counterparts. Shaker Hts, and Shaker Square(Cleveland but part of Shaker school system) have the rapid go through it, pretty safe too. Schools are called excellent but have gone down slightly. Areas around Shaker Square are pretty bad, and the areas where Cleveland and Shaker border are the "bad" areas of Shaker. Areas to avoid would be East Cleveland(ghetto),Euclid, Cleveland Hts(its ok, but overrated and going downhill. Schools are not great, especially the High School), North Randall, Highland Hills, Warrensville Heights, Maple Heights, parts of Garfield Heights.
The east side cities can be a toss up, the inner ring ones can be a toss up between less expensive living, however less decent schools and safety concerns. The outer ones tend to be much more suburban and rich(some of the most expensive houses being on the fringes of the eastern suburbs). A city like Garfield Heights or Cleveland heights can be moderately safe, however its not a place where I'd recommend raising a kid or sending them to their schools.

Shaker Heights has, by far, the best school district out of any of the inner-ring suburbs. Cleveland Heights is the safest of any, although Shaker Heights is pretty safe, too. Those two compare very favorably to anything the western inner-ring suburbs have to offer. Outside of that, generally speaking, I'd avoid East Cleveland, Euclid, Warrensville Heights, Maple Heights, Garfield Heights, and Bedford.

[gtsurfer05]

Shaker is the best out of the inner ring suburbs, however its gone slightly down. I'd rather send a kid to Solon then Shaker. I would not be so quick to call Cleveland Heights the safest. Its got urban decay/crime pulling at it from Cleveland/East Cleveland. Plus the behavior of the schools give a good glimpse into how kids are raised and the crime around the city, and the news from the Cleveland Heights High School is not good. Especially when you've had kids after robbing a store during school hours, counting their loot in the middle of a class, there are countless other stories from there to make it seem like a inner city school if you just told people what happened and didn't give a name.

[Clevelander17]

Originally Posted by gtsurfer05

Shaker is the best out of the inner ring suburbs, however its gone slightly down. I'd rather send a kid to Solon then Shaker.

I'd be okay sending my kid to either high school. Shaker Heights High School, despite having "gone slightly down," is still very good. And especially if your kid is in honors, I'd argue there's no better place to send him/her in the Cleveland area, perhaps even Ohio (at least as far as public schools go).

I don't put much stock in the Ohio report card ratings. I have a good feeling that if the two student bodies were switched, the kids from Solon would do just as well, in general, at Shaker Heights. On the flip side, I also suspect that the kids from Shaker Heights at Solon, especially the lower-income/minorities, would do worse. I say this simply because Shaker Heights has done an excellent job of closing the infamous "achievement gap" to some degree. The school has even received national attention for its work in that area (not to mention national attention for its honors programs and sending kids to Ivy League schools).

Originally Posted by gtsurfer05

I would not be so quick to call Cleveland Heights the safest. Its got urban decay/crime pulling at it from Cleveland/East Cleveland. Plus the behavior of the schools give a good glimpse into how kids are raised and the crime around the city, and the news from the Cleveland Heights High School is not good. Especially when you've had kids after robbing a store during school hours, counting their loot in the middle of a class, there are countless other stories from there to make it seem like a inner city school if you just told people what happened and didn't give a name.

Cleveland Heights is a large, diverse suburb, and generalizations don't work when describing it.

Let's clarify something here: What happens in the school and in the city are two separate things. The city itself is very safe, look at the crime stats on city-data if you do not believe me. The police force in CH is one of the most aggressive in metropolitan Cleveland area.

There are some bad areas, but most of Cleveland Heights is decent, and there are some very good areas, like the old millionaire's row in the western part of the city along Fairmount Boulevard and all of the off-shooting streets. The area isn't as wealthy as it used to be, but it is still home to a very large portion of the area's doctors and lawyers because of its proximity to Cleveland and University Circle (Shaker Heights benefits from this, as well). Generally speaking, the entire part of Cleveland Heights that borders Cleveland is okay, because its borders are with Little Italy and University Circle. I'd say Cleveland Heights' biggest problem is its border with East Cleveland. Those areas tend to be the worst.

The schools are a different story. Most of the middle class families and upper class families that live in Cleveland Heights that can send their kids to private schools, do utilize that option. I think the percentage of kids in CH attending private schools is amongst the highest Northeast Ohio (University Heights is far and away the highest, and it is actually part of the CH district). It's not because the schools are "bad," per se, but because they have a very bad image. I'd would feel comfortable sending my kid to a public elementary school in Cleveland Heights, maybe a middle school (Roxboro only), but nothing past that point. Your assessment of Cleveland Heights High School is a little blown out of proportion, but not too far from the truth. The education that one receives there isn't terrible, and honors students do well there, too, but the problem is that there are too many troubled students ruining the experience for everyone else. Cleveland Heights used to have an alternate school for those troubled kids, but it closed a few years back due to budget constraints.

Bottom line, if one is going to live in an inner-ring suburb on the east side, the two Heights' are good options for someone with younger kids. Shaker Heights would be a much better long-term option, however. Just my two sense, as someone who grew up in the area and still spends a lot of time there.

[Steve36]

Let's clarify something here: What happens in the school and in the city are two separate things. The city itself is very safe, look at the crime stats on city-data if you do not believe me. The police force in CH is one of the most aggressive in metropolitan Cleveland area.

While I'm a fan of parts of CH, I do not believe the crime data reported by that city are even close to accurate.

[gtsurfer05]

Originally Posted by Clevelander17

Let's clarify something here: What happens in the school and in the city are two separate things.


It's not because the schools are "bad," per se, but because they have a very bad image. I'd would feel comfortable sending my kid to a public elementary school in Cleveland Heights, maybe a middle school (Roxboro only), but nothing past that point. Your assessment of Cleveland Heights High School is a little blown out of proportion, but not too far from the truth.

My assessment of CHHS is not blown out of proportion. Its also crazy to say that schools and the city are two different issues. It does give a good indication of how kids are being raised, their attitudes in school reflect how they'll act outside of school(especially if they're robbing places during lunch time). The actions of the students in the high school reflect the trend of the inner city element coming into the city.

The fact that the middle and upper class send their kids to private schools does not reflect on an image, but how the high school is actually performing. There are countless other stories of how many of these kids act in school(drugs,sex,theft,fighting both students and techers). Sure there are a few good students who actually want to learn and their parents most likely push them to do that, but they don't have an over whelming majority. I know teachers who worked in the High school, and before they retired it was not good,and when they ask fellow teachers how its gone, they respond with the same or worse. So No I don't think that my assessment of the High School is too far off.

[Clevelander17]

Originally Posted by Steve36

While I'm a fan of parts of CH, I do not believe the crime data reported by that city are even close to accurate.

I wouldn't disagree with you, but if Cleveland Heights is lying about crime stats, then other cities/suburbs are doing it, too. I've never felt unsafe in Cleveland Heights, although, admittedly, I know the places to stay away from and the times to stay away from them.

[Clevelander17]

Originally Posted by gtsurfer05

My assessment of CHHS is not blown out of proportion. Its also crazy to say that schools and the city are two different issues. It does give a good indication of how kids are being raised, their attitudes in school reflect how they'll act outside of school(especially if they're robbing places during lunch time). The actions of the students in the high school reflect the trend of the inner city element coming into the city.

Like I said before, they are too different and separate issues simply because of the fact that so many people do not send their kids to the public schools. I'm going to sound like a broken record here, but Cleveland Heights is far too big to be making generalizations about it. The inner-city element that has come into the city is only in certain parts. Other parts are still nice and very livable. The inner-city element has also crept in to west side burbs like Lakewood and Parma, so I don't know what point you're trying to make.

Originally Posted by gtsurfer05

The fact that the middle and upper class send their kids to private schools does not reflect on an image, but how the high school is actually performing. There are countless other stories of how many of these kids act in school(drugs,sex,theft,fighting both students and techers). Sure there are a few good students who actually want to learn and their parents most likely push them to do that, but they don't have an over whelming majority. I know teachers who worked in the High school, and before they retired it was not good,and when they ask fellow teachers how its gone, they respond with the same or worse. So No I don't think that my assessment of the High School is too far off.

Again, things are not great at CHHS, but they're not as terrible as you're making them out to be. And for as bad as Cleveland Heights schools supposedly are, they're really no worse than Lakewood or Parma. The fact is that all of the large, inner-ring cities/districts have problems.

Cleveland Heights High School's Alexander Dylan Kraus wants to make going green profitable - Senior Standouts: The Plain Dealer's Top High School Seniors - cleveland.com

[gtsurfer05]

All I'm saying is that since CHHS is still a good sized school, so many of the problems in it do reflect whats going on in the community. I'm not making generalized statements about the city, sure there is good and bad parts, but since the person who posted the question seems to be on a budget, that they'd have to watch out and be more of a vigilant parent if sending their child to CHCSD, especially if they would be going to the High School.
As for the inner-city element, sure its crept into Parma, and Lakewood, but not as much as CH, and their High Schools have not taken as big of a hit as CH has. In the end, all of these high schools should be getting the same standard education(ie what to learn in history, etc), but the atmosphere that the students go to school in, is totally different at CH, than at Parma or Lakewood.