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Old 01-22-2019, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Winterville
181 posts, read 215,050 times
Reputation: 61

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In my opinion the unsaid problem with ECU or almost any college for that matter is that they are coming dangerously close to failing the same way the housing market did. Virtually anyone can get a school loan regardless of grades or finances. I understand the push to continue to grow bigger and try to draw in more students but people are starting to see my generation struggling to pay back their overpriced school loans. Having an education is not as likely to provide a well-paying career the way students are being told. When the government hands out loans like toilet paper there is no accountability and the schools will continue to spend money like crazy until the market changes. Either people will realize that the return on investment isn't worth it or the government may stop giving out loans to everyone. As it is they are practically predatory loans. I mean you can't even buy a beer when you graduate high school but you can take out a 5-6 figure loan over the course of a few years that you have no guarantee of being able to pay back.

I agree that few people go to ECU just for the education. In fact, I don't think most students choose any school for the quality of education let alone whether or not they want to live in the same town after they graduate. Most students change their major multiple times. I think we're all a bit guilty of being bright-eyed and over-optimistic about what we will be doing and where we will be after college. By the time they are done, most of them just want a reasonable chance to pay over their debt. They're just going to follow the best opportunity more often than not.

Because of this, the reduction in students makes me a bit nervous about the school continuing to grow in leaps and bounds. They, like everyone else, seem to expect that the money will always be there. The problem is that if it is not the community will end up suffering in more ways than one. The best way to avoid this is having work opportunities, lower cost of living and a decent amount of businesses to keep the community happy. A low cost of living and lower taxes encourage small and unique businesses.
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Old 01-22-2019, 11:49 AM
 
293 posts, read 271,060 times
Reputation: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by GarnetAndBlack View Post
If you think anyone is choosing ECU because of its academic qualifications you are living in a dream world. Now maybe academic environment where a marginal student can achieve success? Sure I'll go with that. But come on back down to earth. If someone wants to be a doctor and they can get into UNC, Duke, or WFU, they sure as hell are not coming here.

Also the majority of 16-17 year olds do not apply to a university based on where they want to live afterwards. If it's desirable they may stick around afterwards, but unless we are talking about NYC or something it's definitely not the reason they come in the first place.
Yes and no. It depends on the program. Colleges and universities have their overall rankings but so do programs. ECU's PA, PT, OT, and nursing are extremely competitive programs. Such is the nature of public programs, they're cheaper so more students apply and the admissions has to tighten. UNC, ECU, and WSSU are extremely competitive for PA and PT. Its easier to get into Duke's PT than it is ECU.

In general you are correct, ECU's academic reputation surely needs work. The research initiatives underway will help that tremendously. Increased research = increase funding = higher endowment and better faculty etc etc.
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Old 01-22-2019, 02:15 PM
 
2,401 posts, read 3,360,902 times
Reputation: 1406
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrancisDrake View Post
Yes and no. It depends on the program. Colleges and universities have their overall rankings but so do programs. ECU's PA, PT, OT, and nursing are extremely competitive programs. Such is the nature of public programs, they're cheaper so more students apply and the admissions has to tighten. UNC, ECU, and WSSU are extremely competitive for PA and PT. Its easier to get into Duke's PT than it is ECU.

In general you are correct, ECU's academic reputation surely needs work. The research initiatives underway will help that tremendously. Increased research = increase funding = higher endowment and better faculty etc etc.
But isnt all that you mentioned... "academics".

The problem isnt the quality of programs. ECU has high quality programs.

The only problems ECU have are...1) Its reputation (which isn't accurate) and 2)Its acceptance rate.

Personally I dont see the acceptance rate as a problem. Give kids a chance to get a quality education.

But other schools and ratings use ECU's acceptance rate against them in ranking them.

The most telling item a school should use is the quality of its GRADUATES.
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Old 01-22-2019, 07:09 PM
 
293 posts, read 271,060 times
Reputation: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by HP91 View Post
But isnt all that you mentioned... "academics".

The problem isnt the quality of programs. ECU has high quality programs.

The only problems ECU have are...1) Its reputation (which isn't accurate) and 2)Its acceptance rate.

Personally I dont see the acceptance rate as a problem. Give kids a chance to get a quality education.

But other schools and ratings use ECU's acceptance rate against them in ranking them.

The most telling item a school should use is the quality of its GRADUATES.
I was responding the GandB's comments on students choosing ECU for it's academic reputation or lack thereof. If you want to know what ECU needs to do, look at Arizona State over the past 15 or so years. This is a fantastic read from their president Michael Crow: https://www.csuchico.edu/futurepossi...tion_in_AZ.pdf

While ECU doesn't have the benefit of a city like Phoenix there are elements it can emulate. ASU serves a very similar population as ECU and they've had wonderful success fulfilling their dual mission of access and excellence.
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Old 01-23-2019, 05:40 AM
 
Location: Greenville, NC
163 posts, read 115,778 times
Reputation: 59
Road projects remain on target - Daily Reflector

Really looking forward to the forthcoming Dickinson Avenue improvements. Dickinson Ave. and 5th are major thoroughfares for bicycle commuters here and as yet have no bicycle/pedestrian facilities.
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Old 01-23-2019, 08:31 AM
 
293 posts, read 271,060 times
Reputation: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by bikepedguy View Post
Road projects remain on target - Daily Reflector

Really looking forward to the forthcoming Dickinson Avenue improvements. Dickinson Ave. and 5th are major thoroughfares for bicycle commuters here and as yet have no bicycle/pedestrian facilities.
It still bothers me that we voted on the connector in what 2003? But maybe it'll open this year.
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Old 01-23-2019, 11:40 AM
 
Location: Greenville, NC
163 posts, read 115,778 times
Reputation: 59
Welcome to the world of transportation funding. For an MPO and Division with comparatively little sway in the data-driving DOT prioritization process, 16 years from record of decision to completing construction is actually not bad.

Unrelated to transportation; following up on our conversation re: ECU academics-- looks like the Nursing program is helping to shift that perception.

I've met ECU nurses all over the country, including while working in Sacramento this summer and in Clearwater, FL, my hometown.

We're better than our administration projects and better than we think.
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Old 01-23-2019, 09:44 PM
 
Location: Greenville
153 posts, read 186,798 times
Reputation: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bret Wickstrom View Post
In my opinion the unsaid problem with ECU or almost any college for that matter is that they are coming dangerously close to failing the same way the housing market did. Virtually anyone can get a school loan regardless of grades or finances. I understand the push to continue to grow bigger and try to draw in more students but people are starting to see my generation struggling to pay back their overpriced school loans. Having an education is not as likely to provide a well-paying career the way students are being told. When the government hands out loans like toilet paper there is no accountability and the schools will continue to spend money like crazy until the market changes. Either people will realize that the return on investment isn't worth it or the government may stop giving out loans to everyone. As it is they are practically predatory loans. I mean you can't even buy a beer when you graduate high school but you can take out a 5-6 figure loan over the course of a few years that you have no guarantee of being able to pay back.

So I'm not lashing out at you about loans, just venting in general because I hear so much about it. I don't disagree that loans may be easy to get but I don't think we can lay the blame on the government for that one. They're trying to make an education attainable - and people scream and yell if they don't make these loans available. The problem is kids/parents are buying into this is not doing their homework regarding ability to repay the loan. Don't take the loan if you're not going to be able to repay it. And don't complain about the repayment after the fact. I don't think they're getting snookered - they just aren't responsibly researching what this entails.



When I went to college, I didn't have the money to pay for it and I didn't want to take out a loan. So I worked - on average of about 35 hours a week to pay for my college while taking 15-18 hours a semester for a Computer Science major/Math minor. I lived at home (another choice kids should consider if academics are truly their goal) and frankly, also helped my folks out with bills because my Dad went through a period with no job. I also received no financial aid. So it's doable. Yeah - maybe you don't get the full college experience of partying and all the social life, but I still enjoyed college life. I'm not saying this to tout myself I'm saying everyone has to be accountable for their decisions. And there are certainly alternatives which provide you a great education - including community college, which doesn't break the bank.


On that subject - I heard several months back...thought it was on this board, that there was a general expectation that ECU enrollment would likely hold or drop slightly because more students were being cost-conscious and choosing community colleges first. I still think ECU enrollment will tick back up for a lot of the reasons already mentioned here though.
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Old 01-24-2019, 06:27 AM
 
29 posts, read 30,407 times
Reputation: 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrecufan View Post
So I'm not lashing out at you about loans, just venting in general because I hear so much about it. I don't disagree that loans may be easy to get but I don't think we can lay the blame on the government for that one. They're trying to make an education attainable - and people scream and yell if they don't make these loans available. The problem is kids/parents are buying into this is not doing their homework regarding ability to repay the loan. Don't take the loan if you're not going to be able to repay it. And don't complain about the repayment after the fact. I don't think they're getting snookered - they just aren't responsibly researching what this entails.



When I went to college, I didn't have the money to pay for it and I didn't want to take out a loan. So I worked - on average of about 35 hours a week to pay for my college while taking 15-18 hours a semester for a Computer Science major/Math minor. I lived at home (another choice kids should consider if academics are truly their goal) and frankly, also helped my folks out with bills because my Dad went through a period with no job. I also received no financial aid. So it's doable. Yeah - maybe you don't get the full college experience of partying and all the social life, but I still enjoyed college life. I'm not saying this to tout myself I'm saying everyone has to be accountable for their decisions. And there are certainly alternatives which provide you a great education - including community college, which doesn't break the bank.


On that subject - I heard several months back...thought it was on this board, that there was a general expectation that ECU enrollment would likely hold or drop slightly because more students were being cost-conscious and choosing community colleges first. I still think ECU enrollment will tick back up for a lot of the reasons already mentioned here though.
Just wait until the next recession and the enrollment will go up quickly. When economics favor immediate employment after high school, university enrollment suffers.
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Old 01-24-2019, 11:36 AM
 
293 posts, read 271,060 times
Reputation: 64
There are several elements to ECU's enrollment decline in addition to what encecu stated about the economy. One is the NC promise scholarship at ECSU and Pembroke. Both schools draw from an area served by ECU so where they have gained enrollment ECU has surely lost. ECU also relies on its athletics (as we've discussed) as a draw and those have withered. Another is that younger generations tend to favor more urban areas and while Greenville is growing it does not have as much to offer in that regard.

If ECU leaders will stop dragging their school through the mud in the headlines I believe we'll see an uptick over the next several years as new initiatives take hold.
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