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Old 08-18-2011, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Fishers, IN
6,495 posts, read 10,802,779 times
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I don't want to see the death penalty assessed on The U. However, as an unapologetic Ohio State fan, I hope this shuts up the few knucklehead Miami fans who've complained that the Buckeyes should have to vacate the 2002 national championship over the current issues in the Ohio State program (as well as the incorrect assertion that Clarett was ineligible).
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Old 08-18-2011, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Midwestern Dystopia
2,371 posts, read 3,059,204 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waltlantz View Post
Erm, the minute they start paying players is when I consider throwing in my towel as a fan.

I agree there needs to be reform of the rules process and educating the kids about it.

Ok, maybe they should overlook giving kids some free dinners and some stuff like that.

But over looking the whole Title 9 implications......

You are getting a FREE RIDE for a UNIVERSITY EDUCATION. If you decide to take a crap degree and mess around, that's on you. I hear all this "kids, kids, kids" crap. None of us non-ahtletes were called that at 18. We were adults. You should be able to figure out that only A SMALL PERCENTAGE of players go to the NFL after college.
USA Today did an article about this , they studied all the things they get, like coaching, access to physical therapy, great, full medical care, all the benefits put together and it was over 100K per year or something like that.

it's actually 120,000K for a basketball player.

USA TODAY analysis finds $120K value in men's basketball scholarship - USATODAY.com

At Butler University a private school in the Football Championship Subdivision tuition, room, board and fees are $42,278 for 2010-11, according to the school's website.
"Forty thousand dollars-plus a year to play, that's a pretty good salary for an 18-year-old that has no college education, if you think about it that way," Howard said.
But more than scholarships, players receive benefits including: elite coaching; academic counseling; strength and conditioning consulting; media relations assistance; medical insurance and treatment; free game tickets; and future earnings power that comes with some college education.
There also are incalculable perks not included in USA TODAY's $120,000 figure, most notably the regional and national exposure players receive that typical students don't get.



Grants-in-aid: These don't include the full cost of attendance. Some of that full cost can be covered by the NCAA Assistance Fund, which allows additional cash to athletes for, among other items, some books, required clothing and travel to and from home on breaks.

Coaching: One way to determine the value to each athlete of top-flight coaching is to allocate one-fifteenth of a coach's salary to each player on his roster. But a coach making $200,000 a year might be as effective for some players as a star coach who can leverage the market to make $2 million or $3 million a season.
As Butler's Howard asks: "What is the value of someone's coaching (to someone who) never plays again? It's probably zero. But to someone who is getting better, then gets paid to play, I can see where that value is a lot more."
Most years, 60 players worldwide are drafted by the NBA, and another 200 or so college players might move on to minor leagues or non-U.S. teams. The pool of players who bounce a ball for a living after college is limited.
USA TODAY's formula, then, used the price of private, basketball training facilities that some college players attend to prepare for the NBA and that some NBA players use to polish their skills.
Three elite centers placed the cost of one year of full-time basketball and conditioning training at $60,000-$80,000.



General administrative support, equipment, uniforms, marketing and promotion: These categories provide athletes with a range of $7,000 to $15,000 of value a year.
Players go through as many as six pairs of sneakers a season. Almost all players take advantage of dedicated academic counselors, to whom non-athletes don't have access. There are sports media relations staffers and the publicity content they produce.


Medical and insurance premiums: The dollar amount of this is surprisingly small; hundreds of dollars in most institutions, up to $1,200 in others. But the value is huge.
Missouri forward Justin Safford tore a knee ligament last year, requiring surgery. His says his medical bills, including rehab, were covered by the university. A typical Mizzou student wouldn't get such care.
"I was rehabbing seven days a week, sometimes twice a day," Safford says. "I didn't have to go to a physical therapist. I was with our trainer every single day."
Lawyer Kessler scoffs at this. "(Colleges) keep (players) healthy while they're on the team," he says. "It's just to keep them playing."

Game tickets: By NCAA rules, each player can have up to four complimentary admissions for each of his team's regular-season games, home and away. Not all players use all their tickets. But at popular programs, this can amount to more than $2,000 in value. And that's before conference and NCAA tournament play, when the admissions allotment grows to six a player.

Future earnings: U.S. Census data show that workers with "some college" earn $6,500 a year more than workers with a high school diploma only.



Exposure: This isn't included in the $120,000 figure. It's too difficult to quantify the value of exposure that players receive via television, radio, print and the Internet and by being personalities in their respective markets.
Matt Balvanz, director of analytics for Chicago-based Navigate Marketing, says men's basketball players at top-100 programs from an average member of an eight-man playing rotation to a standout on a high-profile team can receive exposure value from $150,000 to $630,000 a season. He based those figures on the values that sponsors receive for the impressions their names or logos garner during a televised game and secondary exposure through highlights, etc.
Former Pittsburgh and all-Big East forward Jason Matthews, who played from 1987 to 1991, is a case in point. A Los Angeles native, he figures his exposure as a collegian helped pave the way for his career as CEO of a real estate investment and consulting firm that's based in Pittsburgh.
Matthews figures he played 120 games during his college career, with each contest lasting two hours, and his name and face on display throughout.
"How much does it cost Procter & Gamble to buy an ad on ESPN?" he says. "That's how I always looked at it, the value of the TV exposure to me."
Old Dominion senior forward Keyon Carter sees personal exposure to local business leaders as a networking perk. Potential employers attend ODU games.
"I try to make myself available for them, to kind of get to know them and them to know me, because those are the people that are hiring," he says. "The general student body, they don't get to shake hands and rub elbows with some of the people that I get to."



========================================


but you'll get a barrage of people who've been classically conditioned by espn to feel sorry for the athlete.
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Old 08-18-2011, 11:54 AM
 
Location: The "Rock"
2,551 posts, read 2,414,215 times
Reputation: 1322
Quote:
Originally Posted by Badger View Post
USA Today did an article about this , they studied all the things they get, like coaching, access to physical therapy, great, full medical care, all the benefits put together and it was over 100K per year or something like that.

it's actually 120,000K for a basketball player.

USA TODAY analysis finds $120K value in men's basketball scholarship - USATODAY.com

At Butler University — a private school in the Football Championship Subdivision — tuition, room, board and fees are $42,278 for 2010-11, according to the school's website.
"Forty thousand dollars-plus a year to play, that's a pretty good salary for an 18-year-old that has no college education, if you think about it that way," Howard said.
But more than scholarships, players receive benefits including: elite coaching; academic counseling; strength and conditioning consulting; media relations assistance; medical insurance and treatment; free game tickets; and future earnings power that comes with some college education.
There also are incalculable perks not included in USA TODAY's $120,000 figure, most notably the regional and national exposure players receive that typical students don't get.



Grants-in-aid: These don't include the full cost of attendance. Some of that full cost can be covered by the NCAA Assistance Fund, which allows additional cash to athletes for, among other items, some books, required clothing and travel to and from home on breaks.

Coaching: One way to determine the value to each athlete of top-flight coaching is to allocate one-fifteenth of a coach's salary to each player on his roster. But a coach making $200,000 a year might be as effective for some players as a star coach who can leverage the market to make $2 million or $3 million a season.
As Butler's Howard asks: "What is the value of someone's coaching (to someone who) never plays again? It's probably zero. But to someone who is getting better, then gets paid to play, I can see where that value is a lot more."
Most years, 60 players worldwide are drafted by the NBA, and another 200 or so college players might move on to minor leagues or non-U.S. teams. The pool of players who bounce a ball for a living after college is limited.
USA TODAY's formula, then, used the price of private, basketball training facilities that some college players attend to prepare for the NBA and that some NBA players use to polish their skills.
Three elite centers placed the cost of one year of full-time basketball and conditioning training at $60,000-$80,000.



General administrative support, equipment, uniforms, marketing and promotion: These categories provide athletes with a range of $7,000 to $15,000 of value a year.
Players go through as many as six pairs of sneakers a season. Almost all players take advantage of dedicated academic counselors, to whom non-athletes don't have access. There are sports media relations staffers and the publicity content they produce.


Medical and insurance premiums: The dollar amount of this is surprisingly small; hundreds of dollars in most institutions, up to $1,200 in others. But the value is huge.
Missouri forward Justin Safford tore a knee ligament last year, requiring surgery. His says his medical bills, including rehab, were covered by the university. A typical Mizzou student wouldn't get such care.
"I was rehabbing seven days a week, sometimes twice a day," Safford says. "I didn't have to go to a physical therapist. I was with our trainer every single day."
Lawyer Kessler scoffs at this. "(Colleges) keep (players) healthy while they're on the team," he says. "It's just to keep them playing."

Game tickets: By NCAA rules, each player can have up to four complimentary admissions for each of his team's regular-season games, home and away. Not all players use all their tickets. But at popular programs, this can amount to more than $2,000 in value. And that's before conference and NCAA tournament play, when the admissions allotment grows to six a player.

Future earnings: U.S. Census data show that workers with "some college" earn $6,500 a year more than workers with a high school diploma only.



Exposure: This isn't included in the $120,000 figure. It's too difficult to quantify the value of exposure that players receive via television, radio, print and the Internet and by being personalities in their respective markets.
Matt Balvanz, director of analytics for Chicago-based Navigate Marketing, says men's basketball players at top-100 programs — from an average member of an eight-man playing rotation to a standout on a high-profile team — can receive exposure value from $150,000 to $630,000 a season. He based those figures on the values that sponsors receive for the impressions their names or logos garner during a televised game and secondary exposure through highlights, etc.
Former Pittsburgh and all-Big East forward Jason Matthews, who played from 1987 to 1991, is a case in point. A Los Angeles native, he figures his exposure as a collegian helped pave the way for his career as CEO of a real estate investment and consulting firm that's based in Pittsburgh.
Matthews figures he played 120 games during his college career, with each contest lasting two hours, and his name and face on display throughout.
"How much does it cost Procter & Gamble to buy an ad on ESPN?" he says. "That's how I always looked at it, the value of the TV exposure to me."
Old Dominion senior forward Keyon Carter sees personal exposure to local business leaders as a networking perk. Potential employers attend ODU games.
"I try to make myself available for them, to kind of get to know them and them to know me, because those are the people that are hiring," he says. "The general student body, they don't get to shake hands and rub elbows with some of the people that I get to."



========================================


but you'll get a barrage of people who've been classically conditioned by espn to feel sorry for the athlete.
No one feels sorry for athletes... The point is that uiversities make far more than 120K per athlete. More like a Million. Where are the perks for that other 900K?

And how about you make a company a million dollars and they give you 120K in perks instead of a salary and see you like it?

Last edited by Mr. GE; 08-18-2011 at 12:07 PM..
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Old 08-18-2011, 11:57 AM
 
51,950 posts, read 41,806,773 times
Reputation: 32412
I honestly don't care what happens to OSU or Miami etc.

It's pretty ironic to see people get all worked up over how "their school" does in football or basketball while working at starbucks and hoping to land fulltime work soon.

It's also VERY clear that you should cheat in college sports since it doesn't really matter if the NCAA "takes away" your 2002 bowl trophy years after the fact blah blah blah. You still got all the money, the TV time and whatnot....and the NCAA hits like a girl. Boosters and Athletic Directors for a struggling program hit like a MACK TRUCK. So many decent, honest coaches are shuffled off to some small school while the scummy coaches are making 7-figs bouncing around programs.

Meanwhile a pack of idiots brag about their schools ability to pay out of state thugs to come run a little ball around and beat up on another schools groups of out of state thugs. I mean who wouldn't take great pride in the fact that your school can cheat better than another school?
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Old 08-18-2011, 12:09 PM
 
Location: Fishers, IN
6,495 posts, read 10,802,779 times
Reputation: 4060
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. GE View Post
No one feels sorry for athletes... The point is that uiversities make far more than 120K per athlete. More like a Million. Where are the perks for that other 900K?

And how about you make a company a million dollars and they give you 120K in perks instead of a salary and see you like it?
Simply not true. There are several Division I-A programs that are flush with cash, but most lose money. And much of the cash that does come into these programs is used to fund non-money-making sports like golf and tennis, which the NCAA requires the schools to offer.
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Old 08-18-2011, 12:14 PM
 
Location: The "Rock"
2,551 posts, read 2,414,215 times
Reputation: 1322
Quote:
Originally Posted by grmasterb View Post
Simply not true. There are several Division I-A programs that are flush with cash, but most lose money. And much of the cash that does come into these programs is used to fund non-money-making sports like golf and tennis, which the NCAA requires the schools to offer.

dont be so short sited.

We are not talking every single school... only the big boys. No football program in the SEC is losing money, i posted the profits of each of them last year. do i need to do that again?
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Old 08-18-2011, 12:31 PM
 
1,261 posts, read 1,771,156 times
Reputation: 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I honestly don't care what happens to OSU or Miami etc.

It's pretty ironic to see people get all worked up over how "their school" does in football or basketball while working at starbucks and hoping to land fulltime work soon.

It's also VERY clear that you should cheat in college sports since it doesn't really matter if the NCAA "takes away" your 2002 bowl trophy years after the fact blah blah blah. You still got all the money, the TV time and whatnot....and the NCAA hits like a girl. Boosters and Athletic Directors for a struggling program hit like a MACK TRUCK. So many decent, honest coaches are shuffled off to some small school while the scummy coaches are making 7-figs bouncing around programs.

Meanwhile a pack of idiots brag about their schools ability to pay out of state thugs to come run a little ball around and beat up on another schools groups of out of state thugs. I mean who wouldn't take great pride in the fact that your school can cheat better than another school?
In a more pessimistic, negative way. That does sum up certain aspects of college football/basketball.

Although we should be careful about the whole "thug" mentality. Not everyone in the general admissions population is a choir boy either you know, it's just that the football players get more publicity when they screw up.
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Old 08-18-2011, 01:46 PM
 
5,507 posts, read 9,276,458 times
Reputation: 2289
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncopus99 View Post
Pot calling the kettle black huh... UF had 31 arrests during Meyer's stay i.e. UF's recent golden age. Chris Rainey threatens to kill his ex-girlfriend after stalking her (remember this guy rape a girl in high school). No problem, we will play him right away and keep him on the team. Muschamp has already dealt with Janoris Jenkins (star cornerback) arrest for marijuana possession under his short time there. Jenkins is a second time offense since he had a misdemeanor affray and resisting arrest back in 2009. Thugs galore over in Gainesville. Let's see if Muschamp fixes the issue with the Thugs; dismissing Jenkins is one step in the right direction...
Not really. Arrest happen at every school and it's nothing as serious as what Miami has done. They program PROMOTES the thug culture and is proud of it. Just watch the 30 for 30 documentary.
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Old 08-18-2011, 01:48 PM
 
5,507 posts, read 9,276,458 times
Reputation: 2289
Quote:
Originally Posted by grmasterb View Post
I don't want to see the death penalty assessed on The U. However, as an unapologetic Ohio State fan, I hope this shuts up the few knucklehead Miami fans who've complained that the Buckeyes should have to vacate the 2002 national championship over the current issues in the Ohio State program (as well as the incorrect assertion that Clarett was ineligible).
You still have to hear that? Most of the bandwagon Miami fans are gone these days now that they don't win. I would have guessed it's hard to find a Miami football fan these days.
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Old 08-18-2011, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Apple Valley Calif
7,475 posts, read 20,209,558 times
Reputation: 5614
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. GE View Post
No one feels sorry for athletes... The point is that uiversities make far more than 120K per athlete. More like a Million. Where are the perks for that other 900K?

And how about you make a company a million dollars and they give you 120K in perks instead of a salary and see you like it?
Not to mention the fact it's really difficult to eat a scholarship. The free ride is great, but they have no spending money. It easy to temp these people because they have zero in their pockets, and the change to get a new car and a paycheck is hard to resist.
When an athlete graduates, he is about 22, which means he or she is an immature child with no concept of real life.
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