Baker Mayfield struggles may doom season (Cleveland, Congress: assess, to move, office)

[ohioaninsc]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Baker wasn't the problem yesterday.

For the most part that's true...but I will tell you this...if you give a truly elite QB the ball w/ 1:30 to go and tell them to go score a TD to win...they do it...once the Chargers took the lead, I knew it was over. I have 0 faith that Baker can lead a game winning drive in crunch time because he's not done it once in 4 yrs.
Put Aaron Rogers, Tom Brady, Pat Mahomoes, Russel Wilson, even Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, and Dak Prescott in that situation and I have confidence they can get it done...I have no confidence Baker can.
And he failed at it miserably again. When you have no timeouts and have to go 75 yards and only 1:30 left, you cannot throw 3 yard passes in the middle of the field....it took them 50 seconds to gain 11 yards. Any true franchise QB knows they have to get chunk plays...meaning 15-20 yard passes down the field, or they must at least be passes to the sideline to get out of bounds.


As for the the game yesterday...kind of hard to stop anybody, let a lone a top 10 QB when your entire starting defensive backfield is out hurt, and you also have a hurt DE which allowed them to key on Myles much better...the loss of Clowner, Newsome, Greedy and Ward killed the defense...

Lastly, a truly great offense when they get the ball w/ 3 min and a 1 score lead runs the clock out and does not give the ball back to the opponent. We not only went 3 and out. but we did so in less than a minute.

[Unicorn hunter]

I am not an expert, by any means, but doesn't the quarterback have to do what the coach tells him to do? So, if Baker makes three long passes, rather than three short passes, isn't he just doing what the coach tells him to do? Ditto for not using the clock wisely? Seriously, I don't know, but from commentators on tv, I always assumed the QB doesn't just make up the plays himself. Am I mistaken?

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by ohioaninsc

For the most part that's true...but I will tell you this...if you give a truly elite QB the ball w/ 1:30 to go and tell them to go score a TD to win...they do it...once the Chargers took the lead, I knew it was over. I have 0 faith that Baker can lead a game winning drive in crunch time because he's not done it once in 4 yrs.
Put Aaron Rogers, Tom Brady, Pat Mahomoes, Russel Wilson, even Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, and Dak Prescott in that situation and I have confidence they can get it done...I have no confidence Baker can.
And he failed at it miserably again. When you have no timeouts and have to go 75 yards and only 1:30 left, you cannot throw 3 yard passes in the middle of the field....it took them 50 seconds to gain 11 yards. Any true franchise QB knows they have to get chunk plays...meaning 15-20 yard passes down the field, or they must at least be passes to the sideline to get out of bounds.


As for the the game yesterday...kind of hard to stop anybody, let a lone a top 10 QB when your entire starting defensive backfield is out hurt, and you also have a hurt DE which allowed them to key on Myles much better...the loss of Clowner, Newsome, Greedy and Ward killed the defense...

Lastly, a truly great offense when they get the ball w/ 3 min and a 1 score lead runs the clock out and does not give the ball back to the opponent. We not only went 3 and out. but we did so in less than a minute.

Likely perfect analysis!

Heard this same point made on 92.3 The Fan by Kenny Carman and Anthony Lima this morning while running errands. They thought that Baker Mayfield would have an excellent game until the Q4 letdown. However, they did think that the Browns were hosed by the refs with at least one blatant no-call interference that might have made a difference in the game.

Carman and Lima contrasted Mayfield with Justin Herbert, whom they considered a "near elite" NFL QB, an emerging consensus by NFL analysts. Herbert actually is carrying the Chargers, who have one of the league's worst defenses.

https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2021/1...021-browns-win

In only his second NFL season, Herbert was drafted sixth in the 2020 NFL draft.

Mayfield does not appear capable of being an elite NFL QB and this explains the rightful reluctance of the Browns' very good and very analytical brain trust to offer Mayfield long-term, franchise QB contract money. Hopefully, they don't back down on their position. Carman and Lima did mention that the Browns' offensive scheme with its run-heavy emphasis may be holding back Mayfield's potential, as evidenced by his rookie season.

If the Browns defense now is crippled by injuries, this may not be a play-off year and a perfect opportunity to position the team even better for great things in subsequent seasons.

[ohioaninsc]

Originally Posted by WRnative

Likely perfect analysis!

Heard this same point made on 92.3 The Fan by Kenny Carman and Anthony Lima this morning while running errands. They thought that Baker Mayfield would have an excellent game until the Q4 letdown. However, they did think that the Browns were hosed by the refs with at least one blatant no-call interference that might have made a difference in the game.

Carman and Lima contrasted Mayfield with Justin Herbert, whom they considered a "near elite" NFL QB, an emerging consensus by NFL analysts. Herbert actually is carrying the Chargers, who have one of the league's worst defenses.

https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2021/1...021-browns-win

In only his second NFL season, Herbert was drafted sixth in the 2020 NFL draft.

Mayfield does not appear capable of being an elite NFL QB and this explains the rightful reluctance of the Browns' very good and very analytical brain trust to offer Mayfield long-term, franchise QB contract money. Hopefully, they don't back down on their position. Carman and Lima did mention that the Browns' offensive scheme with its run-heavy emphasis may be holding back Mayfield's potential, as evidenced by his rookie season.

If the Browns defense now is crippled by injuries, this may not be a play-off year and a perfect opportunity to position the team even better for great things in subsequent seasons.

That call they referenced was a terrible call...that said, a good team overcomes bad calls...they couldn't make a defensive stop in the 4th quarter...that's why they lost more than anything.
As for this season, if they don't make the playoffs, their will be a lot of soul searching and probably major changes again...this is too deep of a team to use the excuse of injuries not to make the playoffs...a better job by the coaching staff and they win that one.
I think they need to get away from Analytics...the Patriots didn't win 6 Super Bowls b/c of analytics...they won 6 Superbowls because of an elite QB and and elite Coach. TB didn't win w/ analytics last year but because they had an elite QB, elite WRs, an elite D-line and an elite coach.

[ohioaninsc]

Originally Posted by Unicorn hunter

I am not an expert, by any means, but doesn't the quarterback have to do what the coach tells him to do? So, if Baker makes three long passes, rather than three short passes, isn't he just doing what the coach tells him to do? Ditto for not using the clock wisely? Seriously, I don't know, but from commentators on tv, I always assumed the QB doesn't just make up the plays himself. Am I mistaken?

Most QBs are given the freedom to change the play at the line of scrimmage...and on passing plays, most plays will have multiple options for the QB to go to...so for instance on that last drive, I guarentee that Stefanski didn't tell Baker to throw it to the shortest route when they needed go 75 yards in 1:30...especially when not one of these guys were in space and moving upfield.
I think where Baker is really challenged is w/ his short frame, he can't see downfield sometimes over top his bid OL and tall D'Lineman coming at him.
Herbert being 6'5 or more has no problem w/ that. Neither does Josh Allen in Buffalo. Neither of them have the same caliber of weapons that Baker and the Browns have.

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by ohioaninsc

That call they referenced was a terrible call...that said, a good team overcomes bad calls...they couldn't make a defensive stop in the 4th quarter...that's why they lost more than anything.
As for this season, if they don't make the playoffs, their will be a lot of soul searching and probably major changes again...this is too deep of a team to use the excuse of injuries not to make the playoffs...a better job by the coaching staff and they win that one.
I think they need to get away from Analytics...the Patriots didn't win 6 Super Bowls b/c of analytics...they won 6 Superbowls because of an elite QB and and elite Coach. TB didn't win w/ analytics last year but because they had an elite QB, elite WRs, an elite D-line and an elite coach.

Elite QBs and coaches are important, but drafting excellence also is important. The Browns front office has done a very good job in the drafts and free agent signings in the last two years.

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by ohioaninsc

Most QBs are given the freedom to change the play at the line of scrimmage...and on passing plays, most plays will have multiple options for the QB to go to...so for instance on that last drive, I guarentee that Stefanski didn't tell Baker to throw it to the shortest route when they needed go 75 yards in 1:30...especially when not one of these guys were in space and moving upfield.
I think where Baker is really challenged is w/ his short frame, he can't see downfield sometimes over top his bid OL and tall D'Lineman coming at him.
Herbert being 6'5 or more has no problem w/ that. Neither does Josh Allen in Buffalo. Neither of them have the same caliber of weapons that Baker and the Browns have.

I thought that Mayfield's height was an issue from the moment he was drafted.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by ohioaninsc

For the most part that's true...but I will tell you this...if you give a truly elite QB the ball w/ 1:30 to go and tell them to go score a TD to win...they do it...once the Chargers took the lead, I knew it was over. I have 0 faith that Baker can lead a game winning drive in crunch time because he's not done it once in 4 yrs.
Put Aaron Rogers, Tom Brady, Pat Mahomoes, Russel Wilson, even Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, and Dak Prescott in that situation and I have confidence they can get it done...I have no confidence Baker can.
And he failed at it miserably again. When you have no timeouts and have to go 75 yards and only 1:30 left, you cannot throw 3 yard passes in the middle of the field....it took them 50 seconds to gain 11 yards. Any true franchise QB knows they have to get chunk plays...meaning 15-20 yard passes down the field, or they must at least be passes to the sideline to get out of bounds.


As for the the game yesterday...kind of hard to stop anybody, let a lone a top 10 QB when your entire starting defensive backfield is out hurt, and you also have a hurt DE which allowed them to key on Myles much better...the loss of Clowner, Newsome, Greedy and Ward killed the defense...

Lastly, a truly great offense when they get the ball w/ 3 min and a 1 score lead runs the clock out and does not give the ball back to the opponent. We not only went 3 and out. but we did so in less than a minute.

Patrick Mahomes is 2-3. Actually kinda got it handed to him by the Bills last night.

[bjimmy24]

The Browns are the first team in NFL history to lose when having either 40 points and no turnovers or 40 points, 500 yards, and no turnovers, according to the Elias Sports Bureau.

[QCongress83216]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

The Browns are the first team in NFL history to lose when having either 40 points and no turnovers or 40 points, 500 yards, and no turnovers, according to the Elias Sports Bureau.

You know they were gonna have a field day with it since it's Cleveland BJimmy. If that were any other team, that wouldn't even been mentioned. JK. .